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  #16  
Old Jun 14, '12, 12:08 pm
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Julia Mae Julia Mae is offline
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Default Re: Litany of Humility still for today? Mentally healthy?

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Originally Posted by AnneTeresa View Post

Also, how could you do this in a relationship? Wouldn't the other person just walk all over you?
Then they wouldn't love you. No matter what they said. Why have relationships with people who would take advantage?


Quote:
Can anyone help me understand? I really am struggling with this.
Here's what I think. This is about removing "desire for..." Now, who wants the most to be recognized and respected and all that? The people with the lowest self-esteem. That would include all the mentally ill folks. When you ask God to remove these desires and have a relationship of Trust with Him, you always have self-esteem because you know that you are of vital importance to the Creator of the Universe. You actually have a whole bunch of confidence and just don't need all this respect and recognition from the world.

To pray for this is to pray for mental health.

Note: the prayer doesn't say, "God I'm going to go do something..." It says "God, take this from me, please..." so that God is doing something. God heals. You don't change your behavior by force of will and make yourself disappear while in the throes of an illness that has caused you (or anyone, not you specifically) to hardly know you exist , anyway. You ask for these things to be taken away by God because God is all the Love you can ever possibly imagine and more and if He grants this will do so in a way that brings extraordinary healing.

Never be afraid to ask God for anything because He will never give you what can harm you or ask of you what you cannot do. And don't pray any prayer you don't feel comfortable with.

Trust Him.
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  #17  
Old Jun 14, '12, 12:31 pm
Robertanthony Robertanthony is offline
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Default Re: Litany of Humility still for today? Mentally healthy?

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Originally Posted by Julia Mae View Post
Then they wouldn't love you. No matter what they said. Why have relationships with people who would take advantage?




Here's what I think. This is about removing "desire for..." Now, who wants the most to be recognized and respected and all that? The people with the lowest self-esteem. That would include all the mentally ill folks. When you ask God to remove these desires and have a relationship of Trust with Him, you always have self-esteem because you know that you are of vital importance to the Creator of the Universe. You actually have a whole bunch of confidence and just don't need all this respect and recognition from the world.

To pray for this is to pray for mental health.

Note: the prayer doesn't say, "God I'm going to go do something..." It says "God, take this from me, please..." so that God is doing something. God heals. You don't change your behavior by force of will and make yourself disappear while in the throes of an illness that has caused you (or anyone, not you specifically) to hardly know you exist , anyway. You ask for these things to be taken away by God because God is all the Love you can ever possibly imagine and more and if He grants this will do so in a way that brings extraordinary healing.

Never be afraid to ask God for anything because He will never give you what can harm you or ask of you what you cannot do. And don't pray any prayer you don't feel comfortable with.

Trust Him.
This is insightful Julia, and I think I could more readily pray a prayer that you would come up with. What I'm getting here is that people are trying to redeem this prayer.
"That others may be chosen and I set aside ...
That others may be praised and I unnoticed ...
That others may be preferred to me in everything...
That others may become holier than I, provided that I may become as holy as I should…"


This has "fool-proof miserable wallflower recipe" written all over it. Make me as spineless and unassertive as you possibly can, oh Lord. Make me like the main character in "The Man who Wasn't There".
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  #18  
Old Jun 14, '12, 12:37 pm
Sing4Him Sing4Him is offline
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Default Re: Litany of Humility still for today? Mentally healthy?

I don't see this prayer as a damaging thing. To me, it's an attempt to take the spotlight off oneself - to honor the 1st Commandment by clearing the mind and heart of matters of self. To wish good on our neighbor, not to deny ourselves happiness. I see it as an attitude adjustment.
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  #19  
Old Jun 14, '12, 12:41 pm
acadian acadian is offline
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Default Re: Litany of Humility still for today? Mentally healthy?

Kind of off the topic, but nort really...one of Matt Maher's recent songs was based on the Litany of Humility...

http://m.youtube.com/index?desktop_u...?v=tk_3WNdG5cA

It's a keeper!
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  #20  
Old Jun 14, '12, 12:56 pm
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Julia Mae Julia Mae is offline
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Default Re: Litany of Humility still for today? Mentally healthy?

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Originally Posted by Robertanthony View Post
This is insightful Julia, and I think I could more readily pray a prayer that you would come up with. What I'm getting here is that people are trying to redeem this prayer.
"That others may be chosen and I set aside ...
That others may be praised and I unnoticed ...
That others may be preferred to me in everything...
That others may become holier than I, provided that I may become as holy as I should…"


This has "fool-proof miserable wallflower recipe" written all over it. Make me as spineless and unassertive as you possibly can, oh Lord. Make me like the main character in "The Man who Wasn't There".
I see how people get this from it, I'd like to put the whole thing here:
O Jesus! meek and humble of heart, Hear me.
From the desire of being esteemed,
Deliver me, Jesus.

