What Christian Denominations Support Gay Marriage? - Page 4

**PRmerger** · #46 May 14, '12, 4:47 am

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wiljo2050

Peace would never challenge your beliefs!The question I ask what if protestants who disagree with catholic doctrine would come out with banning catholic marriage?What if you didnt believe in mixed race marriage does this give you the right to legislate against it?What about someone that started a business created many jobs but hated religion,should we shut his business down for his unbelief?What about a muslim gets beat up for her faith by a proffesing christian,should we legislate against christians?What about Atheists should we legislate against them?What about hitler calling Jews robbers,and Christ killers?Are not most people followers of what they are born with?Were do we draw the line?Can we disagree and coexist?Can we hang on to are beliefs and respect those that have differnces with us?

Of course we can disagree and coexist!

On some things.

That are opinions.

For example, you may believe that Christina Aguilera is the bee's knees. Someone else may say that Charlotte Church is her gal.

Disagree and coexist!

You may hope that Bella goes for that vampire guy; someone else may want her to end up with the werewolf guy.

Disagree and coexist!

HOWEVER! When it comes to morality and what's right and wrong, we simply cannot tolerate some "opinions".

For example, I would never just "disagree and co-exist" with...

(wait for it, CMatt, wait for it...)

the Reverend Fred Phelps, who professes such vile, odious hatred against people, claiming that God hates <fill in the blank with some group of people>.

Joseph Kony, who wants to "purify" the Ugandan people by abducting children and teaching them to murder.

No, I will stand up and fight against such beliefs!

Woolybabe · #47 May 14, '12, 8:33 am

Quote:

Originally Posted by SaintPatrick333

Please don't take this as slander against your friend but is it not hypocritical enough that he is "serving" Christ while being openly gay? Granted he might not actually be sinning at all assuming he is living a celibate life. But if he is "seeing" another man than what he is doing is an offense to God and if he truly loves Christ he will quit his ministry and choose either to live celibately with Christ or live in sin with his partner and stand against Christ. After all, one can not both be with Christ and live in sin. We all must choose one over the other,

I fully agree with you, but although I count him as a friend he is more my mum's friend, so I am not really close enough to him to feel that I can discuss this with him. So although I do feel the same way as you (he has a boyfriend) I accept him the way he is. He knows that the bible says it is wrong, but I am going along with "If anyone is without sin let him cast the first stone" I have sins that I battle with, I have had sins in the past that I have battled with and at the moment I seem to be winning the battle (for example I can't remember the last time I self harmed). I knew what I was doing was wrong, but the compulsion to do so felt so strong. So I do understand how my friend can feel torn in two by wanting to serve Christ, but also wanting to be with his partner. They are both lovely men, So I leave it to the fact that they know what the bible says, and they are the ones that have to face Jesus and face the consequences. Love the sinner but hate the sin. I hope that people do the same to me, when I sin. I want to thank you for your honesty and I did not take offence at your comment (ie when you said don't take it as slander) and I know that what I have written might seem defensive, I don't mean it as that I am just trying to explain that I do fully see your point, but don't feel free enough to discuss it with him, especially as the only time I have contact with him is when my mum is there as well, and she is not a christian at all and she would find my views offensive. so thanks again for your honesty

O Duirnin · #48 May 14, '12, 9:25 am

Quote:

To your list of gay supporting churches we can add the PCUSA (Presbyterian).

The Church of Scotland, their mother Church, has said it does not support the present efforts of the Scottish Government to change the definition of marriage here, although it has refused to condemn gay clergy (while not actively supporting them either). Smaller Presbyterian denominations such as the Free Church of Scotland have taken a more active anti-gay marriage line.

**JonNC** · #49 May 14, '12, 2:45 pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Usige

That depends on which group of Lutherans you are talking about. The ELCA (Evangelical Lutheran Church in America) has supported (allowed?) same sex "marriage" since 2009 I beleive. The more conservative LCMS (Lutheran Church Missouri Synod) still teaches that homosexual behavior is "intrinsically sinful" and does not support same sex unions.

