Where are our souls before the last day?

itullian · #1 Apr 9, '12, 11:49 pm

are the unredeemed in Hell already?

Qoeleth · #2 Apr 9, '12, 11:56 pm

Once we have died, we are outside the realm of time and space. There is no before and after- no waiting, no time. The Day of Judgment for each of us is an eternal reality, it is the day of death.

However, for a more literal answer to the topic- read 2 Esdras.

Gospel Man · #3 Apr 10, '12, 12:15 am

The saved go to heaven until the end of the tribulation period, Then they come back to reign with Jesus for 1000 years, Then after the judgment day, a New heaven and earth comes where we will live forever.

And the un-redeemed go to hell untill judgment day, Then they are cast into the lack of fire.

itullian · #4 Apr 10, '12, 12:50 am

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gospel Man

The saved go to heaven until the end of the tribulation period, Then they come back to reign with Jesus for 1000 years, Then after the judgment day, a New heaven and earth comes where we will live forever.

And the un-redeemed go to hell untill judgment day, Then they are cast into the lack of fire.

aren't Hell and the lake of fire the same?

Qoeleth · #5 Apr 10, '12, 2:07 am

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gospel Man

The saved go to heaven until the end of the tribulation period, Then they come back to reign with Jesus for 1000 years, Then after the judgment day, a New heaven and earth comes where we will live forever.

And the un-redeemed go to hell untill judgment day, Then they are cast into the lack of fire.

How do you know these thing?Surely, it's a metaphor.

**po18guy** · #6 Apr 10, '12, 3:17 am

Private interpretation of biblical prophecy is prohibited by the bible (2 Peter 1:20). We have a violation of that already in this thread. Beware of error.

NeedImprovement · #7 Apr 10, '12, 4:01 am

Quote:

Originally Posted by itullian

are the unredeemed in Hell already?

The short answer to your question is: Yes.

What helps to eliminate any confusion (as far as we are able to forsee here on earth) is when we can differentiate between the particular judgement, and the last judgement .

This page from the Catechism of the Catholic Church provides a more in-depth description and helps to define the difference between the two.

It's easier to grasp when it is all read in its context, but here are several excerpts from that same page differentiating between the particular judgement, and the last judgement :

Particular Judgement

Quote:

1022 Each man receives his eternal retribution in his immortal soul at the very moment of his death, in a particular judgment that refers his life to Christ: either entrance into the blessedness of heaven-through a purification or immediately, -- or immediate and everlasting damnation.

1035 The teaching of the Church affirms the existence of hell and its eternity. Immediately after death the souls of those who die in a state of mortal sin descend into hell, where they suffer the punishments of hell, "eternal fire." The chief punishment of hell is eternal separation from God, in whom alone man can possess the life and happiness for which he was created and for which he longs.

IN BRIEF

1051 Every man receives his eternal recompense in his immortal soul from the moment of his death in a particular judgment by Christ, the judge of the living and the dead.

. . .

Last Judgement/Final Judgement

Quote:

V. THE LAST JUDGMENT

1038 The resurrection of all the dead, "of both the just and the unjust," will precede the Last Judgment. This will be "the hour when all who are in the tombs will hear [the Son of man's] voice and come forth, those who have done good, to the resurrection of life, and those who have done evil, to the resurrection of judgment." Then Christ will come "in his glory, and all the angels with him. . . . Before him will be gathered all the nations, and he will separate them one from another as a shepherd separates the sheep from the goats, and he will place the sheep at his right hand, but the goats at the left. . . . And they will go away into eternal punishment, but the righteous into eternal life."

1039 In the presence of Christ, who is Truth itself, the truth of each man's relationship with God will be laid bare. The Last Judgment will reveal even to its furthest consequences the good each person has done or failed to do during his earthly life:

All that the wicked do is recorded, and they do not know. When "our God comes, he does not keep silence.". . . he will turn towards those at his left hand: . . . "I placed my poor little ones on earth for you. I as their head was seated in heaven at the right hand of my Father - but on earth my members were suffering, my members on earth were in need. If you gave anything to my members, what you gave would reach their Head. Would that you had known that my little ones were in need when I placed them on earth for you and appointed them your stewards to bring your good works into my treasury. But you have placed nothing in their hands; therefore you have found nothing in my presence."

1040 The Last Judgment will come when Christ returns in glory. Only the Father knows the day and the hour; only he determines the moment of its coming. Then through his Son Jesus Christ he will pronounce the final word on all history. We shall know the ultimate meaning of the whole work of creation and of the entire economy of salvation and understand the marvelous ways by which his Providence led everything towards its final end. The Last Judgment will reveal that God's justice triumphs over all the injustices committed by his creatures and that God's love is stronger than death.

1041 The message of the Last Judgment calls men to conversion while God is still giving them "the acceptable time, . . . the day of salvation." It inspires a holy fear of God and commits them to the justice of the Kingdom of God. It proclaims the "blessed hope" of the Lord's return, when he will come "to be glorified in his saints, and to be marveled at in all who have believed."

Gospel Man · #8 Apr 10, '12, 6:22 am

Quote:

Originally Posted by itullian

aren't Hell and the lake of fire the same?

Hell and the lake of fire are two different places.

The Hebrew word for "Hell" is, "Sheol", The Greek word is, "Hades".
The rich man in Lk 16: 19--31, Was in hell,,"Hades".

Jesus was the only one to use the word, "Gehenna" for hell, And He used it as the body and spirit/souls going there, Matt 5: 20. Matt 10: 28.
Both these words for hell is "Gehenna", Not hades.

Whereas only the Spirit/soul goes to hell, Acts 2: 27. & 31.
The Greek word for, "Hell" here is, Hades.
Two different Grek words, Two different meanings and two different places.

Rev 20: 14. says death and hell, "Hades" were cast into the lake of fire.

So the Bible proves they are two different places.

When the Bibles says the Spirit soul and body goes to the lake of fire, It mean the new resurercted body.

Gospel Man · #9 Apr 10, '12, 6:27 am

Quote:

Originally Posted by Qoeleth

How do you know these thing?Surely, it's a metaphor.

It isn't a metaphor, It is Biblical facts.

**po18guy** · #10 Apr 10, '12, 12:13 pm

Until Jesus ascended, there was the abode of the dead, or sheol. This was where the souls of the just abided until heaven was opened by Jesus at His ascension. In the Apostle's Creed, this is the place to which Jesus descended upon His death on the cross. Although it is sometimes called "hell" it is not the hell of the damned, which is the place of eternal punishment. Our Lord referred to sheol as "paradise". It is the place in which Lazarus was being comforted by Father Abraham in the parable. It is where our Lord and Dismas (the repentant thief on the cross) went immediately after their deaths. It is sheol where the Gospel was preached to the dead - those who were not already being punished eternally.

Joe Kelley · #11 Apr 11, '12, 5:49 pm

Souls are spirits; not material things. Thus they do not [can not] be said to occupy physical space. Until they are reunited with bodies they are described as occupying a spiritual state.

What is a spiritual state? I have no idea. But then I am a physicist and can't tell you what an electric, magnetic or gravitational field is. I can only describe to you their influence on physical bodies.

If I drop a book it falls to the floor [or if you prefer the book and the earth move distances inversely proportional to their mass until they meet.

] Why do they do that? Because of the interaction of their gravitational fields. What is a gravitational field? It is what make a dropped book fall to the floor.