Your side on masturbation - Page 6

SacreCoeurJMJ · #76 Jun 23, '12, 11:35 am

masturbation does not relieve this lust, it actually makes it worse. The more one masturbates, the more one thinks about it and desires it (hence the addictions to it). It is a totally selfish act, sex is for showing your spouse how much you love them, therefor masturbation destroys love, and makes us treat ourselves and others like objects. Procreation is a fantastic gift from God , do not misuse it. I can not judge whether it is mortal or venial in a particular circumstance for another person, but it is Grave Matter!
I am no expert, but masturbation is obviously wrong. You must be able to feel in your heart that this is wrong, and if not, trust the Catholic Church.

xSteven · #77 Jun 25, '12, 7:18 am

Quote:

Originally Posted by SacreCoeurJMJ

masturbation does not relieve this lust, it actually makes it worse. The more one masturbates, the more one thinks about it and desires it (hence the addictions to it). It is a totally selfish act, sex is for showing your spouse how much you love them, therefor masturbation destroys love, and makes us treat ourselves and others like objects. Procreation is a fantastic gift from God , do not misuse it. I can not judge whether it is mortal or venial in a particular circumstance for another person, but it is Grave Matter!
I am no expert, but masturbation is obviously wrong. You must be able to feel in your heart that this is wrong, and if not, trust the Catholic Church.

What if I don't desire it, it's like a stress ball. I only do it to relieve stress. I don't lust during it or anything. It seems like I lust, and think more badly in a wetdream than masturbating.

sw85 · #78 Jun 25, '12, 7:27 am

Quote:

Originally Posted by xSteven

What if I don't desire it, it's like a stress ball. I only do it to relieve stress. I don't lust during it or anything. It seems like I lust, and think more badly in a wetdream than masturbating.

The act itself is disordered whether you lust or not. What we mean by disordered is "contrary to the normative order." The normative order is that the sexual faculty is ordered toward procreation and should be used in an appropriate manner, i.e., intravaginal ejaculation of a man into a woman, without steps taken for the purpose of sterilization, in the context of marriage. God didn't give you your sexual faculty so you could pleasure yourself all day, but so that you could get your wife pregnant and unite yourself to her more fully in love.

Sin is just disorder knowingly and willfully acted upon. So it's always a sin to do this.

xSteven · #79 Jun 25, '12, 7:41 am

Quote:

Originally Posted by sw85

The act itself is disordered whether you lust or not. What we mean by disordered is "contrary to the normative order." The normative order is that the sexual faculty is ordered toward procreation and should be used in an appropriate manner, i.e., intravaginal ejaculation of a man into a woman, without steps taken for the purpose of sterilization, in the context of marriage. God didn't give you your sexual faculty so you could pleasure yourself all day, but so that you could get your wife pregnant and unite yourself to her more fully in love.

Sin is just disorder knowingly and willfully acted upon. So it's always a sin to do this.

I understand this but what about the disease "bluebals" some people have to masturbate to not get that. That's not me. You know wetdreams and masturbating are like the same. Most of the time before I ejaculate in a wetdream I can try to stop it but I lust even more in a wetdream than even masturbating.

bilop · #80 Jun 25, '12, 7:44 am

Quote:

Originally Posted by xSteven

I understand this but what about the disease "bluebals" some people have to masturbate to not get that. That's not me. You know wetdreams and masturbating are like the same. Most of the time before I ejaculate in a wetdream I can try to stop it but I lust even more in a wetdream than even masturbating.

That "disease" is nonsense; simply an excuse to justify immoral behavior, or a crude lie by men to coerce women into sleeping with them,

The two are not the same at all. In a dream you can not give consent of the will, so no sin is possible.

God Bless

sw85 · #81 Jun 25, '12, 7:57 am

Quote:

Originally Posted by xSteven

I understand this but what about the disease "bluebals" some people have to masturbate to not get that. That's not me. You know wetdreams and masturbating are like the same. Most of the time before I ejaculate in a wetdream I can try to stop it but I lust even more in a wetdream than even masturbating.

As has been said, it's not a disease. It's not even a real thing. By the way, even the rumor says that blueballs arises from unfulfilled, inordinate sexual desire, i.e., a man gets close to orgasm and then is denied it. So even if it were true, the solution would not be to masturbate, it would be to stop exciting yourself inordinately.

Even if it did exist and was a real thing, it wouldn't change anything. Human nature is still ordered the way it is. If you really need release (while awake), you need to be married.

Wet dreams and masturbating are, again, not the same thing. I said as much earlier. Masturbation is an act of the will. Wet dreams are an involuntary reflex at a time when your will is inactive or at least severely impaired. There is no sin in having a wet dream.

xSteven · #82 Jun 28, '12, 3:11 pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by sw85

As has been said, it's not a disease. It's not even a real thing. By the way, even the rumor says that blueballs arises from unfulfilled, inordinate sexual desire, i.e., a man gets close to orgasm and then is denied it. So even if it were true, the solution would not be to masturbate, it would be to stop exciting yourself inordinately.

