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  #1  
Old Feb 7, '10, 1:31 pm
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Cool Dr. David Jeremiah thinks Purgatory is a 2nd chance after death...

I just finished writing him the following e-mail after stumbling across his "Turning Point" show where he misrepresented Purgatory to his audience.

If this man is a "doctor" of theology, how does he not know better than this? I think this is all the more reason to pay careful head to the letter from St. James when he says, "
[1] Let not many of you become teachers, my brethren, for you know that we who teach shall be judged with greater strictness."
Quote:
Dear Sir,

I just finished watching part of your message this date on television and wanted to point out to you a gross error in something you said.

You said something to the effect that Purgatory does not exist because it was a place where one could change one's final end after death, and that is a grossly misstated understanding of it.

As a devout Catholic, I know the Bible and my Catholic faith well enough to know that the Catholic Church does not now, has not ever, and will not ever teach any such foolishness as that, and you cannot provide any authentic and authoritative documentation where such would be the case.

I saw what appears to be a large group of people sitting there listening to you preach, and It bothered me that you were teaching them something in error.

You are a doctor of theology, are you not? Then I would expect better information in your messages than that, especially since there are many accurate sources on the Catholic faith available to us all.

If you would like some examples:
Purgatory
The Roots of Purgatory (Fathers*)
Where does the idea of purgatory come from, as it is not mentioned in the Bible?
Biblical and Jewish Traditional Beliefs About Purgatory


That last is one that is on my personal blog and has some very interesting information as well.

Thank you for your time.
Very sincerely in Christ,
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  #2  
Old Feb 7, '10, 2:33 pm
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Default Re: Dr. David Jeremiah thinks Purgatory is a 2nd chance after death...

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  #3  
Old Feb 7, '10, 2:38 pm
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Default Re: Dr. David Jeremiah thinks Purgatory is a 2nd chance after death...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Church Militant View Post
I just finished writing him the following e-mail after stumbling across his "Turning Point" show where he misrepresented Purgatory to his audience.

If this man is a "doctor" of theology, how does he not know better than this? I think this is all the more reason to pay careful head to the letter from St. James when he says, "[1] Let not many of you become teachers, my brethren, for you know that we who teach shall be judged with greater strictness."
Do you have a postall or email address for Dr. Jeremiah?
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  #4  
Old Feb 7, '10, 8:30 pm
maximus maximus is offline
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Default Re: Dr. David Jeremiah thinks Purgatory is a 2nd chance after death...

Good luck on getting him to recant on an obvious misrepresentation. Some of these pastors relish too much using such misrepresentations for attacking the Catholic Church and encourage their congregations to believe such things. Sadly, these misrepresentations tend to be very effective.

God Bless
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  #5  
Old Feb 8, '10, 1:00 am
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Default Re: Dr. David Jeremiah thinks Purgatory is a 2nd chance after death...

"Dr." Jeremiah is an anti-Catholic funnymentalist with a fake degree. This article by Mark Bonocore is not on the topic of Purgatory, but it gives a glimpse into "Dr." Jeremiah's integrity.

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  #6  
Old Feb 8, '10, 3:09 am
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Default Re: Dr. David Jeremiah thinks Purgatory is a 2nd chance after death...

CM, you know there are Professors who teach 'drivel' worse than this also.

Formal qualifications does not equate to being good teachers...or teachers of good.

Big ups for letting him know though......and leaving a 'mustard seed' for him to follow if he chooses.

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  #7  
Old Feb 8, '10, 4:56 am
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Default Re: Dr. David Jeremiah thinks Purgatory is a 2nd chance after death...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Church Militant View Post
I just finished writing him the following e-mail after stumbling across his "Turning Point" show where he misrepresented Purgatory to his audience.
Well done - let us know if you actually get a response!
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  #8  
Old Feb 8, '10, 5:47 pm
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Default Re: Dr. David Jeremiah thinks Purgatory is a 2nd chance after death...

Wonder if he would agree to debate Tim Staples on the topic ?

