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  #1  
Old Feb 3, '07, 6:03 am
didymus's Avatar
didymus didymus is offline
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Default $34.06 an Hour

http://tinyurl.com/yr4pmy

$34.06 an Hour
That's how much the average public school teachers makes. Is that "underpaid"?

BY JAY P. GREENE AND MARCUS A. WINTERS
Friday, February 2, 2007 12:01 a.m. EST

Who, on average, is better paid--public school teachers or architects? How about teachers or economists? You might be surprised to learn that public school teachers are better paid than these and many other professionals. According to the Bureau of Labor Statistics, public school teachers earned $34.06 per hour in 2005, 36% more than the hourly wage of the average white-collar worker and 11% more than the average professional specialty or technical worker.

In the popular imagination, however, public school teachers are underpaid. "Salaries are too low. We all know that," noted First Lady Laura Bush, expressing the consensus view. "We need to figure out a way to pay teachers more." Indeed, our efforts to hire more teachers and raise their salaries account for the bulk of public school spending increases over the last four decades. During that time per-pupil spending, adjusted for inflation, has more than doubled; overall we now annually spend more than $500 billion on public education.

. . .

Evidence suggests that the way we pay teachers is more important than simply what they take home. Currently salaries are determined almost entirely by seniority--the number of years in the classroom--and the number of advanced degrees accumulated. Neither has much to do with student improvement. There is evidence that providing bonuses to teachers who improve the performance of their students does raise academic proficiency. With our colleagues at the University of Arkansas we found that a Little Rock program providing bonuses to teachers based on student gains on standardized tests substantially increased math proficiency. Researchers at the University of Florida recently found similar results in a nationwide evaluation.


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  #2  
Old Feb 3, '07, 6:22 am
Benedictus Benedictus is offline
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Default Re: $34.06 an Hour

I think there's some funny business going on here with the numbers.

I imagine most teachers are paid a salary, not hourly, and since most teachers don't work 40 hours a week, 52 weeks a year, their equivalent hourly pay would work out to be artificially high.

According to this the average teacher made $46,597 in 2002-2003, which is far less impressive than $34.06 an hour. Someone who made $34.06 an hour and was paid for 52 weeks of full-time work a year would make about $70,845 a year.
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  #3  
Old Feb 3, '07, 6:35 am
hoosiertoo hoosiertoo is offline
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Default Re: $34.06 an Hour

But I LIKE long summer vacations...
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  #4  
Old Feb 3, '07, 6:38 am
SeekerJen SeekerJen is offline
 
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Default Re: $34.06 an Hour

Quote:
Originally Posted by Benedictus View Post
I think there's some funny business going on here with the numbers.

I imagine most teachers are paid a salary, not hourly, and since most teachers don't work 40 hours a week, 52 weeks a year, their equivalent hourly pay would work out to be artificially high.

According to this the average teacher made $46,597 in 2002-2003, which is far less impressive than $34.06 an hour. Someone who made $34.06 an hour and was paid for 52 weeks of full-time work a year would make about $70,845 a year.
Excellent point. I know a lot of teachers and educational personnel (about half of DH's family is in elementary education) and none of them make even close to $34/hour. In fact, I don't think any of them make the average salary.
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  #5  
Old Feb 3, '07, 6:41 am
hoosiertoo hoosiertoo is offline
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Default Re: $34.06 an Hour

But I LIKE weekends off and only 180 days of actual instuction a year...including half days for "prep."
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  #6  
Old Feb 3, '07, 6:42 am
hoosiertoo hoosiertoo is offline
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Default Re: $34.06 an Hour

And long breaks around the holidays...
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  #7  
Old Feb 3, '07, 6:47 am
Benedictus Benedictus is offline
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Default Re: $34.06 an Hour

Quote:
Originally Posted by hoosiertoo View Post
But I LIKE long summer vacations...
Hey, I'm not trying to take that away. I'm just pointing out that someone figured out how to twist the numbers just right to make teacher pay look higher than it is.
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  #8  
Old Feb 3, '07, 7:20 am
seek seek is offline
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Default Re: $34.06 an Hour

I often worry that if how well someone takes a test is the only
criteria, then teaching how to think, love and enjoy learning is left in the dust.
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  #9  
Old Feb 3, '07, 7:35 am
vern humphrey vern humphrey is offline
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Default Re: $34.06 an Hour

Quote:
Originally Posted by seek View Post
I often worry that if how well someone takes a test is the only
criteria, then teaching how to think, love and enjoy learning is left in the dust.

I invite you to go and look at the tests. Most states post released test questions from past years. The tests are pathetically easy -- a sixth grader ought to be able to pass the typical high school test.

Teachers have complained, "We spend so much time teaching the test, we don't have time to give the children a well-rounded education."

My response is, "If you were really giving them a well-rounded education, you wouldn't have to spend a single minute teaching them to pass that test."
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  #10  
Old Feb 3, '07, 7:42 am
Benedictus Benedictus is offline
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Default Re: $34.06 an Hour

Quote:
Originally Posted by vern humphrey View Post
I invite you to go and look at the tests. Most states post released test questions from past years. The tests are pathetically easy -- a sixth grader ought to be able to pass the typical high school test.
No kidding. I've seen the tests. They're ridiculously easy.
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  #11  
Old Feb 3, '07, 7:57 am
shirleytowers shirleytowers is offline
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Default Re: $34.06 an Hour

Architects don't get paid by the hour, do they? My BIL is one and he gets paid one sum for the project. And did you ever think that maybe economists and architects were just grossly underpaid, too?

