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  #1  
Old Apr 6, '12, 1:29 pm
WarriorSheep WarriorSheep is offline
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Question What exactly is the necessary form and matter of the Holy Eucharist?

The background to this question is that earlier today (Good Friday), my dad asked something to the effect of, "So the service today isn't a Mass since the Eucharist isn't being consecrated, so you can't have a Mass without the consecration. Can you have a consecration without a Mass?" Now, 'Mass' in my understanding is 'Latin Rite' for Divine Liturgy, which is composed of several parts; Liturgy of the Word, Liturgy of the Eucharist, Communion Rite, etc. So I guess the question can be boiled down to "Can a priest ever celebrate the Liturgy of the Eucharist by itself?"

I don't know. If a priest did try it, even if there is no good reason for that to ever happen, would it validly consecrate the Eucharist? If valid, is there ever a reason for a priest to do this? If valid, but there is no good reason to do it, is it licit (I would guess not)?

This is a specific hypothetical, but in general, beyond some basics like knowing the words of consecration actually need to be said, I don't understand exactly what form and matter is required for this sacrament. Could someone enlighten me? Is there a comprehensive (or at least partial) list someone can give?

Thanks!!
Have a blessed Triduum and Eastertide!
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  #2  
Old Apr 6, '12, 2:07 pm
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grasscutter grasscutter is offline
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Default Re: What exactly is the necessary form and matter of the Holy Eucharist?

I'm not sure if I'm answering your actual question. The hosts that are distributed on Good Friday have been consecrated earlier and reserved.
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  #3  
Old Apr 6, '12, 2:31 pm
1ke 1ke is offline
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Default Re: What exactly is the necessary form and matter of the Holy Eucharist?

Can.* 927 It is absolutely forbidden, even in extreme urgent necessity, to consecrate one matter without the other or even both outside the eucharistic celebration.
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ke's universal disclaimer: In my posts, when I post about marriage, canon law, or sacraments I am talking about Latin Rite only, not the Orthodox and Eastern Rites. These are exceptions that confuse the issue and I am not talking about those.
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  #4  
Old Apr 6, '12, 2:38 pm
MarkThompson MarkThompson is offline
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Default Re: What exactly is the necessary form and matter of the Holy Eucharist?

Quote:
Originally Posted by WarriorSheep View Post
I don't know. If a priest did try it, even if there is no good reason for that to ever happen, would it validly consecrate the Eucharist? If valid, is there ever a reason for a priest to do this? If valid, but there is no good reason to do it, is it licit (I would guess not)?
The answer is that although it is possible, it is absolutely forbidden to do so under any circumstances, even (for instance) to consecrate a host as Viaticum for a person about to die. This is set forth in the Code of Canon Law:
Can. 927 It is absolutely forbidden, even in extreme urgent necessity, to consecrate one matter without the other or even both outside the eucharistic celebration.
Quote:
This is a specific hypothetical, but in general, beyond some basics like knowing the words of consecration actually need to be said, I don't understand exactly what form and matter is required for this sacrament. Could someone enlighten me? Is there a comprehensive (or at least partial) list someone can give?
According to the Council of Florence (Bull of Union With the Armenians, 1449):
[The] matter [of the sacrament of the Eucharist] is wheat bread and wine from the vine, to which a very little water is added before the consecration.
The bread must be wheaten, not of any other grain, and is unleavened in the West, although leavened bread can be validly, though illicitly, consecrated. The wine must be fermented from grapes, and is to be mixed with a little water, although the sacrament can still be validly accomplished if this is omitted. And further:
The form of this sacrament are the words of the Saviour with which he effected this sacrament. A priest speaking in the person of Christ effects this sacrament. For, in virtue of those words, the substance of bread is changed into the body of Christ and the substance of wine into his blood. In such wise, however, that the whole Christ is contained both under the form of bread and under the form of wine, under any part of the consecrated host as well as after division of the consecrated wine, there is the whole Christ.
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Old Apr 6, '12, 2:44 pm
WarriorSheep WarriorSheep is offline
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Default Re: What exactly is the necessary form and matter of the Holy Eucharist?

Quote:
Originally Posted by grasscutter View Post
I'm not sure if I'm answering your actual question. The hosts that are distributed on Good Friday have been consecrated earlier and reserved.
Yes, both my dad and I understand this. The Good Friday service just made him curious, and now I'm curious too.