He may sincerely believe what he teaches. If he does, he should agree to debate a Catholic on the topic. Those who teach error, should not be given a free pass to continue unopposed.
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  #9  
Old Feb 8, '10, 11:20 pm
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Cool Re: Dr. David Jeremiah thinks Purgatory is a 2nd chance after death...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ignatius View Post
Do you have a postal or email address for Dr. Jeremiah?
Google his Turning Point site and you'll see a contact link.
Quote:
Originally Posted by maximus View Post
Good luck on getting him to recant on an obvious misrepresentation. Some of these pastors relish too much using such misrepresentations for attacking the Catholic Church and encourage their congregations to believe such things. Sadly, these misrepresentations tend to be very effective.

God Bless
Yeah, but one can only try. I almost missed it because he passed it off so smoothly. I went,"Hey...wait a minute!"
Quote:
Originally Posted by kepha1 View Post
"Dr." Jeremiah is an anti-Catholic funnymentalist with a fake degree. This article by Mark Bonocore is not on the topic of Purgatory, but it gives a glimpse into "Dr." Jeremiah's integrity.

catholic-legate
I like Mark Bonocore. That's a very good answer.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Deconi View Post
CM, you know there are Professors who teach 'drivel' worse than this also.

Formal qualifications does not equate to being good teachers...or teachers of good.

Big ups for letting him know though......and leaving a 'mustard seed' for him to follow if he chooses.

Yeah...we'll see what happens, if anything.
Quote:
Originally Posted by NHInsider View Post
Well done - let us know if you actually get a response!
Quote:
Originally Posted by brb3 View Post
Wonder if he would agree to debate Tim Staples on the topic ?

He may sincerely believe what he teaches. If he does, he should agree to debate a Catholic on the topic. Those who teach error, should not be given a free pass to continue unopposed.
I agree. I am not aware of this man debating anyone. He really doesn't seem like the type.
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  #10  
Old Feb 9, '10, 2:56 am
mardukm mardukm is offline
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Default Re: Dr. David Jeremiah thinks Purgatory is a 2nd chance after death...

I recall reading a book by Fr. John Hardon many years ago where he made this same statement (that Purgatory is a 2nd chance). Ever since then, I've not given too much stock to Fr. Hardon's teachings, though he seems rather popular among orthodox Catholics.

Blessings,
Marduk
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  #11  
Old Feb 10, '10, 8:26 am
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Default Re: Dr. David Jeremiah thinks Purgatory is a 2nd chance after death...

Quote:
Originally Posted by mardukm View Post
I recall reading a book by Fr. John Hardon many years ago where he made this same statement (that Purgatory is a 2nd chance). Ever since then, I've not given too much stock to Fr. Hardon's teachings, though he seems rather popular among orthodox Catholics.

Blessings,
Marduk
Really? I've read quite a bit of Fr. Hardon and have never seen any such thing. Perhaps you misunderstood.

You can see his teaching on Purgatory in this article of his from Inter Mirifica. There's no discussion at all of any 2nd chance.

Fr. Hardon Archives - The Doctrine of Purgatory
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  #12  
Old Feb 10, '10, 6:58 pm
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Default Re: Dr. David Jeremiah thinks Purgatory is a 2nd chance after death...

Quote:
Originally Posted by mardukm View Post
I recall reading a book by Fr. John Hardon many years ago where he made this same statement (that Purgatory is a 2nd chance). Ever since then, I've not given too much stock to Fr. Hardon's teachings, though he seems rather popular among orthodox Catholics.

Blessings,
Marduk
I use the Modern Catholic Dictionary by Father John Hardon and there is no second chance in Purgatory.

PURGATORY. The place or condition in which the souls of the just are purified after death and before they can enter heaven. They may be purified of the guilt of their venial sins, as in this life, by an act of contrition deriving from charity and performed with the help of grace. This sorrow does not, however, affect the punishment for sins, because in the next world there is no longer any possibility of merit. The souls are certainly purified by atoning for the temporal punishments due to sin by their willing acceptance of suffering imposed by God. The sufferings in purgatory are not the same for all, but proportioned to each person's degree of sinfulness. Moreover, these sufferings can be lessened in duration and intensity through the prayers and good works of the faithful on earth. Nor are the pains incompatible with great peace and joy, since the poor souls deeply love God and are sure they will reach heaven. As members of the Church Suffering, the souls in purgatory can intercede for the persons on earth, who are therefore encouraged to invoke their aid. Purgatory will not continue after the general judgment, but its duration for any particular soul continues until it is free from all guilt and punishment. Immediately on purification the soul is assumed into heaven. (Etym. Latin purgatio, cleansing, purifying.)
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  #13  
Old Mar 31, '11, 6:28 am
markbruckner markbruckner is offline
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Default Re: Dr. David Jeremiah thinks Purgatory is a 2nd chance after death...

