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  #46  
Old Dec 10, '11, 11:07 pm
LayingHands's Avatar
LayingHands LayingHands is offline
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Default Re: Is it a Sin to eat Ice Cream?

Quote:
Originally Posted by fom4life View Post
That was a partial way to get people's attention. I don't know how to intellectually make sense of what this person wrote and I am looking for some intellectual arguments to counteract it. I don't really think it is a sin to eat IC. But this person who wrote it brought up some points that raised some questions. When I have questions that stick on my mind like glue I want to un stick them as quckly as possible. I like to present questions to the CA community becasue I usally find a great array of anwers to my questions.

So again I ask if anyone has any intellegent counter arguments to original first post in this thread.

Thanks in advance.
I think this refers to becoming a living material existence servant, to the human 6 senses...GOD's teaching regarding this matter is explained because we are His only conscience beings...Spiritsouls, encased in Material/Matter...unlike all His other living entities as creations, which have no conscienceness or knowledge of right and wrong.

GOD says ALL Human life is intended for one purpose and one purpose only...to find HIM, as Spiritsoul to SUPERSOUL and the conquering/controlling of the 6 senses. They are taste, touch, smell, visual, and hearing and thoughts. They are to be controlled through the awakening of the self...Self-Realization that we are Spiritsoul and NOT Material matter.

We, as Humanity, believe we are the bodies we are clothed in. Our bodies are impermanent and only a coat or dress we wear over our Spiritsouls, however, as we wallow and indulge our 6 senses totally in this life's material existence, we become more and more grounded into the Material Existence.

Holy devotees of all Religions will fast, become solitary, do not socialized, do not engage in sex outside of holy marriage, eat only the quota of food which GOD provides...and strictly control their own self-gratification senses, to become more Spiritual...

In denying the material senses, you deny you are this Material BODY and realize, in reality you are Spirit, a Child of GOD, here temporarily, during this human life to discover you are Spirit...to find Self-Realization, Liberation of Spirit from Material, finding GOD, to return back home, to GODHEAD.
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  #47  
Old Dec 10, '11, 11:29 pm
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LilyM LilyM is offline
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Default Re: Is it a Sin to eat Ice Cream?

This is flat out wrong. We are NOT as humans merely souls encased in a temporary and unimportant envelope of flesh. Rather, our bodies are so central to our humanity that we are not even considered to exist until those bodies come into being at conception.

Moreover, our bodies are so important that they will be resurrected (in glorified form, to be sure, without blemish, but nonetheless the same bodies, otherwise resurrection would be an inaccurate term) and at the last judgement will join our souls in their eternal fate. Why go to such lengths if our bodies aren't essential to our human personhood?

Quote:
Originally Posted by LayingHands View Post
I think this refers to becoming a living material existence servant, to the human 6 senses...GOD's teaching regarding this matter is explained because we are His only conscience beings...Spiritsouls, encased in Material/Matter...unlike all His other living entities as creations, which have no conscienceness or knowledge of right and wrong.

GOD says ALL Human life is intended for one purpose and one purpose only...to find HIM, as Spiritsoul to SUPERSOUL and the conquering/controlling of the 6 senses. They are taste, touch, smell, visual, and hearing and thoughts. They are to be controlled through the awakening of the self...Self-Realization that we are Spiritsoul and NOT Material matter.

We, as Humanity, believe we are the bodies we are clothed in. Our bodies are impermanent and only a coat or dress we wear over our Spiritsouls, however, as we wallow and indulge our 6 senses totally in this life's material existence, we become more and more grounded into the Material Existence.

Holy devotees of all Religions will fast, become solitary, do not socialized, do not engage in sex outside of holy marriage, eat only the quota of food which GOD provides...and strictly control their own self-gratification senses, to become more Spiritual...

In denying the material senses, you deny you are this Material BODY and realize, in reality you are Spirit, a Child of GOD, here temporarily, during this human life to discover you are Spirit...to find Self-Realization, Liberation of Spirit from Material, finding GOD, to return back home, to GODHEAD.
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  #48  
Old Dec 11, '11, 6:29 am
fom4life fom4life is offline
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Default Re: Is it a Sin to eat Ice Cream?

It is not a sin to put sugar or milk in your tea or coffee. It might be a good sacrifice once in awhile.

Thanks Lily for all your valuble insight. If you put too much emphasis on the body that is detrimental to the soul. But the opposite is true as well. You stray too close to Gnosticism if you believe that the soul is the end all and be all of human existence. We have our bodies for life and then for eternity. Sacrifice and mortification help us to be detached from earthly pleasures and to God alone but God did create us so we could enjoy life, just not above God. Also sacrifice and mortification is good to help out souls, both your own and someone else s.

