My life

[JRKH]

We are too far removed to be be able to say whether you are being overly concerned....

What I CAN say is that, given all the pressure you are under right now, you sense of fear is in a heightened state. You are right on the edge....and whether real or not...this concern is just one more evidence of the need for you to step back...

Peace
James

[momof3inOR]

Well, I just don't know how to step back. I really don't.

He turned down freelance work (1 thousand dollars) so we could go out to dinner. He really wanted to have a "relaxing night because work is stressing him out". He doesn't understand stress.

I woke up early this morning and started writing again. And all he wants to know is if it's close to done...

[JRKH]

Originally Posted by momof3inOR

Well, I just don't know how to step back. I really don't.

He turned down freelance work (1 thousand dollars) so we could go out to dinner. He really wanted to have a "relaxing night because work is stressing him out". He doesn't understand stress.

Well maybe he will when his wife is in the mental hospital due to a breakdown....

I woke up early this morning and started writing again. And all he wants to know is if it's close to done...

I hope this is not the erotica....

Peace
James

[momof3inOR]

No it's not erotica. I changed it to romance after the wonderful advice I received here.

I guess my question is.. What choice do I have? If I simply stop working these side jobs.. We won't make our bills. And I have been there before and he doesn't step up to cover for me.

I know it's a viscous cycle.. But how do I simply stop if I know it will only mean more financial turmoil? Life will only be worse...

I keep daydreaming about finding a real man who would fight for his family.

[JRKH]

Originally Posted by momof3inOR

No it's not erotica. I changed it to romance after the wonderful advice I received here.

I guess my question is.. What choice do I have? If I simply stop working these side jobs.. We won't make our bills. And I have been there before and he doesn't step up to cover for me.

I know it's a viscous cycle.. But how do I simply stop if I know it will only mean more financial turmoil? Life will only be worse...

I keep daydreaming about finding a real man who would fight for his family.

You are a bright, intelligent, well educated woman....
There can be little doubt but that you know what needs to be done in your particular situation.

Things ARE going to get worse before they get better...The only choice you have in this matter is whether you are going to be in some sort of control or not.

I am about to be blunt - - Call it tough love - - - you can take this for what it's worth from someone who has seen this happen....

As it stands right now - you have zero control over the situation.

You keep working until you break down. Do you think he will stand by you while you are in hospital and then, after you come home, will he support you and care for you and make sure you have your rest and your meds and you doctor's appointments etc???
OR - after you come home from hospital will he just start pushing at you again to do more and more...
There won't be fewer bills, there will be more....There won't be less pressure on you, there will be more....The doctors won't be able to help you in this....they will only be able to advise...

His past behavior makes it abundantly clear....Your past behavior also makes it abundantly clear that you are headed for a train wreak.
You cannot change his behavior...ALL YOU CAN DO is change your own behavior. Make the decisions that you have to make and that you know you have to make.

We can't do any more for you than to keep telling you what you already know....

You are doing him no favor by supporting his immature nature. This is not love.

I will share that, in my past relationship, my wife - though bright, personable and capable, could not hold down a job. She would complain about "being stuck at home", about not having any money except what I gave her and so forth...but she would not keep a job...
Until (for other reasons) I finally left. THEN, she not only kept a part time job that she happened to be working, but went and got a better job and managed quite well on her own (as did I). We were much better apart than we were together.

I know this is scary. With kids it is even MORE scary. But ----- The train wreak is coming....the question is - - - - Are you going to have any control on when and how it happens and how hard you hit and how much damage (to you and your kids) is incurred...

Peace
James

[momof3inOR]

This is all true. Very true. It is hard to remove the blinders. A part of me still says... If only this book takes off... I'll have another source of passive income. I keep hoping ... Just like he does.. That I can find the answer.

Here's the thing ... In trying to get control... I struggle to determine what is reasonable and what isn't. My husband started a new job a couple of months ago. He thinks he has to wear dress slacks everyday etc instead of khakis. He has been purchasing new clothes and most of them are dry clean only. Our dry cleaning bill has jumped significantly. I don't think he needs those types of clothes... He is a photographer. Not an executive. He told me today he also needs new dress shoes. He does use coupons etc but this is all NEW expenses.

So what is reasonable?

And private school? We've already put 1000 dollars down and he says "too late to back out now....". However it would be far cheaper to go with the public school... In the long run. He says "you are the one who has been so adimant that he get a catholic education". He's right.. I have been. So there is a lot of passive aggressive stuff going on and I do feel partly to blame/responsible.

I just wish I could see this situation clearly.... Like an objective person.

