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  #1  
Old Feb 13, '07, 4:39 pm
Bennie P Bennie P is offline
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Default A Catholic Recovery Program?

I am Catholic who is in recovery for alcoholism and drug addiction. I am currently involved a Christ-centered 12 step program called Celebrate Recovery which was developed by Saddle Back church in California. It uses basically the same 12 step approach as AA but it has support groups for many different areas of recovery, chemical dependency, co-dependency, sexual addictions, anger, sexual and physical abuse, the list goes on and on. As a Catholic I see a need for a Catholic Recovery program similar to this which puts Christ and the Church as an essential part in the recovery of its members in need. But Celebrate Recovery is a protestant recovery program.
Many in the Church have found recovery in AA and it related programs. But I also see this as problematic for many Catholics which seek help. In AA, NA, al-anon other non-Christian spiritual programs I have seen many active Catholics become more dependent on going to meetings and trashing the Church for never teaching them that God was merciful. I have seen very active Catholics who will go to AA meetings every day of the week and totally quit being involved in parish life at all, things like this I seen hundreds of times.

But I see other problems with AA. I have done alot research on Bill W, the roots of AA and the influence of New Age spirituality in program and its founders. The problem of New Age influence in AA really dates back to its beginnings. Both Bill W and Dr Bob was associated with a spirituality movement which seemed to be a Christ Centered Group as we all know in AA circles called The Oxford Group, Bill pulled away from that group to concentrate on Alcoholics. The Oxford Group went on to be the Moral Re-Armament movement lead by a Dr Frank Buchman. The Catholic Church gave warnings about this group from the beginning, because of its Cult-like evangelism and principles it incorporated. This group became very powerful throughout the world and spread its methods even into politics and non-Christian religions. Its effects spread through many members of mainline churches throughout the world. Bill W incorporated many of the methods used by Bachman into the AA program, he just put a different spin upon them divided them into the 12 steps and begin the movement of AA. Bill W. himself adhered to many New Age and occult spirituality techniques and practices which can be confirmed in biographies about Bill W, even in official AA material. Many things that even Fr Dowling warned Bill about. Of course in the beginning many of the people drawn into AA had Judea-Christian upbringings and it seemed to be a generic form of Christianity. Many will point out the influence Fr Dowling had on the program, but did he have an influence on the program or did Bill W have more of influence on him. Bill W. talked Fr. Dowling to experiment with LSD with him to expand on his spirituality.

My sobriety though 12 stepped based, it is not "AA", it was suggested I go to AA by the leader of the Celebrate Recovery group I attend, during my early days of drying out. I had resigned my job and had too much time on my hands so during those first days of not drinking and having a place to go which had four to five meetings a day was good, but I saw from the beginning that the old timers were drawing new comers away from their Christian beliefs and claiming to have the "Truth" which didn't include Christ in any shape or form. It is strange now how I see many of the guys that started back at that time and how they (the very few still in recovery) have become almost clones of their sponsors. I hear over and over AA members claim to have had a spiritual awakening in one breath then curse God and the Church in the next. These are the old timers in the groups in this area. The only reason I attend AA meetings now is to give encouragement to other Christians that attend, but the longer they are in AA many tend to reject the Church and the vast majority quit doing any Church related activities at all. AA had been accused of being a cult forty years ago by those in the medical society, but now it has become acceptable, which I believe is because so many in the psychiatry field have adopted many of the teachings of Carl Jung into their practices and that New Age influence was one of many of the influences which Bill W bought into. I could go on and on. Do your own research for I'm not an expert, but it might surprise you.

I truly believe that the Catholic Church, those of us Catholics that are in Recovery, need to be more aware of influence of the New Age spirituality on all of our culture and AA in particular and need to actively find a way to serve alcoholics and others in need within the Church more, other then to depend on groups like AA or protestant groups like CR


I do not doubt nor challenge those Catholics that have long term sobriety in AA, nor do I judge their sobriety, what I would like to discuss should Catholics develop a Catholic Christ-centered recovery program and how could we do it?
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  #2  
Old Feb 14, '07, 12:36 pm
LSK LSK is offline
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Default Re: A Catholic Recovery Program?