Even if it did exist and was a real thing, it wouldn't change anything. Human nature is still ordered the way it is. If you really need release (while awake), you need to be married.

Wet dreams and masturbating are, again, not the same thing. I said as much earlier. Masturbation is an act of the will. Wet dreams are an involuntary reflex at a time when your will is inactive or at least severely impaired. There is no sin in having a wet dream.

Alright but i'm a teenager. I have high testosterone levels and I get excited easily and stay excited for awhile and while that i lust and stuff. The only way to get rid of the testosterone level is ejaculating. I can't do that only if i sleep and if it happens that night. It doesnt every day.

Also I understand that you should be using your parts with another person in marriage, but some people dont masturbate for pleasure or stuff like that. It's more like a stress releaser. No lusting involved just a time to get away.

I still see no sin it.

SacreCoeurJMJ · #83 Jun 28, '12, 4:53 pm

I hope I can convince you by explaining the error in each of your arguments as best i can. I have already asked Mary to help you, and the Holy Spirit to guide me in helping you.

THE ENDS DON'T JUSTIFY THE MEANS - relieving yourself of stress by killing someone isnt okay, just like masturbating to get rid of stress is not.

1) Masturbation makes us more lustful. This is an indisputable fact, the more a person eats, the more of an appetite they have. Remember God gave us our sexuality for two purposes 1. to create new life, and 2. for unitive purposes (bring husband and wife together. Masturbation serves neither of these purposes.
2)There is no sin in a wet dream your will is impaired. We may be spilling seed, but God designed mens sexuality in this way, there is no sin in this.
3)Can stress not be handled in other means? Masturbation is just going to make you want to do it again and again, and then feel more guilty, and more stressed out. The reason you could not focus on anything but lustful thoughts is because masturbation causes these. Quit now before it is too late. These thoughts and temptations are going to haunt you all the time.
4). Masturbation creates lust and addiction like crazy. look up wwwTheporneffect.com. It will tell you about the addictiveness of these sins. All of our sins effect each other, my sins effect you, and your sins effect me. Everytime you masturbate, you harm all of humanity.
Did you know that original sin was most likely a contraceptive act? The only rule God had was to be fruitful and multiply. Most likely the two committed a contraceptive act, and God sent them from paradise. You are committing a contraceptive act.
5) Most importantly, you already know the answer deep down. Satan is trying to keep you from realizing it. Say the prayer to St. Michael the Archangel. Ask Him, and ask God to remove all demons from tampering with you. You feel guilty about this, otherwise you would not be on this site asking this question. You feel guilt because your conscience is trying to tell you something.
Again, i am no expert. I can not tell you if it is mortal for you, only a good priest could.
Keep strong in your faith and know that i love you and you are in my prayers. Someday, hopefully, we will meet in Heaven
Peace brother!

xSteven · #84 Jun 28, '12, 7:58 pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by SacreCoeurJMJ

I hope I can convince you by explaining the error in each of your arguments as best i can. I have already asked Mary to help you, and the Holy Spirit to guide me in helping you.

THE ENDS DON'T JUSTIFY THE MEANS - relieving yourself of stress by killing someone isnt okay, just like masturbating to get rid of stress is not.

1) Masturbation makes us more lustful. This is an indisputable fact, the more a person eats, the more of an appetite they have. Remember God gave us our sexuality for two purposes 1. to create new life, and 2. for unitive purposes (bring husband and wife together. Masturbation serves neither of these purposes.
2)There is no sin in a wet dream your will is impaired. We may be spilling seed, but God designed mens sexuality in this way, there is no sin in this.
3)Can stress not be handled in other means? Masturbation is just going to make you want to do it again and again, and then feel more guilty, and more stressed out. The reason you could not focus on anything but lustful thoughts is because masturbation causes these. Quit now before it is too late. These thoughts and temptations are going to haunt you all the time.
4). Masturbation creates lust and addiction like crazy. look up wwwTheporneffect.com. It will tell you about the addictiveness of these sins. All of our sins effect each other, my sins effect you, and your sins effect me. Everytime you masturbate, you harm all of humanity.
Did you know that original sin was most likely a contraceptive act? The only rule God had was to be fruitful and multiply. Most likely the two committed a contraceptive act, and God sent them from paradise. You are committing a contraceptive act.
5) Most importantly, you already know the answer deep down. Satan is trying to keep you from realizing it. Say the prayer to St. Michael the Archangel. Ask Him, and ask God to remove all demons from tampering with you. You feel guilty about this, otherwise you would not be on this site asking this question. You feel guilt because your conscience is trying to tell you something.
Again, i am no expert. I can not tell you if it is mortal for you, only a good priest could.
Keep strong in your faith and know that i love you and you are in my prayers. Someday, hopefully, we will meet in Heaven
Peace brother!

Yes I understand what your saying. My heart says it's a sin but my logic says it's not. I dont strive for masturbation it's just when my testosterone levels are high idk what to do like i just lust and i hate it, also when im stressed idk what to do. I just freak out and it gets me stressed even more.

