Any Other people that attend an Anglican church feel the same?

[JPeter]

Originally Posted by defenderoftruth

This is that "cafeteria" feel that I can't stand...

"A little of this and a little of that, oh no thank you I don't feel like peas today, and I don't like Broccoli...it's so nice being my own bishop and pope I get to believe whatever I want and nothing I don't!"

Everyone is infallible except the Pope right JPeter?

Sorry Moderator but I can't stand the "isn't it great" mentality of those that refuse to be obedient to the Pope. I don't mean to sound rough or angry but hey I'll be honest that's how I feel. Oh and JPeter, I've been to an Eastern Orthodox church it was part of the OCA (Orthodox Church in America) they didn't recognize ANY baptism outside of an Eastern Orthodox church yet they were in Communion with the Antiochians and Greeks who do recognize baptisms outside of the EO communion. They have the Greeks, Antiochians, Serbians, OCA, ROCOR, etc. etc. in the United States all claiming they are one church but again have competing Bishops only a few believe in a literal hell the rest think that everyone is in the presence of God in Heaven but some suffer and some don't for eternity...so Eastern Orthodox is a lot like Anglicanism. They also allow divorce and remarriage up to (get this) THREE TIMES. And allow birth control...and rape/incest abortion. That's unacceptable.

The biggest thing is if you actually read the early church you'd see alot of "see of Peter" "chair of Peter" etc. etc. talking about Rome and if one doesn't agree with Rome one isn't in the church. Can't get passed that one.

DoT

Its about placing emphasis on what matters. The message of the Christian faith is Christ Crucified and raised from the dead on the third day for the remission of sin. Whether you pray to saints or not has nothing to do with salvation. Am I supposed to throw a person out of the Church because he does not pray to saints? Am I a better Christian than him for praying to saints? I do not know any Anglican that would say Rome isn't part of the Church but I know Millions of Roman Catholics who would say Anglicans are not part of the Church. The Petrine doctrines are what the Roman Catholic Church stands or falls behind. The Pope said it, so it is (at least when in ex cathedra). If you have become convinced that the Roman Church is the fullness of the faith than go there. But understand this, when you go to the Roman Church you have to believe everything they are teaching you. You want to consistently eat broccoli and they can give you that, but it has to be that way every time. So when you look at a Tradition that looks like it could be peas, it makes no difference because Rome has declared that it is broccoli.

[masuwerte]

DoT, have you changed so much since December? In this thread, http://forums.catholic.com/showthread.php?t=624844, you spoke glowingly of your Anglican church and said you couldn't become Roman Catholic because of the papacy and marian dogmas. See posts 49, 50 and especially 107 in the above thread.

[defenderoftruth]

Originally Posted by masuwerte

DoT, have you changed so much since December? In this thread, http://forums.catholic.com/showthread.php?t=624844, you spoke glowingly of your Anglican church and said you couldn't become Roman Catholic because of the papacy and marian dogmas. See posts 49, 50 and especially 107 in the above thread.

I have. I've really really tried to be "excited" about Anglicanism and quite frankly I'm tired of desperately trying to convince others of it's authenticity but importantly I'm done trying to convince myself. You can only lie to yourself so often until you feel like a heel. Even if IF our church (the one I belong to) had a succession from the "dutch touch" the Anglican church as a whole as given up on theology passed down in favor of intellectualism. I guess no one can change without someone trying to remind them or throw it in their face thanks for proving that Masuwerte.

DoT

Since then BTW, I've read a book called "the bible proves the teachings of the catholic church" it deals with and gives UNDENIABLE evidence of the "problem subjects" I had in December. It's the best apologist book I've read on the Catholic Church. (just because its written by a sedevacantist doesn't mean it isn't true.)

[GKC]

Originally Posted by defenderoftruth

I have. I've really really tried to be "excited" about Anglicanism and quite frankly I'm tired of desperately trying to convince others of it's authenticity but importantly I'm done trying to convince myself. You can only lie to yourself so often until you feel like a heel. Even if IF our church (the one I belong to) had a succession from the "dutch touch" the Anglican church as a whole as given up on theology passed down in favor of intellectualism. I guess no one can change without someone trying to remind them or throw it in their face thanks for proving that Masuwerte.

DoT

DoT,

It was 3 months ago. The question seemed a reasonable one. I had come to a conclusion earlier today myself, on the difference between your posts back 3 years ago, and this thread.

I'm not throwing anything in your face; I don't think masuwerte was, either. If you can affirm what the RCC requires you to affirm, think of Cardinal Newman.

GKC

[defenderoftruth]

Originally Posted by JPeter

Its about placing emphasis on what matters. The message of the Christian faith is Christ Crucified and raised from the dead on the third day for the remission of sin. Whether you pray to saints or not has nothing to do with salvation. Am I supposed to throw a person out of the Church because he does not pray to saints? Am I a better Christian than him for praying to saints? I do not know any Anglican that would say Rome isn't part of the Church but I know Millions of Roman Catholics who would say Anglicans are not part of the Church. The Petrine doctrines are what the Roman Catholic Church stands or falls behind. The Pope said it, so it is (at least when in ex cathedra). If you have become convinced that the Roman Church is the fullness of the faith than go there. But understand this, when you go to the Roman Church you have to believe everything they are teaching you. You want to consistently eat broccoli and they can give you that, but it has to be that way every time. So when you look at a Tradition that looks like it could be peas, it makes no difference because Rome has declared that it is broccoli.

I've done a lot of reading and what you are referring to is called obedience...to the Pope instead of myself.