I am going to suggest something to you...it will mean keeping an open mind and trying something new......go to Lorna Kelly's website and see if you can either order her book or get a CD of one of her talks. If you cannot find it through her website go to Dicobe.com and order AA talks by Lorna K., Father Tom W. out of Oakland, California, Leslie K. out of Modesto, CA, and Kenna McK out of Pasadena, CA. I think you will find that your experience with AA is not the only experience there is....then, look for a room at your parish and see if you can start an AA group at the parish....no, it will not be a "Catholic" AA group but it will be an AA group at your parish....and you will find, as I have, that those people who want to go to AA and truly have a spiritual awakening as a result of the steps will come to your group. If you want to PM me I will share with you my particular experience with doing just such a thing.

Good luck and God bless.....
My experience with CR is similar to the one you have had with AA.... one of the reasons I don't like CR? It is run by one of the evangelical churches here in Modesto and goes out of its way to draw Catholics away from the Truth. I may have to tell people in AA to knock off being a bigot and remind them of the Traditions but all the Catholics I know there - including some with 30 plus years - are still faithful Catholics....
So, do not give up. I didn't like the AA I was attending so I started two new groups.....remember that old AA saying about all it takes is a resentment and a coffee pot?
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  #3  
Old Feb 14, '07, 5:35 pm
Bennie P Bennie P is offline
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Default Re: A Catholic Recovery Program?

Leslie, I don't plan on giving up on spreading the seeds for the idea of a Catholic Christ-centered recovery group. I don't think you understand, I'm not struggling with my sobriety, in fact my sobriety is very sound and I'm very much filled with joy and serenity.

For you see there is already a growing interest for a Catholic Christ-centered program, what I'm looking for is a discussion on the idea and spreading that discussion. Spreading the seed of Christ Love is real and it heals. I see this need and the day will come that I won't go to an AA meeting and hear how the Church failed a Catholic, for the Church will have with in it a loving, caring program that provides the needs of those that find themselves in pain, addiction and need. Or the day I go to a CR meeting and find fallen away Catholics there. Because the Church will meet those needs herself.

Mat 5:14-16 "Ye are the light of the world. A city set on a hill cannot be hid.
Neither do men light a lamp, and put it under the bushel, but on the stand; and it shineth unto all that are in the house. Even so let your light shine before men; that they may see your good works, and glorify your Father who is in heaven."

I would suggest you read these books and find out more about the spirituality of Bill W and the people he looked up to.

Bill W.: a biography of Alcoholics Anonymous cofounder Bill Wilson, Francis Hartigan.
St. Martin's Press, c2000.

The Mystery of Moral Re-Armament, By Tom Driburg, Alfred A. Knopf, Inc., 1964

The Aryan Christ, The Secret Life of Carl Jung, By Richard Noll,Random House
1997
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  #4  
Old Feb 14, '07, 9:50 pm
Bennie P Bennie P is offline
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Lightbulb Re: A Catholic Recovery Program?

For those that want to know more about Matt Talbot
Here is the pledge he took when he decided to give up drinking.

“For Thy greater glory and consolation,
O Sacred Heart of Jesus! For Thy sake to give good example,
To practice self-denial, to make reparation to Thee for the sins of intemperance, and for the conversion of excessive drinkers and addicts,
I will abstain for life from all intoxicating drinks.”
Amen

O Sacred Heart of Jesus! I offer Thee the prayers, works, and sufferings of this day, through the most pure Heart of Mary, in union with Thine, and specially for grace to keep my Pledge faithfully.

O Divine Jesus! Accept me, forever, as Thy victim of Love, prayer, and reparation!

Matt Talbot was not a 12-stepper, when he decided to give up drinking he pledged it off for life(which for many may be asking too much, a day at a time is a biblcal way to live). He went to confession and began a life-long life of penance and good works. Below is the link to official site of The Pioneer Total Abstinence Association of the Sacred Heart which he was a member. The first link is a photo copy of his pledge certificate and the second is his life story.

http://pioneertotal.ie/pioneer/images/matt.jpg

http://pioneertotal.ie/pioneer/fc?action=matt

He is one of many Saints and Venerables I ask to intercede for my love ones, myself and all those I pray for for along with Our Blessed Mother.
JMJ ><>

A good book to read is To Slake a Thirst: The Matt Talbot Way to Sobriety
by Philip Maynard

He is the one and the the only one - Jesus Christ - which heals

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  #5  
Old Feb 14, '07, 11:10 pm
blessedtoo blessedtoo is offline
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Default Re: A Catholic Recovery Program?

