Name Benedict fulfillment of Malachy prophesy?

[UnworthySoul]

Originally Posted by 4 marks

I suppose that this edict should also apply to such things as the Shroud of Turin and the Apparitions/Secrets of Fatima?

I just heard Bill O'Reilly dis some Catholic callers because they dared to say that the Church teaches that using artificial birth control and homosexual acts are sins, and that Catholics who do these should not receive comminion.

Thank God we now have a Pope that won't long put up with such nonsense, relativist spin and confusion. I sure hope Mr. O'Reilly goes to confession regarding the "tool" incident before he takes communion.

I personally believe in the Shroud of Turin and Fatima even though they are not required as articles of faith. I do not let them be the sole arbiters of my faith however. Besides, neither the Shroud of Turin nor Fatima purport to tell when the end of the world will be. That is something Christ Himself told us we will not know until it is upon us.

[Stevereeno]

Originally Posted by K C

Anyone who claims to know the exact day when Christ will return should be ignored, since Our Lord told us that "only the Father" knows this.

Be careful of how you privately interpret that passage of Scripture. I do not know exactly what Christ meant by it, but, certainly you cannot deny that the Son and the Holy Spirit also know the day and the hour. To do so would be heresy.

[Gottle of Geer]

Originally Posted by MamaGeek

The Benedictines are known as Olivetans, are they not?

## Other way round - the Olivetan Congregation is one branch of the Benedictine family. ##

[K C]

Originally Posted by MadMan

Maybe I'm missing something, but John Paul II was the 100th pope since Malachy, not 110th.

I thought the claim that John Paul I and John Paul II fit the prophecies for the 109th and 110th popes "to a tee" demonstrated an incredible lack of cranial activity. You could think of reasons for anybody to fit such sloppy and meaningless descriptions.

God Bless Benedict XVI!!!

John Paul II pray for us

Because there have been times in Church history when man, being the fallen creature he is, caused confusion by electing more than one pope at a time, the prophecies also include a number of duplicate or "antipope"s. A careful comparison of your list source to the prophecies will reveal those in question. These inclusions only serve to show the extent to which the prophecies reflect in detail actual history.

Regarding your remark about "lack of cranial activity"- Those who cannot logically dispute another's views often resort to ad hominem attacks. However, this tactic falls beneath the expected standards of any Catholic forum, which demand charity towards others above all else. As for your final statement, please explain how, in 1973 (or perhaps earlier?) it was said, in reference to the current pope, that he would be in some way associated with St. Benedict? I do not consider this prediction to be "sloppy" or "meaningless" in the least!

[TPJCatholic]

Madman,


Go here: http://www.catholic-pages.com/grabbag/malachy.asp

[UnworthySoul]

Originally Posted by K C

Why would God allow one of his saints to be so defamed by forgery for so long? But, finally, the fact that the prophecies ACCURATELY align with actual descriptions of all the popes until this time is the strongest reason of all for us to take them into serious consideration...if not for our outright acceptance.

Two things strike me here. You ask why God would allow one of his saints to be so defamed by forgery. A fair question, and I could answer that there really is no proof that Malachy even wrote them. But the truth is, does it matter if he did or didn't? No, because at the heart of your statement you say that God would not allow one of his saints to be in error. Why then, would God contradict Himself by saying in the Gospel that only He knows when it will happen only to tell an Irish priest a little later?

As far as the accuracy, take the reference to "flowers" in the prophecy regarding Paul IV. "Flos florum" or "flower of flowers". Yes, Paul IV had a fleur de lis on his coat of arms, but look at how many others had flowers on their coats of arms.

I'm not saying they are right or wrong, but I won't outright say the prophecies are true. Especially since the link with Pope Benedict and his respective "prophecy" is such a stretch.

To go from Malachy's "Olive" to Olivetan is just word association and to go from the Olivetan congregation to "Benedectine" in general is more word association and then to associate Benedict XVI with "Benedictine monks"--that's four really stretched leaps by mere word association in a row.

I don't know, if you try hard enough, you can associate or find links to anything.

[Makerteacher]

I do not know if the prophecies are true or not. If we are in the "end times", so be it! If not, so be that too!

We are called to live lives changed by and devoted to Christ, and to be witnesses to others of the tremendous love of God for His people. We are called to be salt and light to the world, and really does it matter if that world is the "civilized" one we live in now, or a broken world during a massive Third World War?

Be not afraid.

[dorothydagmar]

Originally Posted by UnworthySoul

Simply put, no. St. Benedict believed that in accordance with Malachy's prophecy, it would be a member of the Benedictine Order. Ratzinger is NOT a Benedictine. The choice of names is not all that unusual, after, there were 15 Benedicts before him. Further, "Benedict" does not mean "olive" in any way, shape or form. Granted, the Benedictines are known as Olivetians, but again, Ratzinger is not (from what I've read) a Benedictine.

As an aside, there is contention (and not undue, at that) that the "Glory of the Olive" was the last in the list Malachy wrote. It is believed by some that the next one in the list, that of "Peter the Roman" was added long after Malachy passed away.

Keep in mind that Christ Himself tells us that no one except the Father knows the day and hour when the end will come.

But you know what? Aside from all that, the last thing we need to do as Catholics is focus on a prophecy that may or may not be true. Christ is to be our focus, and if, in the end the prophecy is true indeed, then by focusing on CHrist we should hopefully be ready to meet our Judge.

God Bless Pope Benedict XVI!

Thank you so much for saying that. I went to the link and read this persons theology. In many ways he is contradiction with The Holy See (office of). Heed Pope John Paul II and "Be not afraid!" God will guide you when that time comes.