From the desire of being loved...
From the desire of being extolled ...
From the desire of being honored ...
From the desire of being praised ...
From the desire of being preferred to others...
From the desire of being consulted ...
From the desire of being approved ...
From the fear of being humiliated ...
From the fear of being despised...
From the fear of suffering rebukes ...
From the fear of being calumniated ...
From the fear of being forgotten ...
From the fear of being ridiculed ...
From the fear of being wronged ...
From the fear of being suspected ...

That others may be loved more than I,
Jesus, grant me the grace to desire it.

That others may be esteemed more than I ...
That, in the opinion of the world,
others may increase and I may decrease ...
That others may be chosen and I set aside ...
That others may be praised and I unnoticed ...
That others may be preferred to me in everything...
That others may become holier than I, provided that I may become as holy as I should…

It's very Franciscan, very mystical. What the petitioner wants is the "Grace to desire it."

That is: all these things that follow would be what a person really wants. So, I want to quote the last and ask you a question:
Quote:
That others may become holier than I, provided that I may become as holy as I should…
IF - just imagine, you became as holy as you should be.... IF then, everyone else in the world was holier than you, what would the world be like?

If I could be the most miserable person on earth, right now, but without changing one thing about myself, wow, how great would that be? If everyone was happier and healthier and kinder and more loving and ... just all around better than I, oh, what a great thing to happen. Because I'm not so great, but I can think of so many, so very many that are struggling so much more than I. No one would be hungry or homeless or in terrible pain, or in despair or without love or hope or faith or warmth or companionship ... I would love to live in that world.

Robert, can you not pray that prayer? Make me as good as I can be and make everyone else better?



I bet you can.
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  #21  
Old Jun 14, '12, 12:57 pm
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Pug Pug is offline
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Default Re: Litany of Humility still for today? Mentally healthy?

I wonder if the prayer is a prayer to be content with life.

I will not pray to be freed from the desire to be loved. Not legitimate desire. I don't want to lose it entirely. If I cease to care about someone loving me, I cease to care about God loving me and eternal beatitude.

That's why I think it is more a prayer about being content with what one ought to be content.
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  #22  
Old Jun 16, '12, 8:57 pm
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Blenderx Blenderx is offline
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Default Re: Litany of Humility still for today? Mentally healthy?

I prefer this prayer of St. Augustine as an alternative:

Lord Jesus,
let me know myself, let me know You,
And desire nothing save only You.
Let me hate myself and love You,
And do everything for the sake of You.
Let me humble myself and exalt You,
And think of nothing except You.
Let me die to myself and live in You,
And accept whatever happens as from You.
Let me banish self and follow You,
And ever desire to follow You.
Let me fly from myself and take refuge in You,
That I may deserve to be defended by You.
Let me fear for myself, let me fear You,
And let me be among those who are chosen by You.
Let me distrust myself and put my trust in You.
Let me be willing to obey for the sake of You.
Let me cling to nothing save only to You,
And let me be poor because of You.
Look upon me, that I may love You.
Call me that I may see You,
And for ever enjoy You. Amen.
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  #23  
Old Jun 16, '12, 9:51 pm
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Default Re: Litany of Humility still for today? Mentally healthy?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Robertanthony View Post
This is insightful Julia, and I think I could more readily pray a prayer that you would come up with. What I'm getting here is that people are trying to redeem this prayer.
"That others may be chosen and I set aside ...
That others may be praised and I unnoticed ...
That others may be preferred to me in everything...
That others may become holier than I, provided that I may become as holy as I should…"


This has "fool-proof miserable wallflower recipe" written all over it. Make me as spineless and unassertive as you possibly can, oh Lord. Make me like the main character in "The Man who Wasn't There".
But it will only make you miserable and a wallflower if you are relying on the admiration and approval of other human beings to provide you with meaning or happiness. And we all know how fickle people are, and how easily their opinions about you and your deeds will shift and sway.

The prayer is not to be understood as meaning one should not seek God's approval. On the contrary, it is a reminder that God's approval is the ONLY thing that matters. Not all the approval or acknowledgement or achievement or success in the world will save your soul if you got it by means that are displeasing to God.

And Jesus was all too often misunderstood, ridiculed, mocked, abused, treated with suspicion and derision, had others (Barabbas for one) preferred to him and so on. Was he a miserable wallflower as a result? Not a bit, though to be sure He suffered greatly in many ways.

And why not? Because He knew how how unimportant human respect is. He had enough trust in the Father, and enough genuine self-respect, that He remained steadfast through the ups and downs, the Palm Sundays and the Good Fridays. He did not let the acclamation swell His head nor the suffering dishearten Him.
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  #24  
Old Jun 16, '12, 10:24 pm
JaredR JaredR is offline
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Default Re: Litany of Humility still for today? Mentally healthy?

This prayer should not be rejected if one doesn't understand it.

If we become perfect, we will be free from the desire to be loved and esteemed by others—even our friends and family. If they reject us, it will still hurt, but the heart will be free because its only attachment is God.

If we become perfect, we will desire to be unnoticed and despised, because we will have a holy fear of pride, and we will desire to suffer for Christ.