I think it's a wonderful idea - a Catholic recovery program. My experience with AA was not quite like Bennie P, in that I don't remember too much Catholic bashing. During my first go around with AA, I was as fallen-away a Catholic as one could get, and if there was any "bashing" going on, I probably would have participated eagerly! But I can relate to the "new age "experience as you described it. I remember being overwhelmed by the whole "high-power of your understanding" thing. AA was very effective the first few years of sobriety, with the help of several wonderful sponsors and a few core meetings that I attended regularly. However, there came a point where I just felt that everything I needed to stay sober I was able to get from God through His Church. With a vigorous application of Catholic moral practices such as daily examination of conscience, humility, chastity, fasting, prayer, I just don't see a need to utilize the 12 steps. After all, if the steps themselves were supposedly based on Judeo-Christian beliefs and values, why not just go straight to the source? I would probably benefit and enjoy meetings where Catholics recovering from addiction were more focused on Christ and applying Catholic principles to their recovering lives.
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Old Feb 15, '07, 1:05 am
Jim Jim is offline
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Default Re: A Catholic Recovery Program?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bennie P View Post
Matt Talbot was not a 12-stepper, when he decided to give up drinking he pledged it off for life(which for many may be asking too much, a day at a time is a biblcal way to live). He went to confession and began a life-long life of penance and good works
Matt died before 12-step programs started, I believe he died in 1928, and AA started in 1934
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  #7  
Old Feb 15, '07, 10:00 am
LSK LSK is offline
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Default Re: A Catholic Recovery Program?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bennie P View Post
Leslie, I don't plan on giving up on spreading the seeds for the idea of a Catholic Christ-centered recovery group. I don't think you understand, I'm not struggling with my sobriety, in fact my sobriety is very sound and I'm very much filled with joy and serenity.

For you see there is already a growing interest for a Catholic Christ-centered program, what I'm looking for is a discussion on the idea and spreading that discussion. Spreading the seed of Christ Love is real and it heals. I see this need and the day will come that I won't go to an AA meeting and hear how the Church failed a Catholic, for the Church will have with in it a loving, caring program that provides the needs of those that find themselves in pain, addiction and need. Or the day I go to a CR meeting and find fallen away Catholics there. Because the Church will meet those needs herself.

Mat 5:14-16 "Ye are the light of the world. A city set on a hill cannot be hid.
Neither do men light a lamp, and put it under the bushel, but on the stand; and it shineth unto all that are in the house. Even so let your light shine before men; that they may see your good works, and glorify your Father who is in heaven."

I would suggest you read these books and find out more about the spirituality of Bill W and the people he looked up to.

Bill W.: a biography of Alcoholics Anonymous cofounder Bill Wilson, Francis Hartigan.
St. Martin's Press, c2000.

The Mystery of Moral Re-Armament, By Tom Driburg, Alfred A. Knopf, Inc., 1964

The Aryan Christ, The Secret Life of Carl Jung, By Richard Noll,Random House
1997
I am so sorry - I thought I had read on a different post that you relapsed after 8 years of continuoous sobriety, that you think members of AA become clones of their sponsors and that you think AA is based on 'New Age Ideas'. I must have misunderstood.

I have read those books you mentioned - my sponsor 'suggested' I do so when I was 2 years sober.

Have you read "The Soul of Sponsorship"? it is the collection of the letters between Father Dowling and Bill W.

Have you read the biography of Mary Mann? That is another fabulous work on AA early founders....

How about anything on Dr. Bob?

One of the reasons I ask you to try and listen to people like Lorna K. is because of her experience, as a member of AA, with Mother Theresa. Mother had an incredible respect for AA because she had NO sucess helping Alcoholics. Lorna, who became so close to her that their correspondence was used by the Vatican during the beatification process, tells an incredible story about where the Twelve Steps and Twelve Traditions are kept in the chapel in Calcutta.

I think one of the biggest problems with alcoholics in recovery is trying to distinguish between what is SAID and what they HEAR. Now, of course I would never suggest YOU suffer from this....I know I do but hey, as it says in the Big Book "We are not saints" (and as the Church teaches - I am called to try and BE ONE).

As an example...I remember when a newcomer (she had about 8 years) spoke in a meeting about smoking marijuana a few days before and not sure if that meant she had relapsed or not...after all, she had not had a drink so is that a relapse? Her sponsor was in the room at the time. After the meeting the newcomer went up to her sponsor and asked her, and the reply was "It has been my experience that if I put something, especially something illegal, in my body to purposefully alter my perception because of the pain I feel stone cold sober then that is a relapse". The newcomer said, "Oh. Ok" walked over to someone else who was three or four feet away and said, "My sponsor didn't tell me I had to reset my sobriety date".

