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  #1  
Old Mar 13, '07, 8:40 pm
cubalibre cubalibre is offline
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Default Mormon President

Will having a mormon president (you know who)coupled with polygamist challenges at the supreme court level increase the chances of polygamy being legalized in the United States and the LDS returning to the practice of polygamy?
  #2  
Old Mar 13, '07, 9:22 pm
Chris-WA Chris-WA is offline
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Default Re: Mormon President

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Originally Posted by cubalibre View Post
Will having a mormon president (you know who)coupled with polygamist challenges at the supreme court level increase the chances of polygamy being legalized in the United States and the LDS returning to the practice of polygamy?
No way. Polygamy almost destroyed the LDS church once before. Had the Mormon Church continued to defy the U.S. government on polygamy, the church would have died. If the LDS church publicly tried to push polygamy once again they would cease to exist as a large church. Therefore, no Mormon president would ever try to legalize it. A Fundamentalist Mormon would, of course, love for polygamy to be legalized as they still believe and practice it, but no Fundamentalist Mormon would ever be taken seriously as a candidate for the presidency.
  #3  
Old Mar 14, '07, 6:42 am
Allweather Allweather is offline
 
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Default Re: Mormon President

I'm not sure it is far-fetched to think that polygamy could be legalized in the U.S. After all, same-sex marriage is on the march. So, the very definition of marriage is being subjected to examination. The secular notions of marriage could surely embrace polygamy, so you could conceivably have a nexus between Mormons and athiests on this issue, but could not have any common ground between those two groups and Christians.

I agree, though, that a re-run of Mormon polygamy would destroy the LDS as a functional unit. Most LDS women simply would not stand for it. It would wreak havoc within the Mormon church, and leave standing only small groups of fundamentalist Mormons, such as we have now. We must keep in mind that women, especially American women, are not the obedient flowers they were 150 years ago. Then, they had no options apart from marriage, husband, children. Today, they have as many options as men do, so that the idea that women would put up with polygamous husbands the way they were forced to within Mormonism in the mid-19th century, is a crazy idea.
  #4  
Old Mar 14, '07, 7:44 am
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JimR-OCDS JimR-OCDS is offline
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Default Re: Mormon President

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Originally Posted by cubalibre View Post
Will having a mormon president (you know who)coupled with polygamist challenges at the supreme court level increase the chances of polygamy being legalized in the United States and the LDS returning to the practice of polygamy?
Of all the Republican candidates running for president, only one, was married only once to the same woman and that is, the Mormon, Mitt Romney.

Jim
  #5  
Old Mar 14, '07, 8:44 am
Chris-WA Chris-WA is offline
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Default Re: Mormon President

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Originally Posted by Allweather View Post
I'm not sure it is far-fetched to think that polygamy could be legalized in the U.S. After all, same-sex marriage is on the march. So, the very definition of marriage is being subjected to examination. The secular notions of marriage could surely embrace polygamy, so you could conceivably have a nexus between Mormons and athiests on this issue, but could not have any common ground between those two groups and Christians.
I agree that if same-sex marriage becomes legalized nationally there would be nothing to stop polygamy, or any other form of marriage, from also being legalized. But I doubt that the LDS church would support any such effort given the severe backlash they would receive. Even if the prophet claimed a revelation from God for the church to re-institute polygamy, the church would get so much heat from without and within that it would end the Mormon Church as we know it. The only way this could happen with LDS support would be if Mormons controlled the presidency, congress, and the courts. They would have to have their own national theocracy like they had over the state of Utah during the days of Brigham Young and his immediate successors.
  #6  
Old Mar 14, '07, 8:50 am
kell0618 kell0618 is offline
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Default Re: Mormon President

See this CAF thread for more discussion on the topic.

Kelly
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  #7  
Old Mar 14, '07, 3:42 pm
Allweather Allweather is offline
 
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Default Re: Mormon President

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Originally Posted by Chris-WA View Post
I agree that if same-sex marriage becomes legalized nationally there would be nothing to stop polygamy, or any other form of marriage, from also being legalized. But I doubt that the LDS church would support any such effort given the severe backlash they would receive. Even if the prophet claimed a revelation from God for the church to re-institute polygamy, the church would get so much heat from without and within that it would end the Mormon Church as we know it. The only way this could happen with LDS support would be if Mormons controlled the presidency, congress, and the courts. They would have to have their own national theocracy like they had over the state of Utah during the days of Brigham Young and his immediate successors.
Right. The only difference between Mormon polygamy and atheist polygamy is that the Mormons put a command-of-God slant on it. The Mormons would be loathe to be associated with atheists, I'm sure. So not likely there would be any sudden "revelations" unto the prophet in Salt Lake City.

Frankly, I seriously doubt Romney has any chance at the Presidency. The Republicans are so badly fractured right now, they just aren't going to be able to mount a serious run in 2008. A Repub with any chance would have to have a seamless background that could bring the so-called Religious Right into lockstep. The mere fact of his being a Mormon is going to alienate a very large percentage of evangelicals and rightwing Catholics, and they will join the other disaffected rightwingers who will be staying home on election day.

