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Oct 1, '10, 2:54 pm
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Regular Member
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Join Date: September 8, 2006
Posts: 2,617
Religion: Catholic
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Re: Could it be possible that animals are aware of the existance of God.
Quote:
Originally Posted by raaucoin
I have 2 cairn terriers. They are crazy when I get home, except when I come home from Mass two minutes away from my house. One , the crazier of the two greets me with an almost reverent calmness. It's as if she knows where I've been or can sense that I've received the Lord.
But I'm one of those crazy pet owners who "humanizes" her dogs. Could be nothing more than a very strange coincidence-??  |
That is very interesting. It takes 20 minutes for the Blessed Sacrament in our stomach to be fully consumed. It only takes two minutes for you to get home after Mass. Your dogs obviously sense the Presence inside of you.
My cat will try to grab any dangling object in front of her. But whenever my rosary is dangling in front of her, she never moves her paw. 
__________________
Whom have I in heaven but thee?
And none beside thee delights me on earth. (Psalm 73:25)
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Oct 1, '10, 5:33 pm
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Regular Member
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Join Date: September 17, 2007
Posts: 3,753
Religion: Catholic! Praise be to God!
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Re: Could it be possible that animals are aware of the existance of God.
Quote:
Originally Posted by thistle
Human souls are immortal and spiritual.
Animal souls are mortal and not spiritual.
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I have a theological question about this.
Animals are not intelligent enough to know and love Jesus. Knowing Jesus is eternal life (John 17:3). Therefore they do not have eternal life, either now, while they live, or after they die. Knowing Jesus is spiritual life, life of the soul.
However, animals do have some kind of life right now. I don't think we know for sure that they cease to exist when they die. They simply are not united with Jesus any more than they are now.
It seems to me possible that animals continue to exist in some way, or will be raised up with the rest of creation, in a kind of glorified lower level of life similar to what they have right now. Like a completion to what they have right now. Though not eternal life and spiritual like we humans experience, because they aren't one with God.
I'm just theorizing. This really gets into the question of what life means, and what the mortal life animals have is, compared to the spiritual life Christians have, which is union with Jesus.
Even the damned have some kind of "life," after death, though it obviously is not true spiritual life.
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Oct 1, '10, 7:15 pm
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Junior Member
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Join Date: September 16, 2006
Posts: 230
Religion: Catholic
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Re: Could it be possible that animals are aware of the existance of God.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lief Erikson
Animals are not intelligent enough to know and love Jesus.
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Why would you think this?
We don't know how intelligent animals are - especially when we base the concept of animal intelligence on what we perceive as human intelligence.
God gave all His creation enough intelligence to know and love Him.
Go with Love, Go with God
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Oct 1, '10, 7:35 pm
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New Member
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Join Date: January 20, 2010
Posts: 17
Religion: Catholic
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Re: Could it be possible that animals are aware of the existance of God.
Quote:
Originally Posted by DarkNight
"And he said to them: Go ye into the whole world, and preach the gospel to every creature. Mark 16:14-15
Jesus said to preach to all creatures. Therefor all creatures must have an awareness of their creator.
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Here's another translation: "Go into all the world and preach the good news to all creation."
So by your reasoning, it's not just animals that have an awareness of their creator:
The sun and the moon are aware of the Lord.
The stars of heaven are aware of the Lord.
Dew and rain are aware of the Lord.
Frost and chill are aware of the Lord...
hmmm. Sounds suspiciously like Daniel 3! Of course, it will be a while before we can preach the good news to distant stars (which are indeed part of creation). 
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Oct 1, '10, 8:22 pm
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Junior Member
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Join Date: April 18, 2007
Posts: 270
Religion: Catholic
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Re: Could it be possible that animals are aware of the existance of God.
I think JPII said dogs had souls. If that is true and souls come from God then they must know God on some level we don't understand.
__________________
Nie Boj się bo jestem Tobą JMJ
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Oct 1, '10, 10:49 pm
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Join Date: October 1, 2010
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Re: Could it be possible that animals are aware of the existance of God.
Lovely thread! Dark Night, I found your posts especially touching. I did watch the youtube video you posted and loved it. Also watched the soldier returning from Afghanistan greeting his dog that popped up too.
St. Francis of Assisi is a favorite saint of mine, and I think it's wonderful that he preached to "all creation". I believe that animals have souls and no human can know with certainty where they go after death. It's God's decision. They are innocents who bring joy; why would God not want to surround Himself with them?
Maybe they even get to be angels in Heaven?  I don't know, but I'm not going to limit God by insisting that animals are not aware of Him.
