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  #16  
Old Feb 16, '17, 6:31 pm
Absolvo Absolvo is offline
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Default Re: Mother Miriam

Quote:
Originally Posted by Memaw View Post
Maybe that's the problem, us "cradle" Catholics are just to lax in knowing and living our Catholic Faith properly. We "rationalize" and cater to our liberial society to much. Jesus would NEVER do that!! God Bless, Memaw
By the same token, someone who has an extreme take on Catholic teachings can interpret the canon in an extreme and unskillful way.

The canon teaches that a mother should be a good mother to her children. No disputing that.

But does the canon say that being a good mother means you're forbidden from spending a few hours a week at an exercise class, or any activity that takes you away from your children for even a short time?

It does not. But that was precisely Mother Miriam's unequivocal advice to a caller.

This is why I encourage listeners to her show to always double check her advice with their priest or with the catechism and canon. Just because advice is extreme does not make it useful or appropriate to the faceless person calling her show, not to mention the hundreds of people who are listening in.
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  #17  
Old Feb 16, '17, 6:38 pm
Absolvo Absolvo is offline
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Default Re: Mother Miriam

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Originally Posted by Mary Estelle View Post
She has lot all her "seed vocations." This, and if she is extreme in her advice, may be why her Bishop has asked her to "move on" and that he does not see her new community moving forward.
Can I ask where you heard this? I can't find mention of it on the net.
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  #18  
Old Feb 16, '17, 10:08 pm
Absolvo Absolvo is offline
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Default Re: Mother Miriam

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Originally Posted by Todd977 View Post
If by "living with a man out of wedlock" you mean "an unmarried man and an unmarried woman having sexual intercourse," then that is fornication, a grave sin. According to Jesus Christ, it ranks right up there with murder and adultery. (Matthew 15:19; Mark 7:21) If it is done with the free consent of the will, knowing full well that it is a grave sin, then it is a mortal sin which, if not repented of before death, will result in the fornicator's eternal damnation or, as the Catholic Bible says, "... as for ... fornicators, their lot shall be in the lake that burns with fire and brimstone, which is the second death. (Revelation 21:8)

Humbly admonishing the sinner has long been regarded in the Catholic Church as a meritorious spiritual work of mercy. From the Baltimore Catechism:
Q. 813. Which are the chief spiritual works of mercy?

A. The chief spiritual works of mercy are seven: To admonish the sinner, to instruct the ignorant, to counsel the doubtful, to comfort the sorrowful, to bear wrongs patiently, to forgive all injuries, and to pray for the living and the dead.

Q. 814. When are we bound to admonish the sinner?

A. We are bound to admonish the sinner when the following conditions are fulfilled:

1.When his fault is a mortal sin;
2.When we have authority or influence over him, and
3.When there is reason to believe that our warning will not make him worse instead of better. (source)
Notice it says, under certain circumstances, we are "bound" to admonish the sinner which means we ourselves commit a sin if we do not admonish the sinner.
Yes,but what is the extent of that admonishment? That's something the canon doesn't go into. Certainly doesn't say anything about barring children from a relative's house, or forbidding his girlfriend from entering the house.

If my co-worker is a sinner, should I "admonish" him by yelling at him every day? Bug him at lunch? Tape descriptions of hell and put them on his windshield? Maybe all my free time should be given to be given to such activities, as there are a lot of sinners in this world.

But then, why don't we see any priests doing these "outreach" activities? Well, because it's extreme.

Now, we can all differ with each other on what's appropriate loving admonishment and what's simply too much, but as for MM's directive to bar visits to the grandfather's house, that is a directive that simply doesn't exist in Catholic teaching. Rather, it's MM's personal interpretation, her own idea of how to admonish the sinner.

This is what callers to her show should know -- Mother Miriam's pastoral advice is often not direct Church teaching, but rather her own interpretation of how to implement broad church teachings.
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  #19  
Old Feb 17, '17, 5:01 am
Memaw Memaw is offline
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Default Re: Mother Miriam

Quote:
Originally Posted by Absolvo View Post
By the same token, someone who has an extreme take on Catholic teachings can interpret the canon in an extreme and unskillful way.