I am however a little concerned that this website was posted by a K of C.

[K C]

Originally Posted by Stevereeno

Be careful of how you privately interpret that passage of Scripture. I do not know exactly what Christ meant by it, but, certainly you cannot deny that the Son and the Holy Spirit also know the day and the hour. To do so would be heresy.

Christ was admonishing his apostles not to worry about "the day or the hour" of His return. (In fact, it is evident from the Gospels that they believed that Christ's kingdom would be established on earth within their own lifetimes!) God wants us to focus on our individual obligations rather than any specific "day or hour" of reckoning because, for most of us, that reckoning will come much sooner than the "end of the world" as we know it. However, Christ did not command that we not even "estimate" the approach of the "end times". In fact, He told us to watch for the "signs of the times".

No one has implied that Christ, as the Second Person of the Trinity, knows any less than the other two Persons. His exact meaning in saying "only the Father" knows is yet another mystery beyond human reason. (Perhaps He was deferring to the Father out of His profound humility.) Even the apostles often misunderstood His full meaning, so we are in good company in our ignorance!

I think that God knows it is in our human nature to wonder about the future, so He allows us small glimpses (prophecies) into it. However, this is not to instill FEAR of the future, but to REASSURE us that He will, indeed, return for us. As Christians - as Catholics - how can we recoil from such glimpses when they offer us the consolation that Our King will soon reign in triumph? And..still...we "know not the day nor the hour".

[Stevereeno]

Originally Posted by UnworthySoul

Why then, would God contradict Himself by saying in the Gospel that only He knows when it will happen only to tell an Irish priest a little later?

Again, I don't understand how one can attempt to interpret Christ's statement regarding the "day or hour". We are not allowed to hold that Christ was without any particular knowledge, whatsoever - this is Dogma (C. of Nicea, perhaps). Given that, Christ states:

"But of that day or hour, no one knows, neither the angels in heaven, nor the Son, but only the Father."

Any attempt to interpret this passage seems to lead one to heresy. However, Christ only reserves knowledge of the "day" and the "hour", not knowledge of the Pope.

[K C]

Originally Posted by dorothydagmar

Thank you so much for saying that. I went to the link and read this persons theology. In many ways he is contradiction with The Holy See (office of). Heed Pope John Paul II and "Be not afraid!" God will guide you when that time comes.

I am however a little concerned that this website was posted by a K of C.

I think it important to point out that we are referring to TWO sources in this discussion. The remarks about the WEBSITE and its author, it should be noted, are separate from any considerations about the prophecies of St. Malachy. One may find fault with the website and/or its author. However the prophecies of the saint are centuries old and any discussion of THEM must be carefully disassociated from any current speculations or opinions which are not directly related to or stated within Malachy's writings.

[DustinsDad]

Originally Posted by UnworthySoul

But you know what? Aside from all that, the last thing we need to do as Catholics is focus on a prophecy that may or may not be true. Christ is to be our focus, and if, in the end the prophecy is true indeed, then by focusing on CHrist we should hopefully be ready to meet our Judge

Amen to that brother!

Long live Pope Benidict XVI!

-DustinsDad-

[Dph]

While I agree with Christs words that only the father knows Christ gave us prophecies for a reason in the BIBLE itself. They have for the 50 or 60 being revealed by the handful each decade. I believe in Malachy's prophecies. He gave no dates of the worlds end but SIGNS.

[K C]

Another point to consider: This thread is not so much concerned with knowing "the day" nor "the hour" of Christ's return as it is with the succession of popes as prophesied by St. Malachy. Based upon his brief allusions to each pope, it has been speculated for some time that the present pope might be connected, in some way, to St. Benedict or his order.

The fact that the prophecies mention only ONE pope to be elected after the present one, naturally, inspires some anxiety about the possible approach of the "end". However, if the prophecies were true revelations to St. Malachy, we must remember that he was predicting 112 popes yet to come. Therefore, his intention was not to predict "the end", but to assure Christians a steady stream of successors until the end. Even if there remains only one papacy before the "end", there is no way to predict just how LONG these remaining popes will reign. Furthermore, no one can say whether or not God may intervene and will that there be more than just two more. Even the accuracy of the predictions is still in question. Therefore, the prophecies remain nothing more than a means by which God reminds us, yet again, to be always prepared.

We cannot discern the "day" nor the "hour", but we can be certain that, whether soon or later, the end will come. Those who cannot accept this inevitability are likely to revile the prophecies. Yet Christ assures us that the end WILL come. WHEN does not really matter. All that matters is that we be prepared for OUR end. BUT...following the course of history with an eye on St. Malachy's prophecies certainly awakens us to the approaching, climatic drama of Redemption!

[CatholicHoser]

Originally Posted by Stevereeno

Again, I don't understand how one can attempt to interpret Christ's statement regarding the "day or hour". We are not allowed to hold that Christ was without any particular knowledge, whatsoever - this is Dogma (C. of Nicea, perhaps). Given that, Christ states:

"But of that day or hour, no one knows, neither the angels in heaven, nor the Son, but only the Father."

Any attempt to interpret this passage seems to lead one to heresy. However, Christ only reserves knowledge of the "day" and the "hour", not knowledge of the Pope.

I don't think anyone that has commented on this passage on this thread is trying to be heretical (at least I hope not, anyway!)

Unless I missed someone that is, of course.

I'm willing to accept any Church teaching that I find. In the meantime though, I would like to "keep my own house in order" as best I can to be ready either for my death or the Second Coming of Christ.

This I know for sure, I don't know the day or hour, so I would like to be ready as I can be, and be not afraid.