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Oct 2, '10, 7:42 am
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Junior Member
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Join Date: September 16, 2006
Posts: 230
Religion: Catholic
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Re: Could it be possible that animals are aware of the existance of God.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Evenprimes
Here's another translation: "Go into all the world and preach the good news to all creation."
So by your reasoning, it's not just animals that have an awareness of their creator:
The sun and the moon are aware of the Lord.
The stars of heaven are aware of the Lord.
Dew and rain are aware of the Lord.
Frost and chill are aware of the Lord...
hmmm. Sounds suspiciously like Daniel 3! Of course, it will be a while before we can preach the good news to distant stars (which are indeed part of creation). |
Actually, it is much more like St Francis of Assisi's Canticle of the Sun also known as the "Praise of the Creatures" ...
We praise You, Lord, for all Your creatures,
especially for Brother Sun,
who is the day through whom You give us light.
And he is beautiful and radiant with great splendor,
of You Most High, he bears your likeness.
... And I do so like the way Elizabeth Barrett Browning put it "Earth's crammed with heaven,
And every common bush afire with God" Go with Love, Go with God
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Oct 2, '10, 9:07 am
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New Member
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Join Date: January 20, 2010
Posts: 17
Religion: Catholic
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Re: Could it be possible that animals are aware of the existance of God.
Quote:
Originally Posted by DarkNight
Actually, it is much more like St Francis of Assisi's Canticle of the Sun also known as the "Praise of the Creatures" ...
We praise You, Lord, for all Your creatures,
especially for Brother Sun,
who is the day through whom You give us light.
And he is beautiful and radiant with great splendor,
of You Most High, he bears your likeness.
... And I do so like the way Elizabeth Barrett Browning put it "Earth's crammed with heaven,
And every common bush afire with God" Go with Love, Go with God |
As much as I like the references above, I think my post sounded more like Daniel 3. Snippets of that chapter follow:
Sun and moon, bless the Lord.
Stars of heaven, bless the Lord.
Dew and rain, bless the Lord.
Frost and chill, bless the Lord.
If one reasons that blessing the Lord requires awareness of the Lord, my post follows directly. If, however, one reasons that the very existence of these things gives glory to God without action on their part, that awareness isn't necessarily implied. Of course, if we keep silent then the very rocks will cry out, opening a brand new can of worms. 
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Oct 2, '10, 7:10 pm
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Junior Member
Prayer Warrior
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Join Date: January 1, 2010
Posts: 426
Religion: United Church of Christ
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Re: Could it be possible that animals are aware of the existance of God.
Quote:
Originally Posted by thistle
Human souls are immortal and spiritual.
Animal souls are mortal and not spiritual.
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That may very well be true, but it is totally irrelevant! Mortality does not entail blindness to the witness of Creation. I'm not making any claims about specific species (haha) but I certainly believe animals can, and fervently hope some of them do, have at least a basic knowledge of the Almighty.
__________________
"Episcopal" is the adjective, and "Episcopalian" is the noun. Do please remember.
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Oct 3, '10, 4:01 am
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Forum Elder
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Join Date: August 23, 2005
Posts: 16,933
Religion: Catholic
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Re: Could it be possible that animals are aware of the existance of God.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bran Stark
That may very well be true, but it is totally irrelevant! Mortality does not entail blindness to the witness of Creation. I'm not making any claims about specific species (haha) but I certainly believe animals can, and fervently hope some of them do, have at least a basic knowledge of the Almighty.
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They don't!
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Oct 3, '10, 5:52 am
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New Member
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Join Date: September 26, 2010
Posts: 81
Religion: Catholic
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Re: Could it be possible that animals are aware of the existance of God.
Quote:
Originally Posted by thistle
Atheists can love but they are not spiritual. Animals are NOT spiritual. Animals do NOT go to Heaven.
Church teaching is clear on that when it says "from creation humans have a supernatural end". That means animals do not have a supernatural end and will not be in Heaven or Hell. When an animal dies its soul also ceases to exist.
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This is a God teaching:
Mark 11:23 "I tell you the truth, if anyone says to this mountain ...
and shall not doubt in his heart, but shall believe that those things which he ... he shall have whatsoever he saith: whatever he commands shall be done; ...
http://bible.cc/mark/11-23.htm - 24k - Cached - Similar pages
Romans 10:10 For it is with your heart that you believe and are ...
For it is by believing in your heart that you are made right with God, and it is by ... but with such a faith as shall be sincere, and shall influence the life. .... in declaring to the churches of Christ what he has done for our souls, ...
http://bible.cc/romans/10-10.htm - 32k - Cached - Similar pages
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Oct 3, '10, 5:56 am
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New Member
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Join Date: September 26, 2010
Posts: 81
Religion: Catholic
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Re: Could it be possible that animals are aware of the existance of God.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lief Erikson
I have a theological question about this.