SacreCoeurJMJ · #85 Jun 28, '12, 8:35 pm

Your last argument makes no sense, just because these desires can be strong doesnt make it not sinful. If someone killed a sibling of mine, just because of the intense feelings i have, doesnt make it okay to kill the murderer.

Just quit the logical argument, put your faith in God, and the Church His Son instituted on this earth. Feelings are strong, we can overcome them. Trust me, the more you give into your lust, the more you will become enslaved to it.

austenbosten · #86 Jun 28, '12, 11:34 pm

It's a sin but I still do it. I ain't gonna sugar-coat it and try and justify it...what I am doing is wrong.

My reason for doing so...because it simply is just too much of a hassle. When abstaining, it hurts terribly when I pee. I am always "leaking", when the semen drys and I go to get up or move around...it feels like a Band-Aid is being ripped off the tip of my part. I have trouble sleeping with a full erection and most importantly I'm tired of semen stains on my pants...it's not convenient when you're out in public and (like a woman on her period with no tampon or pad)...you have to worry about a wet stain in front of your pants.

I have worked on cutting down, but I still do it from time to time because I really don't want to deal with the issues I've listed, however I ain't gonna stand and say "oh it's okay for me..." no it's not and I accept the actions I've taken.

Not Sure · #87 Jun 29, '12, 10:48 am

Quote:

Originally Posted by xSteven

Yes I understand what your saying. My heart says it's a sin but my logic says it's not. I dont strive for masturbation it's just when my testosterone levels are high idk what to do like i just lust and i hate it, also when im stressed idk what to do. I just freak out and it gets me stressed even more.

I used to justify drug usage the same way when I was younger. Then "I put away childish things" and gave in to the teachings of the Church.

Masturbation is a mortal sin (well, it is grave matter, and you seem to be doing it with full consent and full knowledge). It is a sin, because it is a sexual act. And sexual acts are only permitted within marriage, between the married couple. You are taking pleasure in a way that is disordered and separated from God's plan. Come back to the Church.

jfitzgerald · #88 Jul 2, '12, 1:49 pm

Hi... I wonder if one of the senior members here could answer a question for me..
I am a middle-aged women whose husband had a mild stroke 18 months ago, and it's really affected our sex life. We have been married for over 30 years, and we used to make love several times a week, but now we have sex about once every six weeks, and it generally lasts less than a minute or two.
This is due in part to side effects of my husband's medications, and also due to the fact that my husband now suffers from slight dementia brought on by reduced blood flow to the brain, which has resulted in personality changes and paranoia; one of the ways that he "gets back at me" for imaginary slights and infractions against him is to withhold sex.
ANYHOW, I still have a healthy sex drive, and I wouldn't think of cheating on my husband or anything like that - it's not his fault that he's ill - but (and I'm sorry if this sounds crude) is it a mortal sin for me to masturbate and bring myself to orgasm after we have sex ?

davidv · #89 Jul 2, '12, 1:55 pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by jfitzgerald

Hi... I wonder if one of the senior members here could answer a question for me..
I am a middle-aged women whose husband had a mild stroke 18 months ago, and it's really affected our sex life. We have been married for over 30 years, and we used to make love several times a week, but now we have sex about once every six weeks, and it generally lasts less than a minute or two.
This is due in part to side effects of my husband's medications, and also due to the fact that my husband now suffers from slight dementia brought on by reduced blood flow to the brain, which has resulted in personality changes and paranoia; one of the ways that he "gets back at me" for imaginary slights and infractions against him is to withhold sex.
ANYHOW, I still have a healthy sex drive, and I wouldn't think of cheating on my husband or anything like that - it's not his fault that he's ill - but (and I'm sorry if this sounds crude) is it a mortal sin for me to masturbate and bring myself to orgasm after we have sex ?

From the church's definition of masturbation:

Quote:

2352 By masturbation is to be understood the deliberate stimulation of the genital organs in order to derive sexual pleasure. "Both the Magisterium of the Church, in the course of a constant tradition, and the moral sense of the faithful have been in no doubt and have firmly maintained that masturbation is an intrinsically and gravely disordered action."138 "The deliberate use of the sexual faculty, for whatever reason, outside of marriage is essentially contrary to its purpose." For here sexual pleasure is sought outside of "the sexual relationship which is demanded by the moral order and in which the total meaning of mutual self-giving and human procreation in the context of true love is achieved."139

it seems to me that what you propose is not allowed.

Catholic80 · #90 Jul 2, '12, 9:32 pm

You might want to read Fr. Groeschel's book, "The Courage to be Chaste."

It's very good and it covers a lot of what you mention... wet dreams, lustful thoughts, and such. Fr. Groeschel makes a clear distinction between involuntary moments (such as during sleep) and auto eroticism (what we commonly refer to as masturbating).

It sounds like you are trying to justify masturbating because it is such a strong addiction. Yes, masturbation is a sin and a highly disordered sin at that. It's a common problem, but that doesn't make it any less grave.