Hang in there, Bennie!
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Old Feb 15, '07, 10:04 am
LSK LSK is offline
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Default Re: A Catholic Recovery Program?

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Originally Posted by blessedtoo View Post
I think it's a wonderful idea - a Catholic recovery program. My experience with AA was not quite like Bennie P, in that I don't remember too much Catholic bashing. During my first go around with AA, I was as fallen-away a Catholic as one could get, and if there was any "bashing" going on, I probably would have participated eagerly! But I can relate to the "new age "experience as you described it. I remember being overwhelmed by the whole "high-power of your understanding" thing. AA was very effective the first few years of sobriety, with the help of several wonderful sponsors and a few core meetings that I attended regularly. However, there came a point where I just felt that everything I needed to stay sober I was able to get from God through His Church. With a vigorous application of Catholic moral practices such as daily examination of conscience, humility, chastity, fasting, prayer, I just don't see a need to utilize the 12 steps. After all, if the steps themselves were supposedly based on Judeo-Christian beliefs and values, why not just go straight to the source? I would probably benefit and enjoy meetings where Catholics recovering from addiction were more focused on Christ and applying Catholic principles to their recovering lives.
This was more my experience and I firmly believe that the graces I received from the Sacraments in my early life saved me again. Now that I am stronger in my sobriety I have no problem telling people from the podium that I am, today, a faithful obedient daughter of the Holy Mother Church and that is because AA started me on the path Home to Rome!
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  #9  
Old Feb 15, '07, 10:51 am
LSK LSK is offline
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Default Re: A Catholic Recovery Program?

It dawned on me that perhaps if I share what I did to help with the sadness I felt dealing with apostates, heretics, new agers and plain old weirdos I met in AA (after all - the name of the program is not Well Balanced People Anonymous) it might get the discussion going in a direction that will help rather than what is beginning to be a "my program is better than your program' and 'I know more about AA and its history than you do" thread.

When I was about 8 years sober I went to a meeting during the height of the priest abuse scandal. As I have stated in previous threads, I live in an area of California that is really full of people who are anti-Catholic and I had been continuously sober for enough time to know that whenever someone said something like "I never learned about forgiveness in the Catholic Church" that they were still learning about their life and would probably change that opinion given good guidance, tough sponsorship and an occasional kick in the pants at group level (verbally, of course!).

But this particular day a man with 9 years of sobriety sat down next to me and in a loud and angry voice said to me, "How in the H**L can you belong to a Church with all those PEDOPHILES in it!".

I have been given a good mind by my Creator and occasionally it works at a quick speed. I said in reply, "Because Truth does not depend upon the state of grace its ministers are in - Truth is Truth, no matter what".

I sat through the meeting but it was so hard. I felt so violated and attacked. I decided that I didn't want to be in THAT meeting any more but I knew that the principles of the steps and traditions of AA were what had begun my journey home and I did not want to lose that either - what was I to do?

I went to my pastor and said, 'We have a lot of rooms here in the Hall...could I have one to start an AA meeting in?". I set up a format, bought some Big Books, registered the meeting with Intergroup and New York and then put my name (not my whole name, in order to respect the traditions of anonymity (spelling? I am a lousy speller for a sober person)) in the bulletin with my telephone number.

We now have a core group of 10 people who have been meeting there every Wednesday night for 7 years. We have, in that group, Catholics, Buddists, Agnostics, Protestants and a practicing Jew. We have watched 6 people come into that group and get sober....four are still sober and come about every two weeks to that meeting when they are in town.

One of the original members, when he started coming to the meeting, had 9 years sobriety and HATED Christians in general and Catholics in particular. Today he is practically an apologist for the Church.

I firmly believe the group is successful because we demand that the Traditions be adhered to as closely as possible and that anyone - ANYONE - who comes into that room who is an alcoholic is welcome.

Because my name is in the Church Bulletin every week (along with having the meeting listed in the AA meeting schedule for the whole area) we get a lot of people who are so scared about getting sober but find comfort in knowing that this meeting is right next to where they go to Mass, do Eucharistic Adoration and meet for the Divine Mercy Chaplet. We may be the only meeting they go to but they are sober and they are learning about AA and how it is not affiliated with any sect, denomination or the Holy Mother Church. More importantly they are learning how to relate themselves to their Higher Power as a Catholic should and in a way that will help them stay sober, one day at a time.

