The Assumption - something historical

[Fr Ambrose]

Here's an interesting historical account of the Assumption - The Dormition..... You might say this is a case of knowing how to keep a secret. The history of the end of Mary's life was genuinely new to most of the Church when it was made public in the fifth century. The facts of the matter were kept private among the clergy of the Jerusalem Church, and only became public during the Council of Chalcedon. This was a case where there was a Tradition - a passing-along of knowledge - that was intentionally kept private. I personally suspect the remarkable near-silence of Scripture about the Mother of God was deliberate on the part of the Apostles; St John (her guardian) and the rest of the Evangelists kept her privacy.

The more picturesque details of the "transitus Mariae" literature had yet to be developed, but in the mid-400's some basic information was revealed by the Jerusalem clergy. I'm attaching a quote from the "Euthymiac History" quoted by St John of Damascus, for details.

__________________________________

In his second homily on the Dormition of the Mother of God, Saint John of Damascus refers to events recounted in the 40th chapter of the Life of St Euthymios:

It was said above that Saint Pulcheria erected many churches for Christ in Constantinople. One of these is the church in Blachernae, built at the beginning of the reign of the divinely-appointed Emperor Marcian . When the two of them built a worthy house there for the all-glorious and all-holy Mother of God, the ever-virgin Mary, and adorned it with every sort of decoration, they hoped to find her holy body, which had been the dwelling-place of God. And summoning Juvenal, the Archbishop of Jerusalem, and those bishops from Palestine who were staying in the capital because of the synod then being held in Chalcedon , they said to them: We have heard that the first and most outstanding church of the all-holy Mother of God, the ever-virgin Mary, is in Jerusalem, in the place called Gethsemane, where her life-giving body was put in a coffin. We now wish to bring this relic here, to protect this royal city."

continued...

[Fr Ambrose]

...continued

Juvenal answered on behalf of them all:

"There is nothing in the holy, inspired Scripture about the death of Mary, the holy Mother of God; but we know from ancient and wholly reliable tradition that at the time she so gloriously fell asleep, all the holy Apostles who were traveling the world for the salvation of the peoples were lifted up in a single instant of time and were gathered at Jerusalem. And as they stood by her, they saw a vision of angels, and heard the divine chanting of the higher powers. So it was that she gave her soul in an ineffable way into God's hands, surrounded by the glory of God and all heaven.

"Her body, which had been God's dwelling place, was brought for burial amidst the singing of the angels and the Apostles, and laid to rest in a coffin in Gethsemane; and the angelic dancing and singing continued without pause in that place for three days. But after three days the song of the angels ceased; the Apostles were there, and since one of them - Thomas - had not been present and came at he end of three days, and wished to reverence that body which had housed God, they opened the coffin. And they could not find her body, which had been the object of such praise; all that they found were her burial wrappings. And being overcome by the ineffable fragrance that came out of the wrappings, they closed the coffin again. Amazed by this miraculous discovery, they could only draw a single conclusion: The one who had deigned to become flesh in her own person and to take his humanity from her, the one who willed to be born in human flesh as God the Word, the Lord of glory, and who had preserved her virginity intact even after childbirth, now chose, after her departure from this world, to honour her pure and immaculate body with the gift of incorruptibility, and with a change of state even before the common, universal resurrection."

When the imperial couple heard this, they asked Archbishop Juvenal to send them the holy coffin, properly sealed, with the funeral garments in it of the glorious, all-holy Mary, Mother of God. And when he had sent it, they placed it in the church of the holy Theotokos that had been built at Blachernae.

[Servulus]

What a fascinating and beautiful account!


An interesting detail . . .

Originally Posted by Fr Ambrose

... one of them - Thomas - had not been present and came at he end of three days, and wished to reverence that body which had housed God, they opened the coffin.

Poor Thomas! He seems to have been late for everything. Perhaps he should be the patron saint of those who struglle with punctuality.