The news for Repubs is terrible, and is going to get worse. Iraq will continue to fester and **** people off. Scandals will continue to float long drowned bodies to the suface. Plus, you've got a couple of extremely personable, fresh, Demo candidates out there who, if they have staying power, will overwhelm the pretty-boy Mormon from MA.
  #8  
Old Mar 14, '07, 3:59 pm
Daniel Marsh Daniel Marsh is offline
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Default Re: Mormon President

There is no need in mormon theology to return to polygamy in this life on earth because they still practice being "sealed" to various women in their temple. A mormon man does not have to get a cancellation of sealing to be sealled to a second or third or fourth woman. Whereas, a woman if she desires to be remarried, re-sealed in the mormon church requires that she get a certificate of cancellation of her previous sealing. Thus if a mormon male, divorces and remarries many times, being sealed each time in the temple, without each wife getting a certificiate of cancellation, he is married to all those women after exhaultation.

http://www.utlm.org/topicalindexc.ht...and%20sealings

http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q...temple+sealing
  #9  
Old Mar 14, '07, 4:30 pm
Allweather Allweather is offline
 
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Default Re: Mormon President

Quote:
Originally Posted by Daniel Marsh View Post
There is no need in mormon theology to return to polygamy in this life on earth because they still practice being "sealed" to various women in their temple. A mormon man does not have to get a cancellation of sealing to be sealled to a second or third or fourth woman. Whereas, a woman if she desires to be remarried, re-sealed in the mormon church requires that she get a certificate of cancellation of her previous sealing. Thus if a mormon male, divorces and remarries many times, being sealed each time in the temple, without each wife getting a certificiate of cancellation, he is married to all those women after exhaultation.

http://www.utlm.org/topicalindexc.ht...and%20sealings

http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q...temple+sealing
That's just the Salt Lake City branch, isn't it? What about the other schismatic Mormons who still practice polygamy here on Earth?

Seems like those guys are having their wives bake their cakes and eat it, too.
  #10  
Old Mar 14, '07, 7:38 pm
PaulDupre PaulDupre is offline
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Default Re: Mormon President

I honestly can't understand why a man would want more than one wife. It must be a completely different mindset about marriage. The only way it seems possible is if the women are seen as mere property of the man; more commodities than people.

LDS apostle Heber C.Kimball, ancestor of recent "prophet" Spencer W. Kimball said "I think no more of taking another wife than of buying another cow".

I think that captures perfectly the polygamous paradigm.

God bless,
Paul
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  #11  
Old Mar 14, '07, 8:27 pm
Allweather Allweather is offline
 
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Default Re: Mormon President

Quote:
Originally Posted by PaulDupre View Post
I honestly can't understand why a man would want more than one wife. It must be a completely different mindset about marriage. The only way it seems possible is if the women are seen as mere property of the man; more commodities than people.

LDS apostle Heber C.Kimball, ancestor of recent "prophet" Spencer W. Kimball said "I think no more of taking another wife than of buying another cow".

I think that captures perfectly the polygamous paradigm.

God bless,
Paul
I'd love to have a whole bunch of women, not necessarily "wives" in the sense of a Christian marriage. I do think that men have a natural desire for multiple partners, while women generally are nest builders. Then again, men can also be very natural muderers, war mongers, thieves, etc. The multiple sex partner thing is just another carnal desire that needs taming so we can be a little higher than the animals. But, gosh, if I believed that God wanted me to have 15 or 20 wives, all pampering me, cooking for me, cleaning the house, maybe send a half-dozen of the better educated ones out into the workforce to bring in some money so I could dedicate myself to being a STUD, why, that'd be just fine. Especially if at least a few of those women were 'round about 18 years old.... hoo boy.
  #12  
Old Mar 15, '07, 7:20 am
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JimR-OCDS JimR-OCDS is offline
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Default Re: Mormon President

Quote:
Originally Posted by PaulDupre View Post
I honestly can't understand why a man would want more than one wife.
I just saw a program on a Mormon sect, where polygamy is
done. The thing I've notice about all polygamist is that the wives always get younger. I've never seen one marry and older woman than the previous one, which seems to suggest that lust is the major motivator.

Jim
  #13  
Old Mar 15, '07, 1:12 pm
PaulDupre PaulDupre is offline
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Default Re: Mormon President

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Originally Posted by Allweather View Post
I'd love to have a whole bunch of women
Well, duh. But multiple wives?
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  #14  
Old Mar 15, '07, 7:24 pm
Allweather Allweather is offline
 
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Default Re: Mormon President

Quote:
Originally Posted by JimR-OCDS View Post
I just saw a program on a Mormon sect, where polygamy is
done. The thing I've notice about all polygamist is that the wives always get younger. I've never seen one marry and older woman than the previous one, which seems to suggest that lust is the major motivator.

Jim
We may've seen the same program. Was it focused on a school teacher who'd "married" a couple of his students? If so, did you notice also that neither "wife" had much in the way of education?
  #15  
Old Mar 15, '07, 7:27 pm
Allweather Allweather is offline
 
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Default Re: Mormon President

Quote:
Originally Posted by PaulDupre View Post
Well, duh. But multiple wives?
I don't think it is possible. Any subsequent marriages would be invalid from the outset, so they wouldn't really be wives.

I wonder how these polygamous Mormons get around the laws against multiple marriages. Maybe they don't actually marry the concubines, but just have some sort of religious ceremony rather than an actual marriage license.
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