Quote:
Originally Posted by 1ke View Post
Can.* 927 It is absolutely forbidden, even in extreme urgent necessity, to consecrate one matter without the other or even both outside the eucharistic celebration.

Alright, so is the 'eucharistic celebration' identical to the Liturgy of the Eucharist said during Mass, or is it the whole of the Mass, or something else? Also, clearly this means consecrating one matter alone is illicit, but is it valid? Thanks, I love Canon references. I ought to just commit to reading it sometime.
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  #6  
Old Apr 6, '12, 2:50 pm
MarkThompson MarkThompson is offline
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Default Re: What exactly is the necessary form and matter of the Holy Eucharist?

Quote:
Originally Posted by WarriorSheep View Post
Alright, so is the 'eucharistic celebration' identical to the Liturgy of the Eucharist said during Mass, or is it the whole of the Mass, or something else? Also, clearly this means consecrating one matter alone is illicit, but is it valid? Thanks, I love Canon references. I ought to just commit to reading it sometime.
Canon 899 makes clear that the phrase refers to the entire liturgy of the Mass.
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Old Apr 6, '12, 2:52 pm
WarriorSheep WarriorSheep is offline
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Default Re: What exactly is the necessary form and matter of the Holy Eucharist?

Thanks Mark,

So then the form is only the words of consecration, but saying them (with the intention of consecrating) is totally illicit outside of the eucharistic celebration. I think I understand that now and why your example of the dying person is not allowed. I still would like to know what exactly the eucharistic celebration is though, as in my last post (before I saw yours).

Edit: Just saw it. If only I could type infinitely fast we wouldn't be out of phase
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  #8  
Old Apr 6, '12, 3:02 pm
MarkThompson MarkThompson is offline
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Default Re: What exactly is the necessary form and matter of the Holy Eucharist?

Quote:
Originally Posted by WarriorSheep View Post
So then the form is only the words of consecration, but saying them (with the intention of consecrating) is totally illicit outside of the eucharistic celebration.
Right.

Quote:
I still would like to know what exactly the eucharistic celebration is though, as in my last post (before I saw yours).
The Mass. I don't know why they chose this somewhat clumsy term for it -- presumably to emphasize the Eucharist as central to the Mass -- but this is clear if you look at the relation of canons in the 1983 Code using the term to canons in the 1917 Code that used "Mass" (among which is Canon 927).
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  #9  
Old Apr 6, '12, 3:18 pm
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beth40n2 beth40n2 is offline
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Default Re: What exactly is the necessary form and matter of the Holy Eucharist?

Good Friday is a communion service where all host were consecrated yesterday for consumption today. There is never a Mass on Good Friday!
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  #10  
Old Apr 6, '12, 3:46 pm
BrJuniper BrJuniper is offline
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Default Re: What exactly is the necessary form and matter of the Holy Eucharist?

Quote:
Originally Posted by WarriorSheep View Post
The background to this question is that earlier today (Good Friday), my dad asked something to the effect of, "So the service today isn't a Mass since the Eucharist isn't being consecrated, so you can't have a Mass without the consecration. Can you have a consecration without a Mass?" Now, 'Mass' in my understanding is 'Latin Rite' for Divine Liturgy, which is composed of several parts; Liturgy of the Word, Liturgy of the Eucharist, Communion Rite, etc. So I guess the question can be boiled down to "Can a priest ever celebrate the Liturgy of the Eucharist by itself?"

I don't know. If a priest did try it, even if there is no good reason for that to ever happen, would it validly consecrate the Eucharist? If valid, is there ever a reason for a priest to do this? If valid, but there is no good reason to do it, is it licit (I would guess not)?

This is a specific hypothetical, but in general, beyond some basics like knowing the words of consecration actually need to be said, I don't understand exactly what form and matter is required for this sacrament. Could someone enlighten me? Is there a comprehensive (or at least partial) list someone can give?

Thanks!!
Have a blessed Triduum and Eastertide!
NO NO NO
Eucharistic Liturgy may only be done within what we call Mass. If a priest wants to consecrate host outside that it would be valid but illicit. Also, should a priest leave out some of the prayers in the Eucharistic Prayer (like not pray for the laity) it invalidates the Mass. If I may ask how old are you and how old is your Father?
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