Is marriage worth it?

[blessedrosary]

I don't mean to sound pessimistic, but there are SO many factors that go into whether two people end up being happy together or not, factors that sometimes are impossible to know apriori.

OR is there an algorithmic way to determine that this person will be worth it in the long run? If there's not, it seems like marriage is a ****-shoot: some people get lucky and are very satisfied and some people are not.

If all (I don't mean to make this sound little) a happy marriage requires is 100% self-sacrifice for the other person, then why aren't more marriages healthy? Or is selfishness (and related problems) the only cause of distress in marriage?

[EasterJoy]

How to answer that. Hmmm. I remember one old guy saying that the key to the success of his 60 year marriage was that he said he got up every morning, looked in the mirror, and told himself: Well, you're no prize, either.

It is a little like farming....there is luck involved, but it is more hard work than luck. I think all vocations are like that: you can become a priest and land in a diocese with some very taxing conditions, conditions that didn't exist before you were ordained.

Those with a vocation for their state in life wouldn't trade the hardships because they're in love with those things that only their state in life has to offer....and to a certain extent, I do mean the things that the state in life has to offer, because you can be married, be widowed, and feel a need to marry again without knowing exactly who you'll marry, while you can be passionately in love with and willing to sacrifice mightily for people in general while really being better-suited to the religious life, where there is a community to help you along but there isn't that one person distracting your attention from God.

There is some distress in marriage because people lacked good models growing up, because of more-or-less accidental problems like a member in the family--could be a spouse or a child or yourself--with very taxing special needs, because you have responsibilities that the economy or society or whatever make very difficult to meet, and so on....I think you get the idea. Part of it is that some are ill-suited to marriage and part is because some married couples are ill-suited to the particular trials that life sends their way.

You don't go looking for your vocations in life by asking: What will make me happy? You go looking by asking: What will please God? Would getting married or joining a convent or monastery or staying single or whatever make that more possible? So, as Matthew Kelly put it, if you want to reach the right answer, start with the right questions. I think you might find his books very helpful.

[underacloud]

Originally Posted by EasterJoy

How to answer that. Hmmm. I remember one old guy saying that the key to the success of his 60 year marriage was that he said he got up every morning, looked in the mirror, and told himself: Well, you're no prize, either.

At first look, this is quite funny. On second look, there's a great depth to the emotion and humility here...many years of wisdom condensed to a very helpful outlook.

[horselvr]

Strive4humility:

I apologize. You are right and shame on me. As I was writing about the abused women and children the abused men actually popped into my head and I dismissed that thought and only spoke of abused women.

Shame on me especially because my brother, a retired Air Force Vet, was terribly abused by his wife of 32 yrs which I witnessed. She was an abusive and violent alcoholic and when he was trying to seek help for her she came unhinged punched him in the face and actually knocked him down right in front of me. I was unaware that he had been living like this for years as they moved around alot with the Air Force.

He was a slight built man, and not in the best of health. He was also working 2 jobs to support her habit as an enabler just to keep some peace in the houshold.

He died a few years ago and I miss him terribly.

Again I apologize for not considering the abused men.

[Strive4humility]

It's nice of you to apologize, but really, there's no need. I'm so sorry for what happened to your brother and will pray for both of you. Abuse is not really a societal problem, I believe. I think it's a function of humanity-too many injured people who "double down" on their problems by refusing to take accountability. Thanks for the kind words.

[robwar]

Originally Posted by underacloud

At first look, this is quite funny. On second look, there's a great depth to the emotion and humility here...many years of wisdom condensed to a very helpful outlook.

that's the rub isn't it? If more people would focus on trying to develop and be the right spouse instead of just looking for the right spouse, they might make better choices and or attrack the right life long spouse. I am speaking to those who are not married and looking or thinking about it. Developing patient, forgiveness, flexibility, kindness, self-giving should be the aim of those who think that they are called to be married and most are. if the OP would think about what would make him (or her) an ideal marriage partner, that puts a whole different view of it and changes the dynamics here. Also, praying. If you think that God is calling you to be married, why don't you start now a spend some time, especially in adoration and pray the God would lead to to the right person as well as for your future spouse. If you focus now on developing your own character as well, you will really go along way later on. Look for someone you genuinely admire and respect.

[Gods_Peace]

Good Marriage- GOD Is involved in the complete process of unity, and the Man vows to lead the household and provide a moral example to the Children. The Woman becomes united to the man, and also follows the Man in leading the household, and provides a moral example to the Children. The Children submit themselves to their parents and honor their rulings, provided they follow the above guidelines.

