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  #16  
Old May 22, '04, 8:59 pm
bemmel bemmel is offline
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Default Re: Placement of the Tabernacle

If a tabernacle is not situated in the front of the church behind the altar, I've always genuflected to wherever it is located, to indicate my reverece before Chirst in the Eucharist.

[Side note:
Does bowing to relics seem like relic worshipping? Or is it showing reverence to the relics of the Saints ??]
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  #17  
Old May 24, '04, 2:34 am
Tyler Smedley Tyler Smedley is offline
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Default Re: Placement of the Tabernacle

I heard a program on Sacred Heart Catholic Radio the other day here in Washington. The official position is that you bow to the altar if it is alone in the church, but if the tabernacle is behind the altar then you genuflect. In the same light you always genuflect to the tabernacle, unless of course you are carrying things then you might want to bow to aviod droping them.
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  #18  
Old May 24, '04, 11:08 am
davemcher5 davemcher5 is offline
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Default Re: Placement of the Tabernacle

Quote:
Originally Posted by Peg
I thought we were to give a profound bow to the Altar because it is a symbol of Christ but to genuflect before the Tabernacle because of the Real Presence?
I will stand corrected! But I will have to look that up when I have more time. - davemcher5
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  #19  
Old May 24, '04, 11:12 am
davemcher5 davemcher5 is offline
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Default Re: Placement of the Tabernacle

Quote:
Originally Posted by bemmel
If a tabernacle is not situated in the front of the church behind the altar, I've always genuflected to wherever it is located, to indicate my reverece before Chirst in the Eucharist.

[Side note:
Does bowing to relics seem like relic worshipping? Or is it showing reverence to the relics of the Saints ??]
The Catholic Church does allow for the veneration of relics and other sacred objects. There is more detailed info in the catechism and canon law, but I'll see if I can get you more information later.
Thanks-davemcher5
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  #20  
Old May 24, '04, 11:50 am
Jack Jack is offline
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Default Re: Placement of the Tabernacle

The tabernacle in any new church should be located in a prominent location clearly visible to all in the main body of the church.
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  #21  
Old May 26, '04, 7:57 pm
Gail Gail is offline
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Default Re: Placement of the Tabernacle

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jack
The tabernacle in any new church should be located in a prominent location clearly visible to all in the main body of the church.
Jack

And those that have removed the tabernacle should move it back. I placed a thread somewhere else that I mentioned that 2 weeks ago we attended Mass elsewhere while we were away for the weekend. They moved the tabernacle which stood on a very simple wooden table several feet to the right from the center. What was behind the altar instead under the crucifix wasn't the tabernacle but the priests chair. Now tell me what is wrong with this picture.

It is also my understanding that there have been cathedrals that moved the tabernacle out of the main body of the church years ago and now they are moving it back again. Good for them.

Gail
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  #22  
Old May 26, '04, 9:50 pm
davemcher5 davemcher5 is offline
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Default Re: Placement of the Tabernacle

Quote:
Originally Posted by bemmel
If a tabernacle is not situated in the front of the church behind the altar, I've always genuflected to wherever it is located, to indicate my reverece before Chirst in the Eucharist.

[Side note:
Does bowing to relics seem like relic worshipping? Or is it showing reverence to the relics of the Saints ??]
Here's some of the the Church (canon) law information on relics, saints, & sacramentals:

Can. 1166 Sacramentals are sacred signs which in a sense imitate the sacraments. They signify certain effects, especially spiritual ones, and they achieve these effects through the intercession of the Church.

Can. 1171 Sacred objects, set aside for divine worship by dedication or blessing, are to be treated with reverence. They are not to be made over to secular or inappropriate use, even though they may belong to private persons.

Can. 1186 To foster the sanctification of the people of God, the Church commends to the special and filial veneration of Christ's faithful the Blessed Mary ever*Virgin, the Mother of God, whom Christ constituted the Mother of all. The Church also promotes the true and authentic cult of the other Saints, by whose example the faithful are edified and by whose intercession they are supported.

Can. 1188 The practice of exposing sacred images in churches for the veneration of the faithful is to be retained. However, these images are to be displayed in moderate numbers and in suitable fashion, so that the Christian people are not disturbed, nor is occasion given for less than appropriate devotion.

Can. 1190 1 It is absolutely wrong to sell sacred relics.

hope this helps - davemcher5
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  #23  
Old May 26, '04, 10:05 pm
kmktexas kmktexas is offline
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Default Re: Placement of the Tabernacle

Quote:
Originally Posted by Angle Girl
What do you think of a parish that is building a new church and have put the tabernacle in the back of the church, in a small chaple, next to the Reconciliation Chaple?

I sometimes attend a church with this set-up and I don't really care for it. These are my reasons.

It is in the back, directly accross from the altar but on the other side of the vestibule. People entering church pass in front of the tabernacle and have to turn their back to the altar to genuflect and then proceed to a pew and bow to the altar. This is awkward (physically) and just feels odd.