Matt Talbot, my personal choice for our future patron saint, did not simply 'decide' to get sober. He worked closely with his pastor (kind of like having a sponsor), intensely with other drunks (kind of like being in service) and did the Exercises of St. Ignatius of Loyola (kind of like the 12 steps).

If our goal is to help people to get and stay sober, let's look honestly at what has been the most successful way to do that in the past 100 years. It may mean putting aside our own painful experiences and trying to figure out what kind of meeting format would be most attractive to the suffering alcoholic.

My hope is that, along with the (now) TWO meetings a week at our Parish Hall of AA that someone from Al-Anon will step up to the plate and start a meeting for those who love and suffer with us.

BTW - that Catholic Bigot who attacked me at group level? Two years later he came to the meeting, on purpose, and made a public apology to me at group level. He told us that he was doing it at group level because he had attacked me at group level. He further stated that he had made the same announcement at the fellowship where the attack had happened and that the AA(s) there had told him it was HIS responsibility to find me and make proper amends. His amends to me was to be in service to that group for 2 years as our GSR. He is still our GSR and he is now a practicing Catholic. He came home to Rome because of the principles of Alcoholics Anonymous and the Grace of a Loving God.
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Old Feb 15, '07, 2:43 pm
Bennie P Bennie P is offline
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Default Re: A Catholic Recovery Program?

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Originally Posted by LSK View Post
I am so sorry - I thought I had read on a different post that you relapsed after 8 years of continuoous sobriety, that you think members of AA become clones of their sponsors and that you think AA is based on 'New Age Ideas'. I must have misunderstood.

I have read those books you mentioned - my sponsor 'suggested' I do so when I was 2 years sober.
I did post that I relapsed after 8 years of sobriety, but I'm not in a relapse at this time and I have recovered from that, I'm sober and clean. May I add, that relapse had nothing to do with my relationship with AA, for my recovery back then had nothing to do AA. I trully understand what happen that lead me up to that relapse. And that relapse is the past.

Yes I do believe AA is based on a "mixture" of New Age Philosophy wrapped up in Christianity.

I thought I understand that your sobriety date was in "1992" ?, if that is so?then I beleive you are mistaken about reading at least two of those books with one being published in 2000 and another in 1997. That is if you were suggested by your sponsor to read them? The third is a very hard book to find written in 1964 and is out of print. I came across it at my public library while trying to get more information on the Oxford Group.

AA has been helpful for many people. Many Catholics and Catholic leaders have been very supportive of AA. That does not mean the Catholic Church shouldn't have its own recovery program.

Personally I see the need. Others also see the need. A Catholic Christ-centered program would not put AA out of business. But it would give us alcoholics more alternatives for recovery and it would be another tool for evangelizing.

As for AA material I have plenty, I have read plenty.
One of the things Bill W wrote that I like is from As Bill Sees It. from page 21 "I just know that you expected, at some point, to do more then carry the message of A.A. to other alcoholics. In A. A. we aim not only for sobriety--we try again to become citizens of the world that once rejected us. This is the ultimate demonstration toward which Twelfth Step work is the first but not fianl step."BW

But what I like more is what Jesus said: And Jesus came to them and spake unto them, saying, All authority hath been given unto me in heaven and on earth. Go ye therefore, and make disciples of all the nations, baptizing them into the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit: teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I commanded you: and lo, I am with you always, even unto the end of the world.
Matthew 28:18-20

Here is the list of books again;


Bill W.: a biography of Alcoholics Anonymous cofounder Bill Wilson, Francis Hartigan.
St. Martin's Press, c2000.

