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  #16  
Old Aug 14, '12, 8:46 pm
TimothyH TimothyH is offline
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Default Re: Why leave behind 99? Parable lost sheep Mt 18

The parable in the OP does not say that the sheep were unprotected, but only that they were left "in the hills." The 99 were probably not left alone.

Shepherds often combined flocks for greater safety. When shepherds wanted to seperate their flock from the larger group, they would simply walk in one direction and command the sheep to follow and their own flocks would would follow their voice. Here in the west we typically drive sheep, the same way cattle are driven, but sheep in many parts of the world are tended by actual shepherds and their flocks know their shepherd's voice and follow where he goes.
Amen, amen, I say to you, whoever does not enter a sheepfold through the gate but climbs over elsewhere is a thief and a robber. But whoever enters through the gate is the shepherd of the sheep. The gatekeeper opens it for him, and the sheep hear his voice, as he calls his own sheep by name and leads them out. When he has driven out all his own, he walks ahead of them, and the sheep follow him, because they recognize his voice. But they will not follow a stranger; they will run away from him, because they do not recognize the voice of strangers. (John 10:1-5)
Here is a picture of small sheepfold. Many were much larger and made with stone walls. Several shepherds may have combined flocks and shared a single sheepfold. In the parable above, Jesus says that there was a gatekeeper. It is likely that the 99 sheep were guarded.





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Last edited by TimothyH; Aug 14, '12 at 8:57 pm.
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  #17  
Old Aug 15, '12, 3:25 pm
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IrishRush IrishRush is offline
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Default Re: Why leave behind 99? Parable lost sheep Mt 18

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Originally Posted by atassina View Post
it doesn't feel very loving when you are the abandoned and isolated one, deeply hurt.
I understand that. Truly.
But this isn't about what you're feeling, it's about the fact that God loves you SO much that he gave his only Son to save you.
If you feel abandoned and isolated, try to objectively look at why. Who has stepped away in the relationship? You or God? See Matthew 28:20 for the answer to that.
God bless you atassina, and bring you into His loving embrace. I pray that you feel the divine and loving presence of the Holy Spirit, heart and soul. God does love you - Jesus suffered because He loves you so much. Trust in that - heck, revel in that! No one will ever love you as much as Jesus. We're so blessed.
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  #18  
Old Aug 16, '12, 1:04 pm
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atassina atassina is offline
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Default Re: Why leave behind 99? Parable lost sheep Mt 18

irishrush:
I really am writing to find out for a friend. i felt frustrated because i didn't know how to answer him. thanks for the prayers
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  #19  
Old Aug 16, '12, 1:28 pm
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Nelka Nelka is offline
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Default Re: Why leave behind 99? Parable lost sheep Mt 18

You have 100 children.

99 are safely tucked up in their beds. (Only a three bedroom house).

One is missing in the streets somewhere.

Would you go out and look for your missing child?
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  #20  
Old Aug 16, '12, 3:11 pm
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atassina atassina is offline
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Default Re: Why leave behind 99? Parable lost sheep Mt 18

return and read the scripture passage in my original quote. the shepherd left the sheep in the hills and not in a manger
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  #21  
Old Aug 16, '12, 3:31 pm
SonCatcher SonCatcher is offline
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Default Re: Why leave behind 99? Parable lost sheep Mt 18

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Originally Posted by atassina View Post
return and read the scripture passage in my original quote. the shepherd left the sheep in the hills and not in a manger
sheep sleep on the hills.
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  #22  
Old Aug 16, '12, 4:15 pm
Evan Evan is offline
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Default Re: Why leave behind 99? Parable lost sheep Mt 18

Recognize how sheep are counted. As they enter through the gate into the paddock, each is counted (1 2 3 ... boring and puts you to sleep). Only after such a count would you know one is missing. So close the gate. Now the 99 are safe. You can go and search for the lost one.

Assuming that the shepherd can look at the flock and one is missing assumes the flock is 5 or 6 sheep. Then you would not need to count. But with 99, you have to count as they move into an enclosure.
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  #23  
Old Aug 17, '12, 3:38 am
LegoGE1947 LegoGE1947 is offline
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Default Re: Why leave behind 99? Parable lost sheep Mt 18

Quote:
Originally Posted by Evan View Post
Recognize how sheep are counted. As they enter through the gate into the paddock, each is counted (1 2 3 ... boring and puts you to sleep). Only after such a count would you know one is missing. So close the gate. Now the 99 are safe. You can go and search for the lost one.