I have been raised and educated as a fundamentalist but am seriously considering becoming a Roman Catholic. Part of the reason is men like Jeremiah. I have listened to literally hundreds of hours of his tapes over many years and find a lot of problems with his honesty. The way represents Church History to be mostly Pre mill and Dispensationalism and very few Amil or Post Mil believers is wrong. Partly dishonesty and partly ignorance. He doesnt have a good understanding of Church History at all.

His doctorate degree is fake no question about it. You can have an honoray degree and not have a fake degree if you advertise it as honorary. But on his website he makes it appear as if he earned a doctorate. His Bachelors degree from Cedarville is ligit, his Masters at Dallas is Legit (or at least as legit as the others who got their degree there). He lists graduate work at Grace on his Bio...but he never completed a degree there. He was later granted an honorary degree from Cedarville College (now University). His father was an administrator there for many years and he Jeremiah speaks there sometimes. There is also a meeting hall humbly named the ''Jeremiah Center.'' I am not sure who paid for the hall or if it was a thank you for the honorary degree. But Jeremiah calls himself Doctor very often..sometimes 8 times on one page of his books....never mentioning he didnt earn his doctorate that I could see.

When I set out to find out if his doctorate was real, it was difficult. I would e-mail Turning point ministries....and instead of an answer I got an offer to buy $58 worth of tapes. Eventually I got a member of his pastoral staff to tell me yes...his degree was honorary and not earned. I sent an email requesting they clarify that in their publications and broadcasts...and then I my email address was blocked from further contact....hehe.

Also recently Jeremiahs organization resigned from Evangelicals for Financial Responsibility after and investigation. I am not sure what the issues were, but over the years he has been plagued by allegations that he hired Ghost Writers to write his high volume of low quality religious books.

I have no respect of his integrity at all.
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  #14  
Old Mar 31, '11, 11:57 am
djrakowski djrakowski is offline
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Default Re: Dr. David Jeremiah thinks Purgatory is a 2nd chance after death...

Quote:
Originally Posted by markbruckner View Post
I have been raised and educated as a fundamentalist but am seriously considering becoming a Roman Catholic.
Welcome to the forums - you've come to the right place! The forums in general, and my buddy Church Militant (the humble dude who started this thread) played a significant role in my own conversion.
Quote:
Originally Posted by markbruckner View Post
Part of the reason is men like Jeremiah. I have listened to literally hundreds of hours of his tapes over many years and find a lot of problems with his honesty. The way represents Church History to be mostly Pre mill and Dispensationalism and very few Amil or Post Mil believers is wrong. Partly dishonesty and partly ignorance. He doesnt have a good understanding of Church History at all.
This is the sort of nonsense I used to hear from my old evangelical Protestant pastor, and he actually earned his PhD from the Temple Baptist Theological Seminary, and serves as an adjunct professor at Moody Theological Seminary's Michigan campus (formerly known as the Michigan Theological Seminary). And yet, he learned everything he knows about Catholicism from Loraine Boettner's contemptible "Roman Catholicism." Who can account for willful ignorance?
Quote:
Originally Posted by markbruckner View Post
When I set out to find out if his doctorate was real, it was difficult. I would e-mail Turning point ministries....and instead of an answer I got an offer to buy $58 worth of tapes. Eventually I got a member of his pastoral staff to tell me yes...his degree was honorary and not earned. I sent an email requesting they clarify that in their publications and broadcasts...and then I my email address was blocked from further contact....hehe.
How generous and helpful of him!

I've also seen/heard this old Irish guy preaching a ton of lies about what the Catholic Church teaches. Having grown up in Ireland, the guy ought to know better.
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  #15  
Old Mar 31, '11, 5:20 pm
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Default Re: Dr. David Jeremiah thinks Purgatory is a 2nd chance after death...

C. Militant ...

Did David J. ever answer you back ?
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