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  #16  
Old May 2, '12, 7:07 pm
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IggyAntiochus IggyAntiochus is offline
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Default Re: Protestant vs. Orthodox to Catholicism

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nine_Two View Post
It was long enough ago that I don't remember exactly what I read. The article was in English, which is unlikely to be the language he used. All I know is that several Protestants I know took it as quite an insult (I'm not sure why they cared, they aren't the type to care what the Pope says, but they did).

I do remember the word "deficient" specifically was applied to Orthodox.
From what I remember, he called Protestant churches ecclesial communities, as opposed to actual churches. If he had called them heretics, it would have contradicted the Catechism, which states that only the original reformers were heretical and not those born into Protestant traditions.

The Protestants who cared seemed to be from the mainline liberal bodies. Conservatives, for the most part, said "Surprise, the Pope is Catholic."
  #17  
Old May 2, '12, 9:41 pm
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Default Re: Protestant vs. Orthodox to Catholicism

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Originally Posted by IggyAntiochus View Post
From what I remember, he called Protestant churches ecclesial communities, as opposed to actual churches. If he had called them heretics, it would have contradicted the Catechism, which states that only the original reformers were heretical and not those born into Protestant traditions.

The Protestants who cared seemed to be from the mainline liberal bodies. Conservatives, for the most part, said "Surprise, the Pope is Catholic."
Actually that was my own misuse of term. I meant to use the term heresy, not heretics. As you say, a heretic (in the Catholic understanding) would be one who left the faith to follow a heresy.

I think it was stronger than just saying ecclesiastical communities, but my memory has failed me before.
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  #18  
Old May 2, '12, 10:09 pm
Jacob50 Jacob50 is offline
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Default Re: Protestant vs. Orthodox to Catholicism

The beliefs of Catholics and Orthodox are pretty similar. They (the Orthodox) have the Eucharist. Protestants dont. That's a huge difference right there. Today some protestants have certain beliefs which are much more 100 times more problematic than papacy (for me the main issue between Catholics and Orthodox). For example a friend of mine told me Methodists use crackers and grape juice for their "communion". I dont expect Orthodox to do that.

Most protestants (if not all) hold to the bible alone. Orthodox have traditions.

Protestants dont have valid ordinations, Orthodox do. These things mentioned are big differences. I hold that the Catholic Church is the only true Church Christ founded and that therefore only we have the fullness of the faith. But Orthodox are close. Protestants are too far away. Many can disagree but I just see it that way.

So my opinion is that I think more energy should be put to try to convert a protestant than to convert an Orthodox. If an Orthodox brother mortally sins, he can go to confession. And God forgives him. But what does a protestant brother do if he mortally sins? They dont have confession (no valid priests). So therefore I consider them in more danger than the Orthodox. I dont mean to say that a protestant cant be forgiven by God, rather that the lack of the sacraments is very problematic. No valid ordinations, no Confession, no Eucharist.

Just my opinion.

-Jacob
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  #19  
Old May 2, '12, 11:11 pm
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Default Re: Protestant vs. Orthodox to Catholicism

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Originally Posted by IggyAntiochus View Post
Yes, He did say that specifically. If the world hates you, remember that it hated me first. He makes it quite obvious that He's speaking about the world in opposition to those who believe in Christ.

Yes, He desired we be one; I don't see that as relevant to you comparing His statements about unbelieving humanity to differences between baptized Christians.
Heretics are part of this world, aren't they?
  #20  
Old May 3, '12, 6:29 am
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Default Re: Protestant vs. Orthodox to Catholicism

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Originally Posted by po18guy View Post
Heretics are part of this world, aren't they?
Yes. However, since your own church doesn't lay the charge of being heretics against those who are not in communion with the Roman bishop, I don't see how that's relevant.
  #21  
Old May 3, '12, 7:52 am
silverdenali silverdenali is offline
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Default Re: Protestant vs. Orthodox to Catholicism

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Originally Posted by po18guy View Post
"Do not think that I have come to bring peace - but (rather) a sword!" "Remember, if the world hates you, it hated Me first"
Agree with the Lutheran's refutation. Also said to love your enemy.
  #22  
Old May 3, '12, 12:49 pm
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Default Re: Protestant vs. Orthodox to Catholicism

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Originally Posted by IggyAntiochus View Post
Yes. However, since your own church doesn't lay the charge of being heretics against those who are not in communion with the Roman bishop, I don't see how that's relevant.
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Originally Posted by silverdenali View Post
Agree with the Lutheran's refutation. Also said to love your enemy.
Let's turn the flame down just a bit. It is not 'my" Church or "yours" It is the Church founded by Christ for our mutual salvation. We remain members in an imperfect communion with one another.

I type a lot of things and some of them make sense. If they do not, then kindly point them out, or simply disregard them.

My long-lost original point in posting those two quotes of our Lord was to point out that many hate the pope, and that belief in Christ will produce division. I use "hate" as in "prefer less" as our Lord spoke.
  #23  
Old May 3, '12, 1:14 pm
silverdenali silverdenali is offline
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Default Re: Protestant vs. Orthodox to Catholicism

It is what it is. I'll guess most average Orthodox Christians or Protestant don't have much contempt for the Papacy. I thought it was a bit of an over the top knee jerk Scripture quoting that comes off as insecure. I get Orthodox & Protestant opinions on the office itself. You can use the Scriptures to justify the it's right existence easier than Protestants cram a square peg in to a round hole IMHO. Just thought those weren't the quotes to get the job done & were reminiscent of the ugly Christian IIYAM.

No big deal.
  #24  
Old May 3, '12, 3:09 pm
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Default Re: Protestant vs. Orthodox to Catholicism

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Originally Posted by po18guy View Post
My long-lost original point in posting those two quotes of our Lord was to point out that many hate the pope, and that belief in Christ will produce division. I use "hate" as in "prefer less" as our Lord spoke.
I understand what you're driving out, po. However, when dealing with the words of the Creator, it's best to use them in their proper context of those who hate Christ opposing those who love Him. They shouldn't be used for the purposes of highlighting divisions among those who mutually love Him.
  #25  
Old May 4, '12, 9:57 am
silverdenali silverdenali is offline
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Default Re: Protestant vs. Orthodox to Catholicism

Quote:
Originally Posted by IggyAntiochus View Post
I understand what you're driving out, po. However, when dealing with the words of the Creator, it's best to use them in their proper context of those who hate Christ opposing those who love Him. They shouldn't be used for the purposes of highlighting divisions among those who mutually love Him.
Quoted for truth.

There is SO MUCH in common that is completely overlooked so we can yell at each other.

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