Bad Marriage- Any marriage where God is not found, for example;
-Where Contraceptives, or any birth control method is being used
-Where one or more of the parents supports abortion, euthanasia, or any other immoral practices now being instituted in society through the practice of false labeling, (magic, etc.)
-Where their is lack of belief in a creator, which leads to no order, because why does a godless family need order?
- Where their is no love, only a poor supply of created resources to fuel their hearts and its desires in vain

[Petersmate]

I was married for 18 years and it wasn't my decision to end it and I still think that marriage is the best thing ever.

this video sums it up listen to what is said @ 10.58.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1OkLNOCUfLY

In case you miss it she says " Marriage! like everything good and important isn't easy"

[daisybee]

It's worth it for us to embrace whatever vocation we are called to. And I think we need to expect that the Cross will be waiting for us no matter what path we take, and sometimes it will be very heavy.

I know two wives who have serious illnesses, which presents logistical and financial challenges to their families. But their husbands' fidelity and compassion is a strong witness to what love really is. So in these cases, I suppose you could say that the "statistics" were against them...but when you consider how bravely the husbands are carrying their crosses, there's no doubt that they are exactly where they are supposed to be in life.

Crosses are a possibility not just in marriage though--they're definitely abundant in other states in life too.

From Sr. Josefa Menendez:
(Jesus) "Josefa, do you not know that I and the Cross are inseparable? If you meet Me, you meet the Cross, and when you find the Cross, it is I whom you have found. Whoever loves Me loves the Cross, and whoever loves the Cross loves Me."

From what I've seen among friends and family, one major factor is that people enter marriage without a lot of deliberate, thorough discernment, which causes a lot of problems later. Some people seem to place too much emphasis on feelings of attraction for another person.

[dedo]

We celebrated our 25th anniversary this past year.

I think that a key ingredient is to have God in your lives individually, and together.

Thus, even though my wife is Protestant, and we belong to different churches, I try and make sure we worship together at least weekly even if it means just watching a service on t.v. together (in addition to our individual services).

[Mystophilus]

When it's good, it's great; when it's bad, it's awful.

One thing which I would add to your schema, however, is that a good marriage requires not just 100% self-sacrifice for the other person, but 100% self-sacrifice for each other. Without that synergistic effect, the result is most likely to be dependency on one side, and burnout on the other.

[robwar]

Originally Posted by blessedrosary

I don't mean to sound pessimistic, but there are SO many factors that go into whether two people end up being happy together or not, factors that sometimes are impossible to know apriori.

OR is there an algorithmic way to determine that this person will be worth it in the long run? If there's not, it seems like marriage is a ****-shoot: some people get lucky and are very satisfied and some people are not.

If all (I don't mean to make this sound little) a happy marriage requires is 100% self-sacrifice for the other person, then why aren't more marriages healthy? Or is selfishness (and related problems) the only cause of distress in marriage?

I am not sure what your experience is and whether you have come from a broken home which might have given you a pessimistic view. The biggest factor is that marriage is a sacrament and those who enter it should do so because that is God's calling on them. Marriage is more than 2 people ending up being "happy ever after". Second you should marry someone who is going to share your faith in God and desire to practice your faith to the same level as yourself. If you are looking at others and think that some are happy because they just got lucky and some not, you are sadly misreading what you think you see. Many people end up in poor marriages because they did not base their decision on God and they made poor choices to begin with. Good and lasting marriages do start with good preparation before hand and a careful look at the person and their core values and be willing not to marry when there are red flags. Also good marriages start out with good morality which mean you WAIT to have sex till marriage. One of the biggest hinderances to lasting happy marriage is living together before hand. study after study after study has proven this to be true. Likewise the Catholic churches teaching on following NFP instead of artificial contraception will definitely lead to a lasting relationship. There is nearly zero divorce on any married couple that follows NFP. Look at the recent news of the "Tom and Kate" divorce. 1st of all, she lives with him, a man with 2 previous divorces and much older than her, they have a baby together then decide to get married. They do not share the same faith. They live chaotic lives and often a part and then with a 6 year in tow, they are getting divorced. They weren't "unlucky", they made a series of choices and actions that will doom any marriage no matter who they are. Good marriages start with God and following His plan for it. I hope you rethink your views on marriage.