[LaVada]

Fr. Ambrose,
Thank you so much. I read a considerable amount and had not ran across this account. How neat. I too noticed the little item about St Thomas. Can't comment too much as it was rather late in life that this "ole" lady woke up, so to speak. Dear St. Thomas, pray for us. Happy Feast day to all. What a wonderful spiritual Mother, we all have. God bless you, Father, and may our Lady keep you close to her.
Peace on earth to men of good will.
LaVada

[PilgrimJWT]

I tend to be suspicious of fabulous accounts in things having to do with Jesus, Mary or the saints. I accept the Assumption solely on the authority of the Church. I do not profess to understand it, but I trust the source.

[MrsMcBear]

Originally Posted by Servulus

Poor Thomas! He seems to have been late for everything. Perhaps he should be the patron saint of those who struglle with punctuality.

Wow! He should then be MY patron saint! My father always said I'd be ten minutes late to my own funeral!

[LatinCat]

Originally Posted by PilgrimJWT

I tend to be suspicious of fabulous accounts in things having to do with Jesus, Mary or the saints. I accept the Assumption solely on the authority of the Church. I do not profess to understand it, but I trust the source.

But you should always accept the traditions that have been handed down. There is definitely a sense of the faith among the faithful and the Fathers were very conservative about what they handed down. They handed on only those things that they knew to be apostolic in nature.

[thistle]

Originally Posted by Fr Ambrose

...continued

Juvenal answered on behalf of them all:

"There is nothing in the holy, inspired Scripture about the death of Mary, the holy Mother of God; but we know from ancient and wholly reliable tradition that at the time she so gloriously fell asleep, all the holy Apostles who were traveling the world for the salvation of the peoples were lifted up in a single instant of time and were gathered at Jerusalem. And as they stood by her, they saw a vision of angels, and heard the divine chanting of the higher powers. So it was that she gave her soul in an ineffable way into God's hands, surrounded by the glory of God and all heaven.

"Her body, which had been God's dwelling place, was brought for burial amidst the singing of the angels and the Apostles, and laid to rest in a coffin in Gethsemane; and the angelic dancing and singing continued without pause in that place for three days. But after three days the song of the angels ceased; the Apostles were there, and since one of them - Thomas - had not been present and came at he end of three days, and wished to reverence that body which had housed God, they opened the coffin. And they could not find her body, which had been the object of such praise; all that they found were her burial wrappings. And being overcome by the ineffable fragrance that came out of the wrappings, they closed the coffin again. Amazed by this miraculous discovery, they could only draw a single conclusion: The one who had deigned to become flesh in her own person and to take his humanity from her, the one who willed to be born in human flesh as God the Word, the Lord of glory, and who had preserved her virginity intact even after childbirth, now chose, after her departure from this world, to honour her pure and immaculate body with the gift of incorruptibility, and with a change of state even before the common, universal resurrection."

When the imperial couple heard this, they asked Archbishop Juvenal to send them the holy coffin, properly sealed, with the funeral garments in it of the glorious, all-holy Mary, Mother of God. And when he had sent it, they placed it in the church of the holy Theotokos that had been built at Blachernae.

Is this officially accepted by the Church? If yes then its a really interesting story but why haven't we heard it before? If no, then its simply another story we can place no reliance on!

[Matthew P.]

Dear Thistle,

I think your Church believes officially in the Dormition of the Mother of God, and the account by Saint John of Damascus as it remains a tradition in the Orthodox Church. I don't know why you never heard it as it is very well known and accepted in Jerusalem by the Latin's. The site of the Dormition is about a stones throw away from the Garden of Gethsemane, maybe it is still considered part of the Garden although now there is a road going through it. It's an Orthodox site so you can trust that it is authentic and part of the living tradition of the Church, no official papal statement is necessary. The reason those statements are issued is because the people get confused if authentic traditions are looked upon the way you have looked upon this one.

It's a good rule particularly in the Holy land to accept the Orthodox sites and traditions as authentic as your Church does, you want to be consistent so your Church does not appear to be very fragmented. Get in-line with the Traditions.

In Christ,

Matthew Panchisin

[marymol]

Originally Posted by Servulus

What a fascinating and beautiful account!


An interesting detail . . .

