Moral poverty cost blacks in New Orleans - Page 2

koda · #16 Oct 5, '05, 4:44 pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by geezerbob

The area has more people and cars than I really care to deal with and, when the housing boom shows signs of easing, I am considering selling out and moving to a lovely town of about 3,000 nestled at the foot of the blue ridge mountains. I've always had a liking for small towns and the mountains and that might be a good move. Kinda hard to do that, though, after having spent my entire life within ten miles of where I was born.

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I moved from Nashville to L.A. in 1993 with my husband who is from southern Indiana (Evansville) and is a cradle Catholic. He's a singer/musician and wanted to try his luck - he is now writing Catholic/Christian songs

I landed a pretty good job but about a year ago felt the Lord was calling me to teach, so I'm working on my masters in secondary ed - will be a history teacher. My mom moved to Riverside near here after my dad died in 1996. Speaking of traffic, you should see the mess out here. Every bad joke you've ever heard about L.A. traffic is true. We're pretty much ready to leave but must wait until I'm out of school. There are some lovely mountains near here. Thought of going back to Indiana but don't think I could take the heat/humidity or cold.

**brotherhrolf** · #17 Oct 5, '05, 6:57 pm

Well Koda, I wish you the best of luck. And I certainly hope that you take far more hours in history than you do in education type courses. My most humble and urgent piece of advice for you is that if you are going to teach history, remember that first and foremost it is a story. I have spent 27 years working for the state with undergrads in history and anthropology and a grad in anthropology. DW teaches English at a local state univ. A good friend of us both teaches History - including a course on Louisiana history entitled Teaching to the teachers - a grad level course in education.

Sheesh! Since the telecomm. tower at the univ. was knocked down by Katrina, they broadcast over Louisiana PB. Excuse my "french" but they had a "dam....yankee w/ a PhD open the session. Before he was finished I was throwing stuff at the TV. Blah, blah, blah. Blah, blah, blah, Blah,.....blah blah! And people wonder why history turns them off. Our friend came on and told the story. DW and old friend have been trying to get me to go for an MA in history (since so much of my anthro. degree involved historical archaeology). If I do it, I want to tell the story...........Historians should be story tellers. How much of human history has been told around a campfire?

Oh yeah, part two.....Traffic. You may have some idea about what happened to Baton Rouge. Half of metro NO moved here to stay with family and friends. Commute times in our city of 400,000 has more than doubled since BR is now the largest city in Louisiana at over a million people. It's almost nine and I need to go to bed so I can be up and meet my ride by 6:30. What used to be a 25 min drive to work is now 45 min to an hour. We're car pooling. Coming home is an hour to an hour and a half - all to go 20 miles.

Traditional Ang · #18 Oct 7, '05, 8:36 pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by brotherhrolf

Well Koda, I wish you the best of luck. And I certainly hope that you take far more hours in history than you do in education type courses. My most humble and urgent piece of advice for you is that if you are going to teach history, remember that first and foremost it is a story. I have spent 27 years working for the state with undergrads in history and anthropology and a grad in anthropology. DW teaches English at a local state univ. A good friend of us both teaches History - including a course on Louisiana history entitled Teaching to the teachers - a grad level course in education.

Sheesh! Since the telecomm. tower at the univ. was knocked down by Katrina, they broadcast over Louisiana PB. Excuse my "french" but they had a "dam....yankee w/ a PhD open the session. Before he was finished I was throwing stuff at the TV. Blah, blah, blah. Blah, blah, blah, Blah,.....blah blah! And people wonder why history turns them off. Our friend came on and told the story. DW and old friend have been trying to get me to go for an MA in history (since so much of my anthro. degree involved historical archaeology). If I do it, I want to tell the story...........Historians should be story tellers. How much of human history has been told around a campfire?

Oh yeah, part two.....Traffic. You may have some idea about what happened to Baton Rouge. Half of metro NO moved here to stay with family and friends. Commute times in our city of 400,000 has more than doubled since BR is now the largest city in Louisiana at over a million people. It's almost nine and I need to go to bed so I can be up and meet my ride by 6:30. What used to be a 25 min drive to work is now 45 min to an hour. We're car pooling. Coming home is an hour to an hour and a half - all to go 20 miles.

Brother Hrolf:

I would add - Koda should read as much in the original authors as he can stand, and learn their stories. I got largely bored by H.S history, but became interested when I started meeting people who had been involved in making the original history.

I also think Koda should be prepared to deal with the anti-Catholic, anti-Conservative indoctrination that he'll be subjected to in the classroom.

I'm sorry about the infernal Yankee on the TV set. I hope it wasn't damaged by the barrage!

I agree with your friends, I think you should go for and either teach evening classes and write a book on your favorite person or era.

I believe most Bible Scholars claim the stories in the O.T. were transmitted by people sitting around the campfire or sitting down to supper. I understand that, before writing became common, this was used to help people remember the details of different types of stories.

Sorry to hear about the traffic. I can empathize - We had a Triathalon here a couple of weeks ago. It took me almost an hour to go about 20 minutes (6 miles - LA normal) driving. Same thing happens in the evenings when I go to late prayers - It can take 45 min. to make the same trip.

I have to go. Good luck with the History courses.

In Christ, Michael

Lizzie · #19 Oct 7, '05, 9:20 pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by koda

And, sad to say, racism is alive and well.

Quite true! Jesse Jackson, Al Sharpton, and Mfume of the NAACP are preaching this tripe. These main stream media-appointed spokemen for the black community are only famous/infamous for promoting immoral family-degrading lincentiousness and racial prejudice.