[EasterJoy]

Originally Posted by momof3inOR

This is all true. Very true. It is hard to remove the blinders. A part of me still says... If only this book takes off... I'll have another source of passive income. I keep hoping ... Just like he does.. That I can find the answer.

Here's the thing ... In trying to get control... I struggle to determine what is reasonable and what isn't. My husband started a new job a couple of months ago. He thinks he has to wear dress slacks everyday etc instead of khakis. He has been purchasing new clothes and most of them are dry clean only. Our dry cleaning bill has jumped significantly. I don't think he needs those types of clothes... He is a photographer. Not an executive. He told me today he also needs new dress shoes. He does use coupons etc but this is all NEW expenses.

So what is reasonable?

And private school? We've already put 1000 dollars down and he says "too late to back out now....". However it would be far cheaper to go with the public school... In the long run. He says "you are the one who has been so adimant that he get a catholic education". He's right.. I have been. So there is a lot of passive aggressive stuff going on and I do feel partly to blame/responsible.

I just wish I could see this situation clearly.... Like an objective person.

A thousand dollars in is cheaper than a thousand dollars a month, no matter how you slice it. The problem is that he may have signed you on for the whole ten months. Go to the principal (or pastor) and explain the situation, to find out what your actual options are with regards to the school, rather than your imagined options.

Normal people can't get into a stressful marital situaiton and "see the situation clearly." That's why they seek marriage counselling....for the same reason that sensible lawyers aren't their own lawyers and sensible doctors aren't their own doctors. There is no shame in that!!

[JRKH]

Originally Posted by momof3inOR

This is all true. Very true. It is hard to remove the blinders. A part of me still says... If only this book takes off... I'll have another source of passive income. I keep hoping ... Just like he does.. That I can find the answer.

Here's the thing ... In trying to get control... I struggle to determine what is reasonable and what isn't. My husband started a new job a couple of months ago. He thinks he has to wear dress slacks everyday etc instead of khakis. He has been purchasing new clothes and most of them are dry clean only. Our dry cleaning bill has jumped significantly. I don't think he needs those types of clothes... He is a photographer. Not an executive. He told me today he also needs new dress shoes. He does use coupons etc but this is all NEW expenses.

So what is reasonable?

And private school? We've already put 1000 dollars down and he says "too late to back out now....". However it would be far cheaper to go with the public school... In the long run. He says "you are the one who has been so adamant that he get a catholic education". He's right.. I have been. So there is a lot of passive aggressive stuff going on and I do feel partly to blame/responsible.

I just wish I could see this situation clearly.... Like an objective person.

You struggle to determine what is reasonable????

Honey the dollar signs say it all...You are not the US government and cannot continue to spend more than you make. PERIOD...You cannot work yourself to death trying to satisfy his desires because I will guarantee you that he will continue to spend what you both make plus a little bit....
And frankly it sounds like you have not been much better....But at least you recognize the problem and he doesn't....he doesn't know what it is doing to you - or he doesn't care.

What is reasonable is to stay within a budget and hopefully one that allows you to save a little. If he is unwilling to do this... there is no hope of salvaging this....The train wreck will be a bad one....

It really is that simple....

NOTE:
I have no doubt but that you have been a contributor to this crisis in more ways than one. I recall in my own experience how I fed into the problems...
But what happens is that one person matures and recognizes the problems and if the other person does not - That's where the problem lies.
It seems that you are the person who is recognizing the coming train wreck and he is oblivious to it...Unless he can come to see this too there is nothing you can do as a couple...

Of course he will bring up things that you have said and done that were not the wisest...but when he brings these up say "Yes and that was a mistake." Or say "I still think that is important but then something else has to give...."
In any event - it takes the two of you working together - it can't be just one mature person and one immature person....

Peace
James

[momof3inOR]

Thanks, jrkh. I really appreciate everyone's feedback.

Honestly my biggest fear is that my husband will lose his job. If he does.., we will lose 75k a year. If that happens we will be in really bad shape.

I am very mindful of what I say to him and I don't want to tell him that ... But he has to know its a concern. His boss threatened a 30 day action plan a few weeks ago and he's still in the 90 day probation window. The boss has not followed through with it but that is not something that weighs positively in his favor.

How do I delicately dance around that?

[momof3inOR]

Not going to lie... If I did what was best financially right now... It would disrupt a lot. We just got into a year lease on a house. If we bail, I'm certain we will be sued. Also if I moved me and the kids into an apt.. I would truly disrupt their lives. They love their new house that my husband absolutely adores.

We all love it... But yes.. It's expensive. I wasn't so concerned until this latest meeting with my husbands boss. If he gets let go... We are screwed.