Poor Thomas! He seems to have been late for everything. Perhaps he should be the patron saint of those who struglle with punctuality.

Or may be to fulfill' the first ..and the last shall be first ' -since we have this parallel discussion now about how to be One Church See vatican etc: thread - and how this little yet powerful Eastern rite Church that St. Thomas has as the father of faith who could be the one to light the way on how to do it with love, humility and forgiveness - for all the blessings ..
Starting with dealing with the all important issue of Sacramental Validity ...and you know who might have turned the wrong lock or holding the wrong keys here..
All the love and veneration of The Mother would become a lot more meaningful , when we take care not to tear it up..and may be the bombs in Iraq would fall silent .... Iran and China would see they are now surrounded by the arms of One powerful Church - that would pray her into tamenss - and the lion and the lamb would ..
We may not even have to worry about the bird flu - that would threaten the lungs ..

[nobody]

This account strongly implies that Mary actually died. The CCC leaves that open - 'when her earthly life was finished' (paraphrasing). This has been debated because if she was born without original sin, she should not have to die.

How does this account of actual death match up with Catholic teaching?

[marymol]

Dear humble nobody,
Since there are allegations about the Cath. Church having 'wrong doctrines ' etc: ( which alone is the very wrong doctrine )the Church's open position on this , in her humility - since she says she does not have valid revelation on this yet ..and it does not matter ..you are welcome to take it either way ..should reassure us how carefully She listens to The Voice

Bl. Mother with her sinless Son , might have participated in the suffering redemptive work by sharing in death ..or like other OT persons who were taken up, she might have 'fallen asleep', but not died and was assumed ..

I too beg with you - please be easy on me too...just a poor lay person who think a little mustard seed of ..could move the mountains ...

[Mordocai]

What a wonderful story! As I understand it, it says that all the Apostles were transported to Mary's side at the end of her life? I can see that as happening.
Imagine the things that Mary taught them!
Of course, this is a story, but irregardless, it can be accepted on good faith because of the reputation of the source. Or it can be rejected simple because...well it doesnt have to be accepted. Mary's humility was so great that she did not want to be in the limelight at all. She indeed is a great mystery, and o how I love her!

[prodromos]

Originally Posted by nobody

This account strongly implies that Mary actually died.

It actually states it plainly as a fact

John

[thistle]

Originally Posted by Matthew P.

Dear Thistle,

I think your Church believes officially in the Dormition of the Mother of God, and the account by Saint John of Damascus as it remains a tradition in the Orthodox Church. I don't know why you never heard it as it is very well known and accepted in Jerusalem by the Latin's. The site of the Dormition is about a stones throw away from the Garden of Gethsemane, maybe it is still considered part of the Garden although now there is a road going through it. It's an Orthodox site so you can trust that it is authentic and part of the living tradition of the Church, no official papal statement is necessary. The reason those statements are issued is because the people get confused if authentic traditions are looked upon the way you have looked upon this one.

It's a good rule particularly in the Holy land to accept the Orthodox sites and traditions as authentic as your Church does, you want to be consistent so your Church does not appear to be very fragmented. Get in-line with the Traditions.

In Christ,

Matthew Panchisin

I asked a priest about the Church's official teaching on the St John of Damascus account of the Dormition. Below is what he told me:

QUOTE

There are many stories and legends about Mary's Assumption, including the writings of St. John of Damascus, and we can learn something from them. But the official teaching of the Church is found in the Catechism, # 966:

"Finally the Immaculate Virgin, preserved free from all stain of original sin, when the course of her earthly life was finished, was taken up body and soul into heavenly glory, and exalted by the Lord as Queen over all things, so that she might be the more fully conformed to her Son, the Lord of lords and conqueror of sin and death."

The Assumption of the Blessed Virgin is a singular participation in her Son's Resurrection and an anticipation of the resurrection of other Christians.
It is interesting to note, however, that when Pope Pius XII declared the Assumption to be part of the Church's official teaching, he did quote St. John of Damascus. That does not mean that he views everything that John said as definitive, but only that we can learn from what the Fathers of the Church taught.

UNQUOTE