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  #1  
Old Jan 20, '11, 1:30 pm
Augustine3 Augustine3 is offline
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Default Matthew 18:17

“If he refuses to listen to them, tell it to the church; and if he refuses to listen even to the church, let him be to you as a Gentile and a tax collector.” – Matthew 18:17

Did Jesus really use the word “Church” in this context before He had officially established He’s Church on St Peter?

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  #2  
Old Jan 20, '11, 2:05 pm
ryanoneil ryanoneil is offline
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Default Re: Matthew 18:17

The footnote from my Ignatius Catholic Study Bible says this verse pertains to a local congregation of Christians, while Mt 16:18 refers to the universal Church.
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  #3  
Old Jan 20, '11, 3:27 pm
Erich Erich is offline
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Default Re: Matthew 18:17

Quote:
Originally Posted by Augustine3 View Post
Did Jesus really use the word “Church” in this context before He had officially established He’s Church on St Peter?
I'm confused... doesn't Matthew 18:17 come after Matthew 16:18?
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  #4  
Old Jan 23, '11, 8:44 am
Verbum Verbum is offline
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Default Re: Matthew 18:17

Hi Augustine,

The original meaning of the Greek word ekklesia is a gathering or assembly. Here it is better translated as "community", which is the translation I find in my Bible de Jérusalem.

Verbum
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  #5  
Old Jan 23, '11, 2:34 pm
Robbinson Robbinson is offline
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Default Re: Matthew 18:17

Quote:
Originally Posted by Verbum View Post
Hi Augustine,

The original meaning of the Greek word ekklesia is a gathering or assembly. Here it is better translated as "community", which is the translation I find in my Bible de Jérusalem.

Verbum
Yes, but Matthew 18:17 does come after Matthew 16:18 and the same word "ekklesia" is used in Matthew 16:18 (the church being built upon Peter) and 18:17. Church is just an english translation for this assembly - which scripture tells us would be led by Peter and the apostles and it is this "church" "ekklesia" which will stand for all time.

Blessings,

Brian
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