See this link for unbiased stats. http://www.census.gov/hhes/income/ea...ll2usboth.html

Teachers in my school district are paid $26 an hour for hourly contracts and yearly salaries starting at $34K. This is California, where the cost of living is high.

When I first started teaching, my kids qualified for free federal breakfast and lunches because our income was low enough to be a poverty issuse.

"All that time off" is what teachers use to get their required additional college courses they have to take every so many years, plan for the next year, collect materials, research, and work a second job. And rest. And boy do they need it.

Teachers do not have it so easy as some seem to think. I work from 7:30 to 4:00 at least every day, plus most weekends I am in there at least one day. This week I left after six twice. I leave when I am done, not when the bell rings. Last week I worked both Saturday and Sunday for a total of ten additional hours. I have to show up for extra duties in the evenings at times. I have 35 minutes for lunch, during which I barely sit down because I have so much work to do, I cannot afford to rest. I have no break in the afternoon and one 12 minute break in the morning but only three times a week. The other mornings I have no break and am lucky if I get to go to the restroom one time.

Prep time? I get precious little because of meetings after school. Two days a week we all have meetings, plus I have several other things I was asked to do which require meetings. In Japan, they get an hour of prep for each hour of instruction. I get maybe four hours a week after shool. No kidding.

I have holidays off, sure, but guess where I usually am at least half the time.

I go in two weeks before school opens, not required or paid but necessary, to get the room and materials ready and plan instruction. I spend a lot of my own money on supplies. I bring clothes and food for the kids, because they are poor, cold, and hungry.

If I divide my salary into 183 days of 8 hours each, I make $40 an hour. For an education for 32 children (not counting overhead and benefits) that seems pretty cheap, doesn't it? How much do you pay a day care provider who watches seven or eight kids, per hour? LIke $7 an hour per kid. If you take my salary and figure it with hours actually worked, it is probably closer to $30 an hour. This is a bargain, if you ask me.
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  #12  
Old Feb 3, '07, 7:58 am
vern humphrey vern humphrey is offline
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Default Re: $34.06 an Hour

Quote:
Originally Posted by Benedictus View Post
I think there's some funny business going on here with the numbers.

I imagine most teachers are paid a salary, not hourly, and since most teachers don't work 40 hours a week, 52 weeks a year, their equivalent hourly pay would work out to be artificially high.

According to this the average teacher made $46,597 in 2002-2003, which is far less impressive than $34.06 an hour. Someone who made $34.06 an hour and was paid for 52 weeks of full-time work a year would make about $70,845 a year.
According to http://www.success-and-culture.net/a...ome.shtml#data

The average per capita income in the United States in the same period was $37,500 -- so teachers made about 24% above the national average.

In 2004, women with Master's Degrees averaged $51,316 for full time work (source: http://www.factmonster.com/ipka/A0883617.html), so a teacher would come within $5,000 a year of that figure -- for part time work! If she worked full time, a teacher would make about 140% of the median for a woman with a Master's Degree.
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  #13  
Old Feb 3, '07, 8:00 am
harinkj harinkj is offline
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Smile Re: $34.06 an Hour

Quote:
Originally Posted by vern humphrey View Post
My response is, "If you were really giving them a well-rounded education, you wouldn't have to spend a single minute teaching them to pass that test."
A well rounded education requires one to learn how to think. Doing well on one of these standardized tests requires one to memorize. These are different mental acitivites.

- Kathie
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  #14  
Old Feb 3, '07, 8:06 am
vern humphrey vern humphrey is offline
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Default Re: $34.06 an Hour

Quote:
Originally Posted by harinkj View Post
A well rounded education requires one to learn how to think. Doing well on one of these standardized tests requires one to memorize. These are different mental acitivites.

- Kathie
I again invite you to look at the tests. A person who knows how to think could pass them cold. After all, you have to memorize the multiplication table before you can think your way to the answer to a simple word problem!
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  #15  
Old Feb 3, '07, 8:13 am
harinkj harinkj is offline
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Smile Re: $34.06 an Hour

Quote:
Originally Posted by vern humphrey View Post
........ -- for part time work! If she worked full time, a teacher would make about 140% of the median for a woman with a Master's Degree.
Hey. Why not only pay the police when they are actually arresting someone. Why not just pay airline pilots when the plane is in the air and they are the one flying it. How about only paying engineers when they are making calculations. No money for meetings, travel, et cetera.

I remember a group of engineers standing around drinking coffee and discussing this very same topic -- how teachers had it so easy. The engineers were yapping on the taxpayers money for that 1/2 to 1 hour.

Why do we need teachers at all. Parents could teach their kids to read and then point them to the library. There is no need for mathematics, physics, history, english, or any other classes.

I never learned about Frechet spaces or string theory in any class. I did it by reading.

Schools must be for the ones who need to be spoon fed.

- Kathie
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