I guess I would encourage myself and others to make sacrifices for the sake of others and for our own spiritual souls, but after reading all these posts it has helped me to remember that such penances are never to be obligatory on the whole Christian community.

Anyone agree or disagree?
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  #49  
Old Dec 11, '11, 4:45 pm
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Default Re: Is it a Sin to eat Ice Cream?

Quote:
Originally Posted by fom4life View Post
It is not a sin to put sugar or milk in your tea or coffee. It might be a good sacrifice once in awhile.
I'm dependent on caffeine but even I rarely drink coffee without cream and never do I drink it without sugar. The bitterness triggers a gag reflex in either my mouth or throat. I can't say God (or my boss) would appreciate me throwing up on the office floor just for a little 'good sacrifice'.

Quote:
Originally Posted by fom4life View Post
I guess I would encourage myself and others to make sacrifices for the sake of others and for our own spiritual souls, but after reading all these posts it has helped me to remember that such penances are never to be obligatory on the whole Christian community.

Anyone agree or disagree?
Agreed actually. However, I would like to add that these sacrifices, should you do them, require a degree of possibility. Even the Church excuses the infirm from attending Sunday Mass.

On the other hand, if I could spare the time to walk all the way from my office to a church that was offering mass for the Immaculate Conception instead of using that time to play on my PC at home, then I don't see why I shouldn't. I've always had the bigger share of time anyways. :P

In fact, that's exactly what I did last week. :P
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  #50  
Old Dec 11, '11, 6:25 pm
Aelred Minor's Avatar
Aelred Minor Aelred Minor is offline
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Default Re: Is it a Sin to eat Ice Cream?

Quote:
Originally Posted by LayingHands View Post
I think this refers to becoming a living material existence servant, to the human 6 senses...GOD's teaching regarding this matter is explained because we are His only conscience beings...Spiritsouls, encased in Material/Matter...unlike all His other living entities as creations, which have no conscienceness or knowledge of right and wrong.

GOD says ALL Human life is intended for one purpose and one purpose only...to find HIM, as Spiritsoul to SUPERSOUL and the conquering/controlling of the 6 senses. They are taste, touch, smell, visual, and hearing and thoughts. They are to be controlled through the awakening of the self...Self-Realization that we are Spiritsoul and NOT Material matter.

We, as Humanity, believe we are the bodies we are clothed in. Our bodies are impermanent and only a coat or dress we wear over our Spiritsouls, however, as we wallow and indulge our 6 senses totally in this life's material existence, we become more and more grounded into the Material Existence.

Holy devotees of all Religions will fast, become solitary, do not socialized, do not engage in sex outside of holy marriage, eat only the quota of food which GOD provides...and strictly control their own self-gratification senses, to become more Spiritual...

In denying the material senses, you deny you are this Material BODY and realize, in reality you are Spirit, a Child of GOD, here temporarily, during this human life to discover you are Spirit...to find Self-Realization, Liberation of Spirit from Material, finding GOD, to return back home, to GODHEAD.
As LilyM has said, we are not merely spirits clothed in matter. We are rational animals, physical creatures whose form (soul) is spiritual. The senses are not things that need to be surpassed through some form of spiritual self-awakening. But in our fallen condition there can indeed seem to be a tension between our animal appetites and our spiritual calling. This is why St. Paul uses so much language reflecting a tension between the spirit and the flesh. The answer is not to reject the body but to integrate your physical and spiritual lives with a goal of serving God in all that you do.

That's really at the heart of this discussion I think, beneath all the bickering over the original question about ice-cream. Should every part of our lives be in some way dedicated to God at least implicitly, or are some things thoroughly non-spiritual affairs, innocent bestial pleasures in which God does not factor in at all. I hold that the answer is the former. We are neither pure spirits clothed in base matter nor pure animals possessed by a spirit alien to it, that what we do with our bodies could be entirely separated from our spiritual vocation.

In the case of small children who have not yet attained the use of reason, sure they will often innocently seek out pleasure simply as such, because they posses reason only in potentiality or at least very incompletely. Gradually though as we grow up we are called to live our lives, our entire lives, in accordance with reason and the love of God. One of the biggest obstacles to this is our tendency to do exactly what is being discussed on this thread, descend back into seeking sensible pleasure without any higher end in sight. This is why it is so important to tame the passions through fasting and mortification, not to transcend the senses but to integrate the life of the senses with the life of the spirit.
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