Helping Parent Kids Who Are Not Ours?

KCT · #1 Oct 29, '06, 2:03 pm

My brother and sil are having a tough time w/ their 14 yr old dd. Her mom has always had trouble disciplining her, and she's now hanging w/ a dangerous crowd. She has some friends the parents like, but not many. Niece has called the police claiming her dad hits her, CPS and the police have been to their house to see what's up. CPS also showed up at her school to talk with her. (at first she claimed her dad hit her and later admitted that her dad wanted what's best and did not mistreat her. she and her mom also admitted to siding together to conspire against dad)

Anyway, my brother wants niece to start spending more time at our house with our family. Partly to get her away from the bad crowd and partly to be around a nice family :-) (he and his wife have always fought - long story but sil will not agree to counseling)

I have serious reservations. For one, they could be avoiding disciplining her. Sending her to our house for a weekend here or there is not dealing w/ their family issues. Also, if niece can call the police and claim her dad abused her, what's to stop her from claiming we did something to her? Actions have consequences and lack of trust is a big one. If she were angry enough, why couldn't she lie about us?

Brother and I are going to talk this week, and dh and I will ultimately have to decide how involved to get. I'm wondering if others have had experience helping out family members in difficult situations.

I want to have a charitable, Christian response, but that doesn't mean saying yes to any request. ---KCT

Della · #2 Oct 29, '06, 2:20 pm

If it were me, I'd be honest with your brother and tell him about your reservations. Tell him how you see the situation and perhaps offer alternatives to your taking your niece in some sort of effort to "straighten" her out. That is her parent's job and no one else's. Frankly, it's not fair to expect you to do over weekends what they can't do the rest of the time. Your brother and his daughter ought to go to counseling together, even if the wife won't. At least they might be able to work out some of their problems until she is old enough to be on her own. I'm sure more experienced people will have better advise, but that's what my heart and head are telling me to say. God bless you and yours.

Monicad · #3 Oct 29, '06, 2:31 pm

Pray, pray and pray some more.

Perhaps you have multiple options? If you are not comfortable having her stay at your home for long periods of time...perhaps she could just come more often for short visits? Or you could call her on the phone to talk? Maybe she could come for a short visit for a "movie night" and watch a nice movie and have popcorn? (if she lives far away this might not be an option tho)

I agree that you need to be cautious as she has lied before to child protective services and you don't want to place yourself in that vulnerable position. However, (going out on a limb here as I don't know her) I would think it highly unlikely that she would retaliate against you like that if your get-togethers were short, fun and casual...there would be no motivation. Why would she call the police after being at your home for 2 hours eating popcorn? Just a thought, keep the visits short?

As far as parenting another person's chld, I don't think that should be the way you see it. It is not your job to parent, discipline, or straighten her out. But you can be there to love her. A child cannot have too much of the right kind of love in their lives. Maybe just frequent phone conversations asking her how school is and how she is doing might help?

Maybe this won't work with your family dynamic...but I was just offering a few suggestions of ways you can be involved, show your love, show her that the adults in her life care about her and at the same time not infringe too much on your own family life.

Pray to the Holy Spirit for guidance and the right words to use when talking to your brother and especially when talking to her. God Bless, hope this helps a little.

BLB_Oregon · #4 Oct 29, '06, 2:46 pm

If my brother asked this, it would be ok...if he was going to be there, too.

I have a relative, a childless couple who could never have kids of their own, who took in the wife's nephew from another state when the boy started high school. I'm sure it made a world of difference for him. Nevetheless, his mother (SIL to the wife) was a single mother with two other kids who didn't have the resources to properly raise all three boys.

By all means, though, have that brother of yours go into counselling with his daughter. There is nothing in the world that will keep a girl out of trouble and out of bad relationships with men like a great relationship with her dad will. The two of them should resolve to work on mom's well-being together, us-for-her, not us-against-her. Whether they succeed with Mom or not, the daughter will always love him for it....but these are all things that a counsellor can help them with.

He will never spend money or time more wisely.

Arlene · #5 Oct 29, '06, 3:30 pm

It also sounds like there are way more issues at hand that you may not want to get in the middle of....

A woman conspires with her daughter against her husband???? There is something very wrong about this.

I agree with the poster who suggested just short get togethers. Are any of your children close to her age? Maybe just start incuding her in some family outings or come over to hang out for a little bit. It sounds like this girl could use a female role model in her life, but not at the risk of harming your own family.

KCT · #6 Oct 29, '06, 5:17 pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Della

Your brother and his daughter ought to go to counseling together, even if the wife won't.

The 14 yr old has also refused to go to counseling.

It really is a messy situation because the husband and wife do not get along. Wife wants a divorce, but wants husband to file. Husband does not want a divorce (wants to get help and work it out) so he told her to file if she wants to. She hasn't (and she refuses to get help). Such an unhappy environment.

I agree it's not likely that niece would retaliate against us, but I never imagined she'd lie about her dad, either.

My brother mentioned all this at a party for our dd's Confirmation this weekend. He may not even follow through in calling me. If he does, I need to listen well and then talk to dh.

