Purificator Question

runningdude · #1 Dec 18, '11, 8:32 pm

The Eucharist only remains the Body and Blood of Christ so long as its elements still visibly have the accidents of bread and wine.

Now, when I was a EMHC, I noticed that the purificators used to wipe the communion chalices would become stained. When the consecrated wine has have dried on the purificators, does the True Presence remain or has sufficient degradation occurred such the stains are no longer the Eucharist?

FrDavid96 · #2 Dec 18, '11, 8:42 pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by runningdude

The Eucharist only remains the Body and Blood of Christ so long as its elements still visibly have the accidents of bread and wine.

Now, when I was a EMHC, I noticed that the purificators used to wipe the communion chalices would become stained. When the consecrated wine has have dried on the purificators, does the True Presence remain or has sufficient degradation occurred such the stains are no longer the Eucharist?

You're correct: once the accidents of wine are no longer present, neither is the Blood of Christ.

The reason why we're so careful about cleaning the purificators is not because of what those stains "are now" but because of what "they once were." The other reason, is that there is still some chance that the accidents of wine might still be there.

YoungTradCath · #3 Dec 18, '11, 11:45 pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by FrDavid96

You're correct: once the accidents of wine are no longer present, neither is the Blood of Christ.

The reason why we're so careful about cleaning the purificators is not because of what those stains "are now" but because of what "they once were." The other reason, is that there is still some chance that the accidents of wine might still be there.

Would one have to wait until the Blood dries on a purificator, if it is spilled a drop or so, in order to clean it, so that the Blood no longer is Blood?

jimrob · #4 Dec 19, '11, 12:52 am

There is a particular procedure for cleaning purificators and all altar linen that may contain traces of the Sacred Elements. This ensures that all traces go to earth. In our Parish, the altar linen is taken away and correctly cleaned at our local convent.

FrDavid96 · #5 Dec 19, '11, 10:25 am

Quote:

Originally Posted by YoungTradCath

Would one have to wait until the Blood dries on a purificator, if it is spilled a drop or so, in order to clean it, so that the Blood no longer is Blood?

No, one would not have to wait. However, one would still have to follow the proper procedures. The purificator (or whatever else) has to be washed (at least rinsed well) in water and the water poured into the ground (that's the purpose of a sacrarium sink). After that, it can be washed as usual.

On a purely practical note, it might be better not to wait, to avoid the stain setting.

MissBorgia · #6 Dec 19, '11, 11:23 am

i help handle the linen at mass and and the purificators go in a bucket of water, then the water is put in a plant or on Father's rosebushes..and the purificators are laundered.

runningdude · #7 Dec 19, '11, 11:52 am

Thank-you Father David. I always enjoy your informative answers

Mrs Sally · #8 Dec 19, '11, 12:07 pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by MissBorgia

i help handle the linen at mass and and the purificators go in a bucket of water, then the water is put in a plant or on Father's rosebushes..and the purificators are laundered.

That's more or less how we do it also. Except for the rosebushes.

FrDavid96 · #9 Dec 19, '11, 2:37 pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mrs Sally

That's more or less how we do it also. Except for the rosebushes.

What kind of flowers do you use then?

Mrs Sally · #10 Dec 19, '11, 5:37 pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by FrDavid96

What kind of flowers do you use then?

They are bushes, some kind of green, bushy bushes. My priest said it was OK to use them.

Do you think it's really alright? Is there a special flower designated in Canon Law?

paperwight66 · #11 Dec 20, '11, 12:16 am

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mrs Sally

They are bushes, some kind of green, bushy bushes. My priest said it was OK to use them.

Do you think it's really alright? Is there a special flower designated in Canon Law?

Now you are being naughty, Mrs. Sally.

(Hyssop, anyone?)

Mrs Sally · #12 Dec 20, '11, 4:48 am

Quote:

Originally Posted by paperwight66

Now you are being naughty, Mrs. Sally.

(Hyssop, anyone?)

isaiah m · #13 Dec 21, '11, 2:56 pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by YoungTradCath

Would one have to wait until the Blood dries on a purificator, if it is spilled a drop or so, in order to clean it, so that the Blood no longer is Blood?

When does wine cease to be wine? Outside of the Eucharistic concept, wine spilled on a carpet is considered a "wine stain". It is possibly removed by proper cleaning processes. Is it when it is removed that the wine ceases to be wine? If this is true, then in the Eucharistic concept, it is still the Blood of Christ until properly removed by rinsing. Then the rinse water must be properly disposed of.

This brings to mind a different queston about the "Real Presence". If the chalice or other vessel(s) that contained the Blood of Christ has(have) not been properly purified, and remain(s) in the sanctuary on the sacristan table, the Blood of Christ is in the open, the same as if the tabernacle is open or the Host is in the monstrance for public adoration. Does this mean the same rules of respect apply until proper purification of the vessels, even though the tabernacle is closed? Would this mean it would be proper to kneel except when standing is proper for the remainder of the Mass? (It is only a short time. I know sitting during longer periods of Adoration is acceptable). Is it still considered proper etiquette to genuflect on both knees when leaving the presence of the Eucharist? How does anyone really know the status of purification at Mass?

I know there are many questions here, but trust the many viewers to come up with the right answers.

YoungTradCath · #14 Dec 21, '11, 3:04 pm

Wine ceases to be wine when it dries or becomes so diluted with something as to not look like wine or have the accidents of it.

isaiah m · #15 Dec 21, '11, 6:09 pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by YoungTradCath

Wine ceases to be wine when it dries or becomes so diluted with something as to not look like wine or have the accidents of it.

This is a bit confusing to me. When mashed potatoes dry, what do they become since they are not the same as when moist? When milk is put in powder form, it doesn't look like milk. Is it milk when in powder form? There are many other examples.

Another question is about diluting it. The proper precedure for washing purificators is use water to rinse them out. But this water may not be disposed of by pouring down the drain into the sanitary sewer system. It must be returned to the ground in an apropriate way. Almost every church has such a place in the sacristy. If not they have an alternative to the sewer system.