As for the cars... We both need vehicles to get to work. Like most these days.. We are upside down on our loans which extend for 2 more years. Dave Ramsey suggests one avoids repossession ....

I just feel stuck. What options do we have?

[JRKH]

I have to say that my level of sympathy is somewhat reduced....
The MOST that my wife and I ever earned together is right at $78k for one year. That was the last year that she worked - 1998.
After that we lived quite nicely on between $45-$48K - no complaints.

Today (since 2007) - we live on less than $23k from all sources....And my wife has been suffering from Alzheimer's - seriously - since 2007 and now she is almost totally bedridden and I have trouble getting her to eat - she may not last out the year (God's will be done).

Still - we own our house (but with a mortgage) drive a 12 yo car, shop for clothes at the goodwill and everything else at discount stores etc...

Now - let's contrast this.....
You say your husband makes 75K right now AND has the opportunity to freelance....at something like 1K a pop....You are also a working professional and make. I assume, a reasonably good salary....Is that correct? So you guys are pulling down something over $110K per year?? Is that a reasonable assumption??

And you find yourselves in dire financial straits with this sort of income?????????

Forgive me for venting like this - - - but frankly - you both need a serious does of reality....and you are getting it now...

You ask above, "How do I delicately dance around" your husband's trouble at work. Well - frankly you don't...you charitably lay out the facts...and expect this "grown up man" to take them in, inegrate them and act appropriately on them.
You explain to him that:

• The financial situation is bleak - that serious steps are necessary and that both a short term AND long term plan must be devised and implemented to get a handle on things...Pursuant to that...
• He had better do whatever it takes to keep this job (short of committing sin).
• That he had better learn to shop at the goodwill for any clothes he might need and that shoe polish can do wonders for old shoes....
• Cable is a luxury item that you can no longer afford
• As much as you would love to send the kids to Catholic School it is impossible due to the poor financial decisions you and he have made. The kids will have to go to public School and receive their religious education at home and at CCD.
• You explain that, as soon as the lease is up on this house you are going to need to downsize...to something more affordable.
• When the leases are up on the cars, at least one of you will need to get a cheaper, used car...
• Date nights are fine - but they will have to be at home since eating out is too expensive
• If free lance opportunities come up he is to take them - period....A "date night" at the expense of sorely needed income is of no use...It only adds stress to an already stressful situation.

I'm sure that if I knew more about your situation that I could offer more...

Perhaps right now there is nothing you can do about this mess....
But STILL a good sound plan - a budget - and a commitment to sticking to the plan can go a long way towards relieving tension - and then building a good sound foundation for your future....

I'm not sure if I should continue posting here...It's very frustrating and I know that I am being quite blunt and perhaps not very charitable....
...but I can't help it...

You and your husband are trapped in a materialistic view of things that is making it nearly impossible for you to recover....This is one of satan's most popular and successful traps...Consider how you were actually beginning to write erotica - to commit mortal sin - in order to support this addiction to "stuff" to "Mammon"....
PLEASE consider carefully what I have said....

If you find my posts offensive or you are unable to bear them or if I am completely off base...Just tell me so and I will drop off the thread with no hard feelings.

Peace
James

[KnitNut]

If he loses his job, then the nanny has to go, too. And housekeepers and anyone else you've hired - the person not working will be doing the cooking & cleaning, period. (That alone might motivate him to keep a decent job.) Pay the early lease termination fee on one of the cars, and pick up a used-but-works vehicle for cash (a cheap one, not a Mercedes). Talk to the landlord about your lease - if the rental market is good, he should have no problem finding new tenants, freeing you to downsize. Yes, it disrupts your kids' lives (again) but let this be a lesson for the future. In the meantime, it's what needs to happen...

I don't remember seeing any mention of credit cards - I hope you've been able to avoid that trap.

It is going to take a RADICAL change, both in spending habits and in mindset, to sort this out and get your family back on safe, stable footing.

I also agree 100% with JRKH's posts. Call your priest, ask for his recommendation for a financial/credit counselor. Explain your situation to your priest (in particular the paralyzed mindsets and the attachment to material possessions at the expense of family peace and financial responsibility). Objective, 3rd party guidance will help you formulate (and CARRY OUT) the best plan for your family. Also, spell it out for your therapist (is the appointment soon?). He/she may have referrals for you as well. But if you're not candid with these people about your reality, they can't help and guide you as effectively.

[momof3inOR]

First off jrfk I am SO sorry about your wife. It's awful to hear what you have been going through. I'm very sorry. And thanks to all of you for what you have said.