[PrayHarder]

Originally Posted by blessedrosary

I don't mean to sound pessimistic, but there are SO many factors that go into whether two people end up being happy together or not, factors that sometimes are impossible to know apriori.

OR is there an algorithmic way to determine that this person will be worth it in the long run? If there's not, it seems like marriage is a ****-shoot: some people get lucky and are very satisfied and some people are not.

Welcome fellow engineer (I'm assuming that based on your diction). While there isn't a 100% certain algorithm to a happy marriage, there are ways to increase the odds. The happiest marriage include a good mix of faith, flexibility, and humor. The marriages that I've seen fail always seem to be missing at least one of those pillars.

But there is an intangible attribute as well. You just know that a certain person was made for you and you were made for her. It's different than being "in love" with someone. I just can't explain it as it is something you will just need to experience.

[Strive4humility]

I agree with the above posts as to what is needed for a lasting, fulfilling marriage which serves God and mankind. However, mental illness undetected before marriage is a devastating problem. With all of the secularism surrounding us today, divorce still seemed as though it was not an option-Jesus endured much more than daily physical, verbal and emotional abuse. One's stamina is derived only from His example, and continued unconditional love and support flows when that holiest of examples is followed. However, when your children begin to suffer from the same types of abuse, and when you see their hearts and minds being misshapen by the endurance of such abuse, the questions begin to take shape for real. I promised the Lord that I would protect the children He so lovingly gave us. Now I see that this type of abuse has gone on in my spouse's family for generations, only to be hidden from "outsiders" like me, and explained away with the narcissism that only mental illness can provide. There are known disorders, well-studied by the medical and psychiatric communities, wherein the disordered individual is masterful at hiding all evidence until the lifetime commitment is made. Then, the abuse is unleashed. Until we had children, I dutifully took the abuse that was given, because I saw it as service to the Lord and the commitment I made to His sacrament. Then, my children were not only unhappy, but very unhealthy due to this abuse. There's no "slam-dunk" answer. Every time I felt closer to a decision, it was always a "51-49" swing in my thought process. In other words, there was no good answer, only degrees of badness. How do you answer this question-enable the abuse of your children and show them that accepting such abuse from your spouse is necessary, or leave the marriage, break God's union, commit the unthinkable with a divorce and annulment? I'm interested to hear all responses, no matter how angry with me they may be-I divorced my spouse in order to remove my children from such an awful environment as much and as often is possible. I must make my Penance to the Lord, this I know, but the abuse of my children was something I felt compelled to protect them from.

[robwar]

Originally Posted by Strive4humility

I agree with the above posts as to what is needed for a lasting, fulfilling marriage which serves God and mankind. However, mental illness undetected before marriage is a devastating problem. With all of the secularism surrounding us today, divorce still seemed as though it was not an option-Jesus endured much more than daily physical, verbal and emotional abuse. One's stamina is derived only from His example, and continued unconditional love and support flows when that holiest of examples is followed. However, when your children begin to suffer from the same types of abuse, and when you see their hearts and minds being misshapen by the endurance of such abuse, the questions begin to take shape for real. I promised the Lord that I would protect the children He so lovingly gave us. Now I see that this type of abuse has gone on in my spouse's family for generations, only to be hidden from "outsiders" like me, and explained away with the narcissism that only mental illness can provide. There are known disorders, well-studied by the medical and psychiatric communities, wherein the disordered individual is masterful at hiding all evidence until the lifetime commitment is made. Then, the abuse is unleashed. Until we had children, I dutifully took the abuse that was given, because I saw it as service to the Lord and the commitment I made to His sacrament. Then, my children were not only unhappy, but very unhealthy due to this abuse. There's no "slam-dunk" answer. Every time I felt closer to a decision, it was always a "51-49" swing in my thought process. In other words, there was no good answer, only degrees of badness. How do you answer this question-enable the abuse of your children and show them that accepting such abuse from your spouse is necessary, or leave the marriage, break God's union, commit the unthinkable with a divorce and annulment? I'm interested to hear all responses, no matter how angry with me they may be-I divorced my spouse in order to remove my children from such an awful environment as much and as often is possible. I must make my Penance to the Lord, this I know, but the abuse of my children was something I felt compelled to protect them from.

I am sorry about what happen to you and your children. May God continue to heal you and your children. You will be in my prayers and do seek out the annulment which does bring healing to those who have gone through it. Trying to find out as much as you can about one's future spouse and family would hopefully bring out any red flags. I am saying this not to make you feel bad to as a warning to those who aren't married and thinking of it.
God bless you.