The Aryan Christ, The Secret Life of Carl Jung, By Richard Noll,Random House
1997

The Mystery of Moral Re-Armament, By Tom Driburg, Alfred A. Knopf, Inc., 1964
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Old Feb 15, '07, 2:44 pm
LSK LSK is offline
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You are correct - I was wrong about two of the books! Sorry about that...however, may I redirect you to my post about my experience starting the meeting? You might like me better then - if not then all I can say is good luck to you and hope you can come up with a good program - I'm sure your heart is in the right place!
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Old Feb 15, '07, 3:46 pm
Bennie P Bennie P is offline
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Originally Posted by LSK View Post
You are correct - I was wrong about two of the books! Sorry about that...however, may I redirect you to my post about my experience starting the meeting? You might like me better then - if not then all I can say is good luck to you and hope you can come up with a good program - I'm sure your heart is in the right place!
Leslie, I have no reason to dislike you. I just feel you misunderstand where I'm coming from and what I'm trying to accomplish with this discussion. I expressing my experience, and conclusions from my own research along with those experiences. I have no wish to discount your own personal experience nor discount you. My sponsor told me once when my previous sponsor and I were not seeing some things eye to eye, and that is "your program is your program, you are the one responsible for it, not your sponsor, not the group, you are responsible."

Thank you for your caring heart.

Trust Him
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Old Feb 15, '07, 3:53 pm
LSK LSK is offline
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Originally Posted by Bennie P View Post
Leslie, I have no reason to dislike you. I just feel you misunderstand where I'm coming from and what I'm trying to accomplish with this discussion. I expressing my experience, and conclusions from my own research along with those experiences. I have no wish to discount your own personal experience nor discount you. My sponsor told me once when my previous sponsor and I were not seeing some things eye to eye, and that is "your program is your program, you are the one responsible for it, not your sponsor, not the group, you are responsible."

Thank you for your caring heart.

Trust Him
Bennie P ><>
Ok Bennie - well good luck.....
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Old Feb 15, '07, 4:23 pm
nana3 nana3 is offline
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Default Re: A Catholic Recovery Program?

The only experience I have with AA is having to go to one meeting during nursing school. I found the people not open to God. They did end it with the Our Father though. That is all I remember. I remember our instructors telling us not to mention God for the program speaks of a "higher power" than oneself and that power is different for many people.

I think it is great that Leslie has had a great experience and has started new groups and many are coming Home to the Church. This is God's Spirit working using her and her group.

I also would have to admit that I would love to see a Catholic Christ-centered group as well. I think it would be great as well. I have a brother-in-law who has been in AA for more than 15 years. He has fallen back to drinking many times though. I truly believe that his problem is not having God in his life and that is why he can't seem to stay sober for years. He is now, according to him, 13 months sober again, but he has lied about his sobriety when he was dating his past girlfriend. I remember him telling us he was sober, but he just admitted that he was not during that time for he seems to go back to drinking whenever he breaks up with a girl. He has other addictions also. He is very addicted to pornography. I could not believe the boxes and boxes of porno magazines and videos when we helped him move. He is also very addicted to sex and has been since the age of 15 yr. old. He lost his virginity at the age of 12, sad but true. Since that time he can't live without it according to him. I think a program that does address all addictions and not just alcohol could help a person like him and others like him. I am not an expert so I don't know if one has an alcohol addiction, if they are addicted to other things as well. I know my husband has more than one addiction as well. I went one time to his anger management group at the Veterans affair and the men in the group that had an anger problem also admitted to turning to alcohol for comfort, but actually were worse in their anger. They had an anger addiction and some of them used whatever to help them feel better and to some it was alcohol and others were prescription drugs.

I would love to see a Catholic program to help with all addictions, but I think it could also turn away many who are not really to have a Christ- centered program.
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  #15  
Old Feb 15, '07, 6:11 pm
Bennie P Bennie P is offline
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Join Date: February 12, 2007
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Default Re: A Catholic Recovery Program?

Quote:
Originally Posted by nana3 View Post
I would love to see a Catholic program to help with all addictions, but I think it could also turn away many who are not really to have a Christ- centered program.
No recovery program is 100% effective, nor do I expect any one to be. All the programs now available do a really poor job. Many that go into recovery are not ready to submit to what it takes to overcome their addictions, nor ready to accept God's loving Grace. But a Catholic Christ-centered program could be a factor of increasing the overall percentage of those that seek recovery to be successful. For it would give another alternative and another option. What else it could do is provide a bridge in the Catholic community to gather more support for those in recovery from those not in recovery. There are many that don't seek out help because of the stigma attached. But if they saw a recovery program that was an important part of the Diocese or Parish ministry, instead of something they had to go outside of the community in order to get, you know like being a leper going off to a leper colony, then maybe more that needed help would seek it out.
Thanks for sharing Nana, Leslie, Jim, & blessedtoo, and thanks for adding to the discussion. My prayers are with you.

Leslie what you are doing in your Parish is very, very Good

In His Grace,
Bennie P ><>
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