The canon teaches that a mother should be a good mother to her children. No disputing that.

But does the canon say that being a good mother means you're forbidden from spending a few hours a week at an exercise class, or any activity that takes you away from your children for even a short time?

It does not. But that was precisely Mother Miriam's unequivocal advice to a caller.

This is why I encourage listeners to her show to always double check her advice with their priest or with the catechism and canon. Just because advice is extreme does not make it useful or appropriate to the faceless person calling her show, not to mention the hundreds of people who are listening in.
Sounds like you have a serious ax to grind against Mother Miriam that seems extreme. Maybe she hit a nerve or something!! God Bless, Memaw
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  #20  
Old Feb 17, '17, 11:17 am
Absolvo Absolvo is offline
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Default Re: Mother Miriam

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Originally Posted by Memaw View Post
Sounds like you have a serious ax to grind against Mother Miriam that seems extreme. Maybe she hit a nerve or something!! God Bless, Memaw
I don't think so. I feel for the people out there who have personal or family problems, and who tune in to Mother Miriam radio show, believing her advice is sound Catholic pastoral teaching.

It's obvious that many of her callers know very little about Catholicism, and believe she's an authority on that topic, as well as all matters of personal and family life.

But as I've said before, her advice tends to be quite extreme, particularly in matters regarding family life.

Everyone is free to make up their own minds about the value of her advice. But as I've noted before, a review of her advice against what's written in the catechism and the canon reveals that Mother Miriam tends to conflate Catholic teachings with her own personal opinion of how to follow those teachings.

Why does she do this? I believe it has something to do with her own personal history.

She's told us that when she became a Christian, her family was so outraged that they literally spit on her, and barred her from any family gatherings for years.

Does Mother Miriam's extreme family background impact her family advice to callers? It might.

But again, all I'm saying is that it's wise for her listeners to not blindly accept her admonitions as necessarily being standard Catholic pastoral guidance.

Double check the catechism, and talk to your priest.
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  #21  
Old Feb 17, '17, 2:05 pm
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gracepoole gracepoole is online now
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Default Re: Mother Miriam

Quote:
Originally Posted by Memaw View Post
Maybe that's the problem, us "cradle" Catholics are just to lax in knowing and living our Catholic Faith properly. We "rationalize" and cater to our liberial society to much. Jesus would NEVER do that!! God Bless, Memaw
Or we've lived through many seasons as Catholics (not just those during which we're on fire with faith) and recognize the importance of meeting people where they are when preaching God's laws.
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  #22  
Old Feb 17, '17, 2:24 pm
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JharekCarnelian JharekCarnelian is offline
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Default Re: Mother Miriam

Quote:
Originally Posted by Todd977 View Post
If by "living with a man out of wedlock" you mean "an unmarried man and an unmarried woman having sexual intercourse," then that is fornication, a grave sin. According to Jesus Christ, it ranks right up there with murder and adultery. (Matthew 15:19; Mark 7:21) If it is done with the free consent of the will, knowing full well that it is a grave sin, then it is a mortal sin which, if not repented of before death, will result in the fornicator's eternal damnation or, as the Catholic Bible says, "... as for ... fornicators, their lot shall be in the lake that burns with fire and brimstone, which is the second death. (Revelation 21:8)

Humbly admonishing the sinner has long been regarded in the Catholic Church as a meritorious spiritual work of mercy. From the Baltimore Catechism:
Q. 813. Which are the chief spiritual works of mercy?

A. The chief spiritual works of mercy are seven: To admonish the sinner, to instruct the ignorant, to counsel the doubtful, to comfort the sorrowful, to bear wrongs patiently, to forgive all injuries, and to pray for the living and the dead.