Animals are not intelligent enough to know and love Jesus. Knowing Jesus is eternal life (John 17:3). Therefore they do not have eternal life, either now, while they live, or after they die. Knowing Jesus is spiritual life, life of the soul.
However, animals do have some kind of life right now. I don't think we know for sure that they cease to exist when they die. They simply are not united with Jesus any more than they are now.
It seems to me possible that animals continue to exist in some way, or will be raised up with the rest of creation, in a kind of glorified lower level of life similar to what they have right now. Like a completion to what they have right now. Though not eternal life and spiritual like we humans experience, because they aren't one with God.
I'm just theorizing. This really gets into the question of what life means, and what the mortal life animals have is, compared to the spiritual life Christians have, which is union with Jesus.
Even the damned have some kind of "life," after death, though it obviously is not true spiritual life.
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IF God is Love and Animals can Love then they are part of god not just something that exsists. My animals love me and come to me when i call "My sheep know my name and follow me where ever i go"
Mark 11:23 "I tell you the truth, if anyone says to this mountain ...
and shall not doubt in his heart, but shall believe that those things which he ... he shall have whatsoever he saith: whatever he commands shall be done; ...
http://bible.cc/mark/11-23.htm - 24k - Cached - Similar pages
Romans 10:10 For it is with your heart that you believe and are ...
For it is by believing in your heart that you are made right with God, and it is by ... but with such a faith as shall be sincere, and shall influence the life. .... in declaring to the churches of Christ what he has done for our souls, ...
http://bible.cc/romans/10-10.htm - 32k - Cached - Similar pages
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Oct 3, '10, 7:13 pm
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Junior Member
Prayer Warrior
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Join Date: January 1, 2010
Posts: 426
Religion: United Church of Christ
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Re: Could it be possible that animals are aware of the existance of God.
Quote:
Originally Posted by thistle
They don't!
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Well, since Scripture is entirely silent on the purely scientific question of the mental abilities of animals, I'm not at all prepared to make such a hasty statement. I'm not even claiming here that animals will be in the next life, just that in this one they might know about God. Still, don't say I didn't warn you if someday you see a chorus of harmonious heavenly hamsters peeking through the Pearly Gates.
__________________
"Episcopal" is the adjective, and "Episcopalian" is the noun. Do please remember.
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Oct 4, '10, 9:51 am
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New Member
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Join Date: September 26, 2010
Posts: 81
Religion: Catholic
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Re: Could it be possible that animals are aware of the existance of God.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lief Erikson
I have a theological question about this.
Animals are not intelligent enough to know and love Jesus. Knowing Jesus is eternal life (John 17:3). Therefore they do not have eternal life, either now, while they live, or after they die. Knowing Jesus is spiritual life, life of the soul.
However, animals do have some kind of life right now. I don't think we know for sure that they cease to exist when they die. They simply are not united with Jesus any more than they are now.
It seems to me possible that animals continue to exist in some way, or will be raised up with the rest of creation, in a kind of glorified lower level of life similar to what they have right now. Like a completion to what they have right now. Though not eternal life and spiritual like we humans experience, because they aren't one with God.
I'm just theorizing. This really gets into the question of what life means, and what the mortal life animals have is, compared to the spiritual life Christians have, which is union with Jesus.
Even the damned have some kind of "life," after death, though it obviously is not true spiritual life.
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Most Humans are not intelligent enough to love and know Jesus(Fully) some claim to, but i have my doubts. We can only relate his love to each other and animals can intersept what we relate, and they do the same as they tend to immitate, or do they in fact love and know? Do we teach them or do they teach us? What of the lions in the lion den with Daniel,did they understand not to kill Daniel?Did God directly communicate with them through his spirit or do you feel that is imppossible?AHH but i know you know better then that. What of ST Francis? 
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Oct 4, '10, 10:00 am
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Veteran Member
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Join Date: April 7, 2006
Posts: 10,990
Religion: Catholic
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Re: Could it be possible that animals are aware of the existance of God.
After I had to put down my dog about two months ago, a friend of mine told me that some one had asked a Eileen George if we would see our pets in heaven.
She said that in heaven we will have perfect joy and if we ask the Lord to see our pets, he will grant it.
Now, I think she's mistaken because perfect joy will mean we no longer need the affection of pets, but our complete joy will be in standing in the presence of God.
However, it was something to think about at the time.
I'd like to think that I will see the dogs that were in my life when I get to heaven, but I don't know.
Jim
__________________
"God can not be grasped except through love."
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