If that sounds distasteful to you, that is why you need the Litany of Humility! We don't really desire humility, so we have to pray for the grace to desire it. Don't redefine humility to make it more palatable... examine the lives of the saints and see what it means to be humble, and when you realize that true humility is repugnant to you, ask God to tear down your pride and give you a love of this virtue.

The Litany is certainly still for today... we need it now especially. I admit that I don't feel particularly "drawn" to the last part right now, and I know I need to pray for this.
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  #25  
Old Jun 17, '12, 9:29 am
Joannm Joannm is offline
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Default Re: Litany of Humility still for today? Mentally healthy?

I have been praying this litany for years, and it has made me more aware of who I am and where I am in my relationship with God. St. Benedict wrote, "prefer nothing to the Love of Christ." This is what the litany is driving at. All the great saints strive for complete humility and emptying themselves for the sake of the Love of God.

There is such a freedom in not desiring acceptance, prestige, getting ahead, and even the love of others. My husband doesn't like the litany but I think, like some posters here, he doesn't understand it.
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  #26  
Old Jun 17, '12, 10:13 am
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Default Re: Litany of Humility still for today? Mentally healthy?

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I think in layman's terms what the litany of humility is trying to get at is. Honor your own dignity and others by not comparing or competing. Rejoice in your uniqueness and rejoice in the success of others. Who we are in the eyes of others isn't necessarily what's true. It is only who we are in the eyes of God that is true. We can be content with knowing that God sees us, God praises us, loves us and glorifies us. Because we are satisfied with God's approval, we do not seek it from others as though they were God and the one we need to seek approval from.

There is freedom by being delivered from the opinion of others. You can be who God made you to be, without compromising so that you are more acceptable to others. When you no longer "seek" approval you no longer are laid low by rejection or puffed up by praise. You just are...and it's o.k.

These fears and desires prevent us from being ourselves.


I really love "That others may become holier than I, provided that I may become as holy as I should". This illustrates the point of the whole litany to me: abandonment to God's will for us. I fell like I'm essentially praying "please give me what you want for me, Lord, and not what I think I need. Please help me focus on YOU and not the admiration of the WORLD."

Of course, we all have dignity as human persons and God's children. I don't think this litany is asking us to forget that. It's asking us to see ourselves in the big picture.

A healthy regard for self is important, but I'm not sure the whole "self-esteem" movement has been that good for society.
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  #27  
Old Jun 17, '12, 11:16 am
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Default Re: Litany of Humility still for today? Mentally healthy?

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Originally Posted by Lady Love View Post
I think in layman's terms what the litany of humility is trying to get at is. Honor your own dignity and others by not comparing or competing. Rejoice in your uniqueness and rejoice in the success of others. Who we are in the eyes of others isn't necessarily what's true. It is only who we are in the eyes of God that is true. We can be content with knowing that God sees us, God praises us, loves us and glorifies us. Because we are satisfied with God's approval, we do not seek it from others as though they were God and the one we need to seek approval from.

There is freedom by being delivered from the opinion of others. You can be who God made you to be, without compromising so that you are more acceptable to others. When you no longer "seek" approval you no longer are laid low by rejection or puffed up by praise. You just are...and it's o.k.

These fears and desires prevent us from being ourselves.
Thank you very much for this post.

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  #28  
Old Jun 17, '12, 11:31 am
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Default Re: Litany of Humility still for today? Mentally healthy?

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I really love "That others may become holier than I, provided that I may become as holy as I should". This illustrates the point of the whole litany to me: abandonment to God's will for us. I fell like I'm essentially praying "please give me what you want for me, Lord, and not what I think I need. Please help me focus on YOU and not the admiration of the WORLD."

Of course, we all have dignity as human persons and God's children. I don't think this litany is asking us to forget that. It's asking us to see ourselves in the big picture.

A healthy regard for self is important, but I'm not sure the whole "self-esteem" movement has been that good for society.
Another excellent post.

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  #29  
Old Jun 18, '12, 2:08 pm
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Default Re: Litany of Humility still for today? Mentally healthy?

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So basically we're renouncing our dependence on these types of recognitions?
You're asking for the Lord to transform you from one who depends on those things to one who depends solely on the Lord. What a life I'd have if I lived that way!
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  #30  
Old Jun 18, '12, 3:43 pm
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Default Re: Litany of Humility still for today? Mentally healthy?

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Originally Posted by Lady Love View Post
The key words in this prayer are "desire" and "fear." You are not asking to never be praised etc. you are asking to be delivered from the DESIRE and likewise the FEAR.
I think that quote settles it. It's a razor edge.

But let me add with what Pope Pius XII termed the "golden book" (this term has been used prior as well past for other masterpieces of faith) commonly known as The Imitation of Christ.

"Fight like a good solider and if you sometimes fall into weakness, rise again with greater strength then before, trusting in my most abundant grace. But beware of vain complacency and pride. For many are led into error through these faults and sometimes fall into perpetual blindness. Let the fall of these, who proudly presume on self, be a warning to you and a constant incentive to humility." (Book Three, Chapter Six)
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