Thanks for the input and insights. ---KCT

**jmcrae** · #7 Oct 29, '06, 5:24 pm

Our nephew was going through a spot of bother a few years back, and we took him in for a few weeks to help him sort things out. (He was running away from school - nobody could figure out what was wrong - it turned out that he just doesn't like big crowds. We advised him to switch to a smaller school - it had never even occurred to him that that would be allowed - anyway, it all turned out well - he's a bank manager, now.)

Sometimes a bit of a break away from the routine is good for kids, and a fresh perspective on things - sometimes it's easier for kids to talk things out with an adult who isn't as emotionally involved with him.

ReginaNova · #8 Oct 29, '06, 5:30 pm

KCT--I have not had exactly the same situation with family members. But I have struggled with the knowledge that no matter how bad things get with children of my adult siblings, there is really very little that I and my husband can do. I come from a big family and several of my siblings or their spouses parent their children in ways that I think are very damaging. I have a sister who shares my concerns--it helps having an ally. What we do is try to reach out to the children, making it clear that we care about them and that we will make time for them. But it is a delicate balance. And fundamentally, no matter how abusive a parent is, it is still the parent. Family loyalty is usually strong even in the worst situations.

In your case, you might make overtures to your niece but you need to let her take the initiative. If she senses that her father is behind this, she might be angry at you and your family too for conspiring with him. I suspect you will be very limited in your ability to help your niece. But you can still try to reach out to her.

leonie · #9 Oct 29, '06, 5:32 pm

The one thing I would add to the conversation is: it is not a good idea to bring bad companions into your children's lives. It is more likely that your child would be negatively influenced than she would be positively influenced (in a peer relationship).

If you decide to have her over, make sure you are closely supervising. I would say not to have her alone with your kids at all.

**jmcrae** · #10 Oct 29, '06, 5:37 pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by ReginaNova

In your case, you might make overtures to your niece but you need to let her take the initiative. If she senses that her father is behind this, she might be angry at you and your family too for conspiring with him. I suspect you will be very limited in your ability to help your niece. But you can still try to reach out to her.

That's an excellent point. In my nephew's case, I don't even know who's idea it was to send him to us - he just showed up at the door. We called his parents to let them know he was okay, and they gave their permission for him to stay with us until he was ready to come home again, but to this day I have no idea whether they were expecting that call, or not.

KCT · #11 Oct 29, '06, 6:27 pm

Thanks for all the thoughts. It does make me feel a bit easier about possibly helping out. ---KCT

Meggie · #12 Oct 29, '06, 7:19 pm

I wouldn't jump to the conclusion that your niece lied. As someone whose's many relitives were pretty much in the dark about my life its really hard for them to understand. Alot goes on behind closed doors that aunts and uncles never get to know about. It could also be that her mom has alot of mental control over her, and is the one harming her, either mentally or physically....no matter what, something sounds very wrong, and not with your niece.

I agree with spending time with her...don't discredit her if she begins to tell you things....she sounds very confused and in need of help.

Those aunts and uncles that I let into my life a bit are still very important to me.

KCT · #13 Oct 30, '06, 5:36 am

Quote:

Originally Posted by Meggie

....no matter what, something sounds very wrong, and not with your niece.

Those aunts and uncles that I let into my life a bit are still very important to me.

It's a sad situation, and I'm certain we don't know all the details. I do want to help in any way I can (even just being there), but knowing she has no problem picking up the phone and getting the police involved still makes me nervous. In this day and age, one accusation can ruin someone's reputation. ---KCT

Meggie · #14 Oct 30, '06, 9:36 am

Like I said, you don't know the basis behind the call...and for a 14yo to pick up a phone and call cops she probably was at some sort of limit. Weither she was put up to it or not. That type of anger, frustration and pain towards a parent dosn't come from nowhere. Many teens chalenge their parents "Wah, wah' you're hurting me I'm going to call the cops," and the parents dare them to...most teens then become somewhat rational and storm off. Teens are naturally emotional and irrational, but even they act within some boundaries.

And I cringe at the thought of her being labled a child who whas hard to disipline becuase while there are truly those impossible children, for myself and people I know it was a parental excuse.

I don't think by being there, for a movie night, or much later after you can judge wither she's all there mentally, a sleepover.

BLB_Oregon · #15 Oct 30, '06, 11:34 am

Quote:

Originally Posted by Meggie

Like I said, you don't know the basis behind the call...and for a 14yo to pick up a phone and call cops she probably was at some sort of limit. Weither she was put up to it or not. That type of anger, frustration and pain towards a parent dosn't come from nowhere. Many teens chalenge their parents "Wah, wah' you're hurting me I'm going to call the cops," and the parents dare them to...most teens then become somewhat rational and storm off. Teens are naturally emotional and irrational, but even they act within some boundaries.

And I cringe at the thought of her being labled a child who whas hard to disipline becuase while there are truly those impossible children, for myself and people I know it was a parental excuse.

I don't think by being there, for a movie night, or much later after you can judge wither she's all there mentally, a sleepover.

I knew a kid who used to threaten a call to Social Services as a way to manipulate her parents. She wasn't being abused. She just wanted to put Mom and Dad on a leash. That was still a situation that required professional intervention.