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  #1  
Old May 12, '12, 5:51 pm
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SeanF1989 SeanF1989 is offline
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Default The Church and Communism/Socialism

On Youtube someone has sent me comments telling me that the Church and the Pope, support these, I respond with quotes from Pope's criticizing and denouncing Communism and Socialism the he/she responds with see Pius XI's list of errors.

How do I respond?
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  #2  
Old May 12, '12, 6:31 pm
sw85 sw85 is offline
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Default Re: The Church and Communism/Socialism

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Originally Posted by SeanF1989 View Post
On Youtube someone has sent me comments telling me that the Church and the Pope, support these, I respond with quotes from Pope's criticizing and denouncing Communism and Socialism the he/she responds with see Pius XI's list of errors.

How do I respond?
That is a total non sequitur. You don't respond to it at all. You don't have to engage every anti-Catholic ignoramus on the Web, you know.
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  #3  
Old May 12, '12, 6:37 pm
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MikeDunphy MikeDunphy is offline
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Default Re: The Church and Communism/Socialism

Quote:
Originally Posted by SeanF1989 View Post
On Youtube someone has sent me comments telling me that the Church and the Pope, support these, I respond with quotes from Pope's criticizing and denouncing Communism and Socialism the he/she responds with see Pius XI's list of errors.

How do I respond?
Pope Pius XI clearly opposed communism and socialism. See his encyclical Quadragesimo anno:

"Socialism, if it remains truly Socialism, even after it has yielded to truth and justice on the points which we have mentioned, cannot be reconciled with the teachings of the Catholic Church because its concept of society itself is utterly foreign to Christian truth."
"... no one can be at the same time a good Catholic and a true socialist".

"Communism ...is incredible and portentlike in its cruelty and inhumanity. The horrible slaughter and destruction through which it has laid waste vast regions of eastern Europe and Asia are the evidence; how much an enemy and how openly hostile it is to Holy Church and to God Himself is, alas, too well proved by facts and fully known to all."

Pope Pius did oppose exploitation of workers. Your correspondent on youtube may be equating the good pope's support of decent wages and working conditions with socialism. Or he may even have seen various propositions condemned by the pope and mistakenly thought they were ideas endorsed by the pope.
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  #4  
Old May 12, '12, 7:13 pm
Bartolome Casas Bartolome Casas is offline
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Default Re: The Church and Communism/Socialism

This is much more complicated than most people say. If you have 2 or 3 years you want to devote to studying this issue, then go ahead. Otherwise, let other handle this. You are not God. You can't be everywhere and do everything. You have limits. So do I.
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  #5  
Old May 12, '12, 7:58 pm
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Samuel63 Samuel63 is offline
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Default Re: The Church and Communism/Socialism

I wanted to offer another viewpoint.

Some people just want to pick a fight and their minds are closed to objective truth - the truth most fully contained in the Catholic Church.

You can spar with them but it almost always leads to no real fruit except in one respect, it provides good opportunity for us to practice apologetics.

Why not go ahead and debate a little. It helps us to sharpen our skills. If we make a few mistakes along the way - who cares. The other person is not even close to ready for conversion. In any case, they may only remember what we got right, with a little help from the Holy Spirit.

Go at'em!
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  #6  
Old May 13, '12, 5:11 pm
FaithBuild18 FaithBuild18 is offline
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Default Re: The Church and Communism/Socialism

Yeah Youtube sucks. I can't stand it. It makes me lose hope in the future of our civilization. It is literally majority atheistic gay rights social liberals.

I was well aware of the existence of such people, but they are such a dominating force on Youtube that it's jaw dropping.

These are New Atheists. They hate, hate, hate, absolutely hate anything religious. They are religiously anti-religious, and make southern baptist creationists look like the most open-minded beings in the universe, THAT'S how narrow-minded these New Atheists are. They are not very rational individuals, and I find it is best to leave them alone. There is nothing more precious in the galaxy than their own tiny brains with which they conduct ritualistic incantations of "logic" in an attempt to outsmart God. Their vast fallacies and inabilities to comprehend anything outside the realm of junior high science ranks these hardhearted angry ignoramuses among the most illogical members of our society.
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  #7  
Old May 13, '12, 5:22 pm
Robert Sock Robert Sock is offline
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Default Re: The Church and Communism/Socialism

Just because the Vatican looked down on socialism/communism in the past does not mean that it will in the future. We are living in a world of drastic change, and it's possible that the Vatican will have to change its political views.
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  #8  
Old May 13, '12, 6:23 pm
St Francis St Francis is offline
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Default Re: The Church and Communism/Socialism

Quote:
Originally Posted by Robert Sock View Post
Just because the Vatican looked down on socialism/communism in the past does not mean that it will in the future. We are living in a world of drastic change, and it's possible that the Vatican will have to change its political views.
Robert,
I am only writing this to clarify to readers who may not know any better: you have been shown the documents condemning socialism and communism (a form of socialism) over and over. The Church has condemned these political systems for intrinsic flaws, the denial of the rights of people to the fruits of their labor. The systems are inherently unjust.

There is no possiblity that "the Vatican will have to change its political views."
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  #9  
Old May 13, '12, 6:23 pm
Mickey Finn Mickey Finn is offline
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Default Re: The Church and Communism/Socialism

Quote:
Originally Posted by SeanF1989 View Post
On Youtube someone has sent me comments telling me that the Church and the Pope, support these, I respond with quotes from Pope's criticizing and denouncing Communism and Socialism the he/she responds with see Pius XI's list of errors.

How do I respond?
Da, comrade.
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  #10  
Old May 13, '12, 6:35 pm
St Francis St Francis is offline
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Default Re: The Church and Communism/Socialism

Quote:
Originally Posted by SeanF1989 View Post
On Youtube someone has sent me comments telling me that the Church and the Pope, support these, I respond with quotes from Pope's criticizing and denouncing Communism and Socialism the he/she responds with see Pius XI's list of errors.

How do I respond?
1. Ask for their sources. WRT socialism and communism, the only thing I can think that they could bring up is Liberation Theology, which has been condemned by the Vatican.

Whenever someone says something outlandish about the Church, ask them for their sources. A lot of times they will be unable to respond, or respond with some ridiculously anti-Catholic source.

2. Excellent to respond with quotes from the popes I don't know why the other person would respond with the Syllabus of Errors...

3. The policy I try to stick to is to explain the Church's position. I will answer questions regarding clarification, maybe enter into some debate, but I try to remember to stay away from "trying to win." This is because I know that they have different criteria for proof--if they are atheists, they deny miracles because they go against nature, when the point of miracles is that they are God's superceding nature!

Also, all debate against Catholicism seems, in my experience, to boil down to authority. If they completely reject God's authority, or the Catholic Church's authority, then we can't get anywhere. So I know I can't "win" or "prove" anything in their eyes...

And remember that guy who wouldn't go to bed because "someone was wrong on the Internet." Sometimes we have to leave some of the correcting to others
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