[Kathryn Ann]

Come Swim the Tiber! (Methinks your husband doth protest too much. Many converts begin that way.) But please check out RCIA in the autumn, and in the meantime, your husband may well be interested in the news of many British (Anglicans) in conversation with the Holy Father and the Vatican, hoping to "come over." There are a few U.S. formerly Episcopalian parishes that already have. You might enjoy surfing the web using search terms such as "Anglican Ordinariate," as well.

My prayer is that you will both come over together, in time. Perhaps not at the exact same time, but in time. Scott Hahn, a former Presbyterian pastor is one example of a highly educated person converting, and his (also highly educated) wife followed a few years later. Examples abound, but you are each unique, and the heart of each person needs gentle persuasion. I pray that you will both be surrounded with loving converts and compassion on every side.
Peace to you both.
Kathryn Ann (Joyfully Converted from Episcopal church, 2004)

[JPeter]

I've done a lot of reading and what you are referring to is called obedience...to the Pope instead of myself.

What if the guy your obeying is telling you the wrong thing? What you believe is up to you. As for myself I'm with your husband. I don't owe the Pope anything. If the Papacy returns to its status as the first among equals I may change my mind.

[Miriam1947]

Originally Posted by defenderoftruth

I have. I've really really tried to be "excited" about Anglicanism and quite frankly I'm tired of desperately trying to convince others of it's authenticity but importantly I'm done trying to convince myself. You can only lie to yourself so often until you feel like a heel. Even if IF our church (the one I belong to) had a succession from the "dutch touch" the Anglican church as a whole as given up on theology passed down in favor of intellectualism. I guess no one can change without someone trying to remind them or throw it in their face thanks for proving that Masuwerte.

DoT

Since then BTW, I've read a book called "the bible proves the teachings of the catholic church" it deals with and gives UNDENIABLE evidence of the "problem subjects" I had in December. It's the best apologist book I've read on the Catholic Church. (just because its written by a sedevacantist doesn't mean it isn't true.)

There is another book that you may enjoy as well.

The Biblical Basis for the Catholic Faith by John Salza.

It's all based on the Bible and I found it very enlightening.

Here is a link to his website.

http://www.scripturecatholic.com/

[jlhargus]

Originally Posted by JPeter

What if the guy your obeying is telling you the wrong thing? What you believe is up to you. As for myself I'm with your husband. I don't owe the Pope anything. If the Papacy returns to its status as the first among equals I may change my mind.

JL: Then the scriptures would be wrong telling us the Church is the pillow and ground of truth. Christ's promise to send the Holy Spirit to lead those whom He has sent into all truth would be wrong and no one can know the truth. What if the guy (self) your obeying is telling you the wrong thing (which would be more likely than not)?

[GKC]

Originally Posted by Miriam1947

There is another book that you may enjoy as well.

The Biblical Basis for the Catholic Faith by John Salza.

It's all based on the Bible and I found it very enlightening.

Here is a link to his website.

http://www.scripturecatholic.com/

How about Steve Ray's Crossing the Tiber?

GKC

[Bran Stark]

Originally Posted by defenderoftruth

They haven't put anymore into Sainthood. (capital S not lower case s)

DoT

Really when was the last time the Anglican church canonized someone?

It was in 1662, of course. Blessed Charles Stuart, King & Martyr.

[jordananglo]

Originally Posted by defenderoftruth

I feel like John Henry Cardinal Newman must have felt...(sorry so long) I apologize if anyone finds this "offensive"...I'm just trying to be honest and ask if anyone feels the same.

I attend a "high church" oxford movement type Anglican church. We don't have female "priests/deacons/bishops" and we think homosexuality is perversion. We got the smells and bells, altar boys-no girls etc.

With that said, I just can't stay Anglican. I hear all this stuff about "rich Anglican Patrimony" I fail to see it. Every time I tell someone I go to an Anglican church they say "what's that?" (if they are protestant and "oh......" with a kind of uncomfortable look (if they are Catholic). ....

Anyone feel the same?
DoT

So sorry to hear about this difficult situation. I completely understand: Continuing Anglicanism is crazy. It is the very model of disunity, disobedience, and dysfunction, even if they frequently have good liturgy.

On the other hand, the local RC church has lots of very normal people, a model of global unity, keeping orthodox beliefs, but typically has disastrous liturgy these days.

There is now a solution: Find a nearby Anglican Use/Ordinariate parish, or start one!

If your husband will divorce you for joining the Catholic Church, then you've got bigger problems than where to go to church. The danger is that if your husband thinks he has a monopoly on religious truth - that he has it figured out and no one else does - and just needs some bishop to give him authority to set up his own house church, then this has the makings of a cult of personality or worse.

It doesn't have to be that way, and is the very opposite of the unity Christ prayed for. I will pray that you and your husband find a solution.

Ask your husband to pray with you to help build your marriage. Read and learn more about church history. Be patient, conversion takes time.

[Peter J]

Hi DoT and everyone. Quite an interesting thread you've got here -- if it wasn't so serious, some of the statements made here might really be comical.

Originally Posted by defenderoftruth

...so Eastern Orthodox is a lot like Anglicanism.

You should read some of the threads about Orthodoxy -- bottom line, I don't think very many Catholic posters of CAF would agree with your assertion.

[Peter J]

Originally Posted by JPeter

We are Catholic. Unless of course you allow Rome to have the definition on who is Catholic and who is not. Many Orthodox would not consider the R.C. to be Catholic.

I would say, rather, that they don't consider anyone to be Catholic except the Orthodox.

[Peter J]

Originally Posted by GKC

You say you feel as Newman felt.You know what Newman eventually did; he had no choice.

Could you elaborate?