Yes my husband makes 75k and I make more. But that is why I really wanted to be able to downsize and save more. Now, I know that most won't believe this, but do you know that someone who makes 140 thousand a year, brings home 6k a month. I know that is still substantial, but after taxes and healthcare in my state .. That's a huge reduction! Our lease is 3400 a month and 2 car payments... And you can see ... That's just making ends meet. (in this current..situation). We have racked up credit card debt from the time that my husband wasn't working. We don't have any extra cash to spare. Maybe 3 thousand for an emergency. We can't use that to pay off our cars.

My husband and I grew up in very different scenarios. I grew up on a farm and have been working since I was 13. I am still paying off college loans and my parents never had car loans etc.

My husband's parents are very frugal these days, but times were tight for them because his father didn't work for some time. He had his own business and couldn't handle it.

I wish I could just "go back home" in some ways. My mom and my sis and her family's lifestyles are so simple. They aren't exposed to the kind of stress that I am and I just wish sometimes.. That my life were different. My job will always be stressful and come with certain expectations (nice clothes etc) but sometimes the grass isn't always greener. They have a VERY simple life. To me... It looks pretty darn good.

[Kelfa28]

Originally Posted by momof3inOR

First off jrfk I am SO sorry about your wife. It's awful to hear what you have been going through. I'm very sorry. And thanks to all of you for what you have said.

Yes my husband makes 75k and I make more. But that is why I really wanted to be able to downsize and save more. Now, I know that most won't believe this, but do you know that someone who makes 140 thousand a year, brings home 6k a month. I know that is still substantial, but after taxes and healthcare in my state .. That's a huge reduction! Our lease is 3400 a month and 2 car payments... And you can see ... That's just making ends meet. (in this current..situation). We have racked up credit card debt from the time that my husband wasn't working. We don't have any extra cash to spare. Maybe 3 thousand for an emergency. We can't use that to pay off our cars.

My husband and I grew up in very different scenarios. I grew up on a farm and have been working since I was 13. I am still paying off college loans and my parents never had car loans etc.

My husband's parents are very frugal these days, but times were tight for them because his father didn't work for some time. He had his own business and couldn't handle it.

I wish I could just "go back home" in some ways. My mom and my sis and her family's lifestyles are so simple. They aren't exposed to the kind of stress that I am and I just wish sometimes.. That my life were different. My job will always be stressful and come with certain expectations (nice clothes etc) but sometimes the grass isn't always greener. They have a VERY simple life. To me... It looks pretty darn good.

There is no reason why it can't be done!

My husband and I make a combined 60k a year.
He works and puts things up on EBay.

I'm a SAHM and I go to school full time. I also bring home, in a year, about half what you make a month in drill pay. That's it.

However, we have a house and two cars and a TON of savings. In actuality my husband and I could pay our mortgage just fine and put food on the table for almost 2 years, without help, if we both stopped working (which is about to happen because he is getting laid off this fall).
Of course we'd have to give up cable, my Iphone, eating out and no more treats like beer, sweets and anything new.

It's a total lifestyle change. I can't imagine having a new car...or wanting a new car.
I haven't bought new clothes for myself in a year.
I cloth diaper and make my own, reusable, wipes at home. I use baking soda and vinegar to clean the house and do some laundry with it.

Before we bought our house...my husband and I had a small apartment and we owned no good furniture.
All of it...everything...was free and second hand. We had no dining table (just tv trays) and only one small couch that seated three. No other chairs.
Our bed was my grandmother's 30 year old spare bed that was just a mattress and box spring on the floor.

Sure, entertaining was really tough...but we saved and made it work. We were finally able to buy better furniture when we bought the home. It's not top end but it's nice.

Another big thing...we have no debt...none! I have no loans for school (thank-you US military), our cars are either paid off (mine) or used and paid in full (his) and we pay off anything we put on the credit cards either in one or two months.

Desperate times call fir desperate measures.

EBay everything you don't need...including the furniture. Eat on the floor with paper plates if you have to.
Get rid of the cable and use Hulu and Netflix, which is only $8.00 a month for the instant version. Or don't bother with that...go totally without and use the library.
Use the money you make and save to pay down debt.

No more date night, no more $5.00 coffees, no more gym memberships. Cut up your credit cards.
Get rid of the smart phones and get a simpler phone with a cheaper plan. My husband spends about $40 a month on his cheap phone.
Disenroll your kids...tomorrow...eat that grand if you have to but forget the private school.

You say you want a simple life...you can have one! Either take the advice or don't...everyone has given some great ideas on how to save money...put these tips to use.

[KnitNut]

You can have a simple life *and* make big $. This is what I mean when I suggest in your situation it's as much (if not more) an issue of mindset as it is an issue of budget shortfall.