Assuming that the shepherd can look at the flock and one is missing assumes the flock is 5 or 6 sheep. Then you would not need to count. But with 99, you have to count as they move into an enclosure.
What if the shepherd miscounts?
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  #24  
Old Aug 17, '12, 4:49 am
Oldtimer_7 Oldtimer_7 is offline
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Default Re: Why leave behind 99? Parable lost sheep Mt 18

One of the hallmarks of parables was that there was always something included that would not have happened in real life. This was a standard feature in Jewish storytelling. A good example is the deuterocanonical book of Judith. No place exists in Israel that fits the geopraphy of the locale of the book. The point is that Judith is not history, like 1 Maccabbees, but is to be understood for its story, not as a travelogue.
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  #25  
Old Aug 17, '12, 9:32 am
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atassina atassina is offline
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Default Re: Why leave behind 99? Parable lost sheep Mt 18

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Originally Posted by LegoGE1947 View Post
What if the shepherd miscounts?
the shepherd won't miscount. i used to live in Tanzania, East Africa; they count with the right side of their brain. they simply watch the herd come in. the watching forms a picture in their mind. if the picture is not complete, they know one or two or three of the sheep are missing; in the Tanzania case it would have been cows.

the point here is that different people and different cultures act differently.
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  #26  
Old Aug 17, '12, 4:15 pm
LegoGE1947 LegoGE1947 is offline
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Default Re: Why leave behind 99? Parable lost sheep Mt 18

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Originally Posted by atassina View Post
the shepherd won't miscount. i used to live in Tanzania, East Africa; they count with the right side of their brain. they simply watch the herd come in. the watching forms a picture in their mind. if the picture is not complete, they know one or two or three of the sheep are missing; in the Tanzania case it would have been cows.

the point here is that different people and different cultures act differently.
Seems to me that would take more patience and concentration than I have!
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  #27  
Old Aug 17, '12, 4:45 pm
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Julia Mae Julia Mae is offline
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Default Re: Why leave behind 99? Parable lost sheep Mt 18

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Why leave behind 99 sheep? Would you leave behind 99 children to find one? It appears the shepherd is being irresponsible.
The parable illustrates something Jesus has said elsewhere: "I came to call sinners." Jesus didn't seek out all the righteous and speak to them, He sought out the lowliest, and those who lived in sin and ate with them and preached to them and died for them.

The lost sheep needs saving, not the ones safely in the sheephold. He goes to them because:

.
Quote:
In just the same way, it is not the will of your heavenly Father
that one of these little ones be lost."
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  #28  
Old Aug 17, '12, 5:36 pm
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atassina atassina is offline
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Default Re: Why leave behind 99? Parable lost sheep Mt 18

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Originally Posted by LegoGE1947 View Post
Seems to me that would take more patience and concentration than I have!
If you looked at a puzzle and saw that it was missing one piece would that take much patience? No, that is how it works with right brain thinking. either the picture is complete or it isn't.
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  #29  
Old Aug 18, '12, 4:45 pm
LegoGE1947 LegoGE1947 is offline
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Default Re: Why leave behind 99? Parable lost sheep Mt 18

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Originally Posted by atassina View Post
If you looked at a puzzle and saw that it was missing one piece would that take much patience? No, that is how it works with right brain thinking. either the picture is complete or it isn't.
It might take more patience than I have to FIND the missing piece
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  #30  
Old Aug 20, '12, 8:12 pm
bmonk bmonk is offline
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Default Re: Why leave behind 99? Parable lost sheep Mt 18

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Why leave behind 99 sheep? Would you leave behind 99 children to find one? It appears the shepherd is being irresponsible.
I think all the parables have something wonky going on to make us think and ask, "What is going on here?"

The king with the unforgiving servant (Mt 18:21-35) forgives a debt of 10,000 talents, some $100,000,000 or thereabouts in silver. Try convincing your banker to write of a debt like that. The lamp in Mark 4:21 is lit and then put under a bed or under a basket. The farmer of Mk 4: 26-29 sows the seed, and then goes about his other business. Apparently he has no concern for the field. The farmer of Matthew 13:24-30 not only is paranoid--he thinks an enemy sowed weeds in his field--but the enemy actually did it! And then he lets them grow together until harvest, without weeding. If you look, all the parables are unrealistic in some ways. The unjust judge fears the widow will do him harm!

It's similar here. We call it "The Good Shepherd," but consider: he loses a sheep, and when he find it, he doesn't take it back to the flock, but goes home and tells all the neighbors and throws a party. No shepherd would admit, unless pressed, to losing a sheep--his good care for them was his reputation as a shepherd. No, it's about God's concern for the sinner over the "righteous", as he explains in Luke 15:7.

I think it relates to the fact that, as long as we are "good enough" for heaven--in our own eyes--we have no real need of God and God's grace. It's only when we recognize how lost we are that we turn to God. Look a St. Paul for a good example of this. He was a Pharisee, and made every effort to "do it right", to keep God's will in every particular, to the best of his knowledge and his will. However, on the road to Damascus, he realized that all his zeal and effort had only brought him to act against God, to persecute the very group God was using to save the world and spread the Good News of salvation. Only when he realized that his efforts led him to be a sinner, could he repent and join the Church and find the salvation he sought.
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