Q. 814. When are we bound to admonish the sinner?

A. We are bound to admonish the sinner when the following conditions are fulfilled:

1.When his fault is a mortal sin;
2.When we have authority or influence over him, and
3.When there is reason to believe that our warning will not make him worse instead of better. (source)
Notice it says, under certain circumstances, we are "bound" to admonish the sinner which means we ourselves commit a sin if we do not admonish the sinner.
I'd want to hear exactly what this woman said but if she actually gave advice that involved posting this kind of literature to family members then I would say it is bad advice and likely to start a family rift.
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  #23  
Old Feb 17, '17, 3:02 pm
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SAVINGRACE SAVINGRACE is offline
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Default Re: Mother Miriam

The only person I take seek counsel from regarding my personal and spiritual welfare is my Priest. He always advises, admonishes and refers onto professional help from a place of love.
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  #24  
Old Feb 17, '17, 10:45 pm
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brian custer brian custer is offline
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Default Re: Mother Miriam

i liked Mother Miriam and enjoyed listening to her on CA. i had heard she was transferred to France and was only going to make occasional broadcasts on CA radio
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  #25  
Old Feb 18, '17, 8:09 am
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Brendan Brendan is offline
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Default Re: Mother Miriam

Quote:
Originally Posted by Absolvo View Post
By the same token, someone who has an extreme take on Catholic teachings can interpret the canon in an extreme and unskillful way..
Which canon are you referring to, a particular item of Canon Law, the Canon of the Bible?

Your statement is not very clear.
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  #26  
Old Feb 18, '17, 11:49 am
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Mary Estelle Mary Estelle is offline
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Default Re: Mother Miriam

Quote:
Originally Posted by Absolvo View Post
Can I ask where you heard this? I can't find mention of it on the net.
I didn't "hear" it. I read it in the Catholic News. Soon after she came out with a statement about it on her website. I don't remember the exact date, but it was about 3 months ago. Peace.
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  #27  
Old Feb 19, '17, 1:51 am
eatpraylove11 eatpraylove11 is offline
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Default Re: Mother Miriam

I remember one time I was listening to the show and she said, "Everyone has the right to choose hell." I agree with you about her extreme advice.
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  #28  
Old Feb 19, '17, 10:14 pm
jeannetherese jeannetherese is offline
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Default Re: Mother Miriam

Quote:
Originally Posted by eatpraylove11 View Post
I remember one time I was listening to the show and she said, "Everyone has the right to choose hell." .
I'm unfamiliar with Mother Miriam, but the quote you mentioned seems to line up with Catholic teachings on free will.
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  #29  
Old Feb 20, '17, 12:15 am
SecretCatholic SecretCatholic is offline
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Default Re: Mother Miriam

I can't speak for everything that Mother Miriam says or writes, but from what I have personally heard from her on her Podcast, I can say that, unlike many in the Church today, she really does believe in Hell and that people can and do end up there.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Memaw View Post
Mo. Angelica was strong and straight forward in her advice too!!! We need more of that in todays society. God Bless Mother Mariam !!, Memaw
Mother Angelica was (and still is) quite "controversial" because she did not tow the party line and fit in with the cool priests and theologians. She was faithful to the timeless teachings of the faith (as far as I can see) and called it like it is. She wasn't soft or wishy-washy.

Everything is about "tone" and being uber-pastoral these days. And there is certainly a place for prudence and good timing. But sometimes some people need the truth straight. And people like Mother Miriam and Mother Angelica are straight-talkers and maybe what some people need to come to the Church and avoid Hell.

Catholic Answers are very measured in their radio/podcast responses. And that's fine for them, as long as they clearly speak the truth- which they do. But its also okay for other apostolates to adopt a more intense attitude, just as its okay for individual Catholics to hold different attitudes about evangelization, as long as it is not sinfully uncharitable or otherwise against Church teaching.

Frankly, though we should certainly talk about God's love and grace, I think we ought to talk more than we do now about the repulsiveness of sin, the horror that is Hell and the frightful consequences of rejecting God and his graces.
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  #30  
Old Feb 20, '17, 6:40 pm
Absolvo Absolvo is offline
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Default Re: Mother Miriam

Quote:
Originally Posted by Brendan View Post
Which canon are you referring to, a particular item of Canon Law, the Canon of the Bible?

Your statement is not very clear.
http://www.vatican.va/archive/ENG1104/_INDEX.HTM
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