Not exactly, regarding the ELCA. They have not come out in favor of same sex "marriage". They do allow for gay clergy who are in a "committed relationship", but do not call it marriage. In fact, my understanding is that heterosexual clergy receive no such permission, as they must be married, not just in a "committed relationship".
Not defending it. They are plain wrong.

Jon

**JonNC** · #50 May 14, '12, 2:50 pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nicea325

Yep! Lets push an agenda over God! Truly sad!

That's exactly right! That's the motivation. When I was ELCA, it was my biggest complaint: the leftist political agenda.

Jon

CMatt25 · #51 May 14, '12, 4:04 pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by PRmerger

For example, I would never just "disagree and co-exist" with...

(wait for it, CMatt, wait for it...)

the Reverend Fred Phelps

PR

Seeing me suddenly interjected into your post along with Fred cracked me up! Thanks for the laugh! I'm still laughing as I'm typing this.

(For those unfamiliar, it's a thing with PR and I. She likes talking about him to me A LOT)

**Holly3278** · #52 May 14, '12, 4:07 pm

I think the United Church of Christ and some Episcopalians support this.

**PRmerger** · #53 May 14, '12, 4:54 pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by CMatt25

PR

Seeing me suddenly interjected into your post along with Fred cracked me up! Thanks for the laugh! I'm still laughing as I'm typing this.

(For those unfamiliar, it's a thing with PR and I. She likes talking about him to me A LOT)

Daniel1Catholic · #54 May 14, '12, 6:15 pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by peace2u2

Can you tell me what Christian denominations support homosexuality, gay marriage and the adoption of children in a SSM?

Also, do the ministers of these Christian denominations have Bibles that omit God's Word regarding same and if not than how do they justify homosexuality if they read God's Word that says they should not?

Thanks.

No true Christian will go against the teaching of Christ. Therefore, no Christian denomination allows these things.

Why not ask which denomination allows lying or murder? There all sins.

Pax

Roy5 · #55 May 14, '12, 6:49 pm

Someone has asked why some Protestant groups accept gay marriage. There are various arguments.

Probably the main one is that many churchmen have become convinced that homosexuality is established at birth by the genes, etc. Some would include early enviromental influences, too. In any case, this means that some men and women have a natural same-sex attraction, something innate, beyond their control. This is part of their very nature. Some would even say that this must be God-given. In any case, if this is the way certain people are born it is essentially Christian to treat them equally, which means freedom to marry, etc.

(I do not agree with calling it marriage, but have reached the point of approving of civil unions.)

There also is the related argument that this is a matter of equal rights, just as legislation regarding African-Americans was. Many believe that in 50 years we will look back and see the gay movement for equality as justified as that of African-Americans..

How critical should Catholics be of all this when the Church has had such a homosexual mess among its own clergy, leading to serious predatory activity aimed mainly at teenage boys? In fact, one Catholic I know - well-informed - thinks that probably a third of the priests are gay, that gays are attracted to the priesthood for several reasons, among them: (1) a desire to escape this temptation by pledging to be celibate; (2) ordination keeps relatives and others from asking when you will get married; (3) a cover for homosexuality; (4) the attraction of an all-male fraternity; and (5) the aesthetics of the mass, the vestments, etc.

Some Protestants also would argue two other points:

Jesus never mentioned homosexuality.

Yes, homosexual activity is sharply condemned in scripture. In fact, gays were to be stoned to death (Lev. 20:13). Do we really advocate that? Others to be killed include witches, rebellious sons, any woman who marries and is found not to be a virgin, and anyone who worships a God other than Jehovah (Ex. 22:20). Fathers can even sell their daughters into slavery, too.

In a word, if we get literal about the Bible and homosexuality - wow! lots of men and women out that should be put to death.

Now, would Christ approve of that, when the core of his message was to love one another. He also warned us to beware of judging, and he had this habit of hanging out with such outcasts of society as Samaritans, prostitutes and tax collectors.

I disgree with the churches who support gay marriage, but I understand their deep desire to demonstrate the love of Christ - and I respect it.