BTW, my home town neighborhood was more intergrated before , repeat before intergration ignobles destroyed/block busted our neighborhood than after..

MommaKat · #20 Oct 8, '05, 7:00 am

Everyone is missing the elephant in the room. The war on poverty. The welfare system that pays women to have children without a husband. I work in a food store in Cleveland in the poor section of the city and I heard conversation that made me sad. Women who lived with their fathers would go get pregnant in order to receive more food stamps. These were white women. Most of the black in the area were struggling to get out of the slums. The hispanics had intacked families and came to the store together.
This is another example of why Pope John Paul II stated that Catholicism and Socialism are imcompatible.

smartblkchick · #21 Oct 23, '05, 12:59 pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by brotherhrolf

No, African American professionals stayed here. New Orleans is home to two historically black universities - Dillard and Southern University New Orleans.

Ahem....

New Orleans is home to THREE historically black colleges. You forgot about Xavier University of Louisiana--the only historically black CATHOLIC university in the world!

Signed,

smartblkchick, PhD.
Proud 1990 Graduate of Xavier University of Louisiana

As for the ridiculous premise of this thread...

I think it is shortsighted to attribute to situation in New Orleans to one cause. That there are significant average differences between the white and black populations in the city is indisputable. There is no question that racism still exists. The economic situation of poor blacks in New Orleans is due to a combination of factors including contemporary racism, historical racism, and moral bankruptcy. To focus on any one factor is an exercise in futility if we are to have a productive discussion of how to improve the lives of the people affected by Katrina.

**brotherhrolf** · #22 Oct 23, '05, 2:47 pm

Dear Dr. smartblkchick: Ouch! Mea culpa, mea culpa, mea maxima culpa! Where has my head been? I am only posting to correct my profound oversight. And, you are absolutely correct and in a far better place to defend our city than I. Hrolf

proudnifi · #23 Oct 23, '05, 9:29 pm

I love New Orleans, am a product of the areas, and hope it is rebuilt better than ever. However, I recognize it has serious issues and that's why I left and sought opportunities elsewhere. I'm not black. The lack of opportunities doesn't - or didn't - discriminate only by color. The issues were many and complex.

Racism (historical and contemporary) contributed to the situation. But I get frustrated when certain people (ex, Rev. Jesse Jackson, Rev. Al Sharpton) appear to attribute everything that went wrong to racism. Actually, I get frustrated and angry.

The "moral poverty" angle, assuming it is tied to lack of personal responsibility and basic ethical behavior, is valid, in my opinion. I think it's true of lots of people, not just blacks and not just in the New Orleans-area. Too many people think the world owes them something. I like reading that other people recognize this. If only we could get more people to develop programs that help develop moral wealth.

smartblkchick · #24 Oct 24, '05, 6:59 am

Quote:

Originally Posted by proudnifi

The "moral poverty" angle, assuming it is tied to lack of personal responsibility and basic ethical behavior, is valid, in my opinion. I think it's true of lots of people, not just blacks and not just in the New Orleans-area. Too many people think the world owes them something. I like reading that other people recognize this. If only we could get more people to develop programs that help develop moral wealth.

The problem with focusing solely on the "moral poverty" angle is that moral poverty was not created in a vacumn. Some things that are attributed to moral poverty evolved because of a lack of opportunity and institutionalized racism. For example: it is no surprise that crime rates go up when unemployment rates go up! To focus on one (moral poverty) and not the other (racism, poverty, inequality) quickly deteriorates into a "blame the victim" mentality. Once we blame the victims, we have a tendency to absolve ourselves of any responsibility for helping to create the conditions we criticize!

proudnifi · #25 Oct 24, '05, 7:33 am

I didn't suggest that anyone focus solely on the "moral poverty" angle; I don't think any of the posts here did. As I noted "The issues were many and complex" and "Racism (historical and contemporary) contributed to the situation."

And while I didn't offer a specific suggestion as to how to make things better, I don't think my suggestion of developing programs to create moral wealth lays blame on victims. It does put responsibility on everyone - to create and utilize opportunities, etc.

One last note, I didn't help create the situation. I considered staying there to work against the system, but decided it would be a losing battle with my family losing out. I left to protect my family's future.

smartblkchick · #26 Oct 24, '05, 8:16 am

Quote:

Originally Posted by proudnifi

One last note, I didn't help create the situation. I considered staying there to work against the system, but decided it would be a losing battle with my family losing out. I left to protect my family's future.

We all helped to create those conditions. We help to create them when we ignore unequal funding between urban and suburban school districts. We help to create them when we support politicians who propose regressive tax structures. We help to create them when we support to gutting of most income supports. We help to create them when we ignore the lack of quality medical care in poor communities. In short, we help to create those conditions when we do not demand that society as a whole bear some responsibility for helping those at the bottom.

proudnifi · #27 Oct 24, '05, 4:47 pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by smartblkchick

We all helped to create those conditions. We help to create them when we ignore unequal funding between urban and suburban school districts. We help to create them when we support politicians who propose regressive tax structures. We help to create them when we support to gutting of most income supports. We help to create them when we ignore the lack of quality medical care in poor communities. In short, we help to create those conditions when we do not demand that society as a whole bear some responsibility for helping those at the bottom.

Poor New Orleans was messed up long before I was born. My votes were steps in the correct direction; too bad there weren't enough like-minded people.

Clearly the same-old, same-old didn't work. The city has an amazing opportunity to make changes - I hope she takes it.