**PRmerger** · #56 May 14, '12, 6:59 pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Roy5

I disgree with the churches who support gay marriage, but I understand their deep desire to demonstrate the love of Christ - and I respect it.

Catholicism does demonstrate the love of Christ to homosexuals.

Not allowing them to marry is not an illustration of hatred towards them any more than not allowing men to marry 2 women portrays a hatred towards men.

Wiljo2050 · #57 May 14, '12, 8:43 pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by ltwin

This really isn't about respecting differences. No one is saying that you can't have sex with someone of the same gender if you want. This is a free country. But don't ask us to call something holy that God has called sinful. Most Christians are simply trying to stay faithful to scripture and the received tradition of the church. Both are clear: homosexual acts are sinful. Those who are tempted by homosexual desires must do what all Christians are expected to do: live lives of chastity in singleness and faithfulness in marriage. The majority of Christians continue to adhere to what marriage was always believed to be. There are some Christians, following secular culture, who now wish to change the definition of marriage. They are wrong for doing so.

It is not "respecting differences" and "coexisting" with homosexuals to tell them that God is pleased by their sin. If we love all people, then we should be honest with them: man is sinful and our sin separates us from God. It is only through the grace and forgiveness offered to us by Christ that any of us can be saved. Homosexual actions, just as heterosexual actions committed outside of the bonds of holy matrimony, are sinful acts. To deny that reality is to lie to anyone and everyone who struggles with such desires. Ultimately, we are enabling them to continue in sin, separate from God. How is that love? How is that respect? How is that coexisting?

Wiljo2050 · #58 May 14, '12, 8:58 pm

You Only partly said What I am Saying" Go ahead and speak your mind freely.even if people disagree!But should we legislate against people that dont have same values as long as their not hurting other people?Do we legislate against people that dont have same religion?Lots of people think they are right,If they obey our laws and pay taxes who is anyone?What about people that have serious issues with catholic church does that give them the right to appeal catholic marriage or abolish it because its against their beliefs?What I am saying are all people equal as any catholic even though its the true religon?Can we grant only certain laws and exclude others from the same law because we disagree with them?Havent we all fallen short?

CMatt25 · #59 May 14, '12, 9:01 pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Roy5

Jesus never mentioned homosexuality... In fact, gays were to be stoned to death (Lev. 20:13). Do we really advocate that? Others to be killed include witches, rebellious sons, any woman who marries and is found not to be a virgin, and anyone who worships a God other than Jehovah (Ex. 22:20). Fathers can even sell their daughters into slavery, too.

In a word, if we get literal about the Bible and homosexuality - wow! lots of men and women out that should be put to death.

Now, would Christ approve of that, when the core of his message was to love one another. He also warned us to beware of judging, and he had this habit of hanging out with such outcasts of society as Samaritans, prostitutes and tax collectors.

I disgree with the churches who support gay marriage, but I understand their deep desire to demonstrate the love of Christ - and I respect it.

Excellent post Roy. Great points. Jesus spoke a lot more about the poor than He did these social issues that have so many finding themselves dwelling on. I honestly do not get the priorities sometimes that some people seem to have. He spoke a lot about love and peace too.

Also for just another of many for instances, if we get literal about the Bible saying women should not speak in churches, well a lot of women, Catholic women included, would not be speaking in churches.

Yet I attended a Catholic Mass yesterday. There was a woman on the altar reading aloud. Many were responding aloud in prayer and for intentions. There were some women who even spoke to me, "peace be with you".

Peace be with you & with all who journey on their walks of faith.

vsedriver · #60 May 14, '12, 9:17 pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wiljo2050

But should we legislate against people that dont have same values as long as their not hurting other people?

Does gay marriage hurt other people? I say yes. It does hurt other people. If gay marriage is the equal of hetero marriage than it will be unlawful to discriminate against gay couples in adoptions. Where does this hurt people? It hurts children by deliberately depriving them of the natural human experience of a mother and a father. This isn't about the quality of parenting but about an experience nature designed for us all. It denies that there is something unique to masculinity and femininity that a child should grow up with.