After Communion, there is the problem of transferring the remaining consecrated Hosts to the tabernacle. What this church does is send one of the EMHCs with the ciborium to place into the tabernacle. It is my understanding that this should only be done by the priest or deacon but he can't without leaving the altar. Once, I saw a priest leave the Ciborium on the altar until Mass was over and then carry it with him at the Recessional.

I do like this setup better than one where the tabernacle is not visible at all when you are in the main church. But I still prefer the tabernacle right behind the altar - front and center. When our new pastor came, one of the first things he did was move the tabernacle back to that position. It was in a side alcove before.
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  #24  
Old May 28, '04, 12:14 pm
DominvsVobiscvm DominvsVobiscvm is offline
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Default Re: Placement of the Tabernacle

Hey, guys.

One of my posts here was one-worded, and had the word "Dope!" in it. Its since been deleted.

I was not calling anyone a Dope.

I meant to say "D'oh!" ala' Homer Simpson.

I'm sorry for the misunderstanding.
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  #25  
Old May 31, '04, 8:33 pm
Agnes Agnes is offline
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Wink Re: Placement of the Tabernacle

Quote:
Originally Posted by Peg
I thought we were to give a profound bow to the Altar because it is a symbol of Christ but to genuflect before the Tabernacle because of the Real Presence?
Yes, there's a big difference between a respectful bow and genuflection. We ONLY genuflect to the Blessed Sacrament. We only kneel before God. Catholics do not worship idols, therefore we never genuflect (but may bow) to such things as the Crucifix (it's a statue), relics, altars, the Word, etc.

It never ceases to amaze me how on Good Friday when the Tabernacle is empty, people come into church and genuflect. To what?!? Or how when the Blessed Sacrament is exposed, they do not kneel on both knees as they should.

It seems to me geunflection has become just a habit and most people do not understand why they are doing it. Something lacking in their upbringing or education, I guess. Some survey I read said that a large number of Catholics describe the Blessed Sacrament as only a "symbol" of Christ, and do not even understand that God is present body and soul. That makes me wonder why they are Catholic, if you feel that way, it would be so much easier to be a Protestant.
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  #26  
Old May 31, '04, 8:54 pm
JackPaul JackPaul is offline
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Default Re: Placement of the Tabernacle

Prior to becoming a new Catholic, I always wondered why they locked Jesus up in a box. Our RCIA classes were held in an old school behind our Church. The classroom was right next to a small chapel that contained a wall-mounted tabernacle. I always found it kind of funny that when we were in the Chapel we were supposed to be very reverent because we were in the true presence of God. But when we walked around the corner, we could do just about anything we wanted to do. The Idea that Jesus was anymore present in the room next door just kind of made me smile. I didn't think he was confined by time or space, but yet a wall or six feet of distance somehow made a difference. I would feel the same way in the main Church. Some of our buildings have adoration chapels and some have the Tabernacle placed behind the Alter. I still don't see how once we are in the Body, God is any more or less present in either case. How close do we have to get before we need to be reverent? Or how far away before we change our attitude? I think that once we enter the doors and we leave the world behind us for that hour or so, we are there with him, no matter where the Tabernacle is placed.
Just a thought.
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  #27  
Old Jun 1, '04, 3:02 pm
otm otm is offline
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Default Re: Placement of the Tabernacle

[quote=Agnes] We ONLY genuflect to the Blessed Sacrament. We only kneel before God. Catholics do not worship idols, therefore we never genuflect (but may bow) to such things as the Crucifix (it's a statue), relics, altars, the Word, etc.


That is not entirely correct; on Good Friday, we genuflect to the Cross.

Or how when the Blessed Sacrament is exposed, they do not kneel on both knees as they should.


My understanding is that genuflecting on both knees is a tradition, but not a rule. Anyone?
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  #28  
Old Jun 4, '04, 2:04 am
Katie-Scarlett Katie-Scarlett is offline
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Red face Re: Placement of the Tabernacle

[quote=otm]
Quote:
Originally Posted by Agnes
We ONLY genuflect to the Blessed Sacrament. We only kneel before God. Catholics do not worship idols, therefore we never genuflect (but may bow) to such things as the Crucifix (it's a statue), relics, altars, the Word, etc.


That is not entirely correct; on Good Friday, we genuflect to the Cross.
With respect, I am not sure, but I believe you may be incorrect. I was taught, and could be wrong, that we never genuflect to the cross or crucifix. On Good Friday it appears people are genuflecting to the cross (which should be covered or removed anyway if it's Good Friday!), because they are merely genuflecting out of habit when they come into church. Genuflection is only for the Blessed Sacrament. If people are doing it willy-nilly all over the place at other times out of confusion, that's a shame, because that's how we Catholics get a reputation among protestants for worshipping statues and the like.
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  #29  
Old Jun 4, '04, 2:23 am
Katie-Scarlett Katie-Scarlett is offline
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Smile Re: Placement of the Tabernacle

I just copied this from something called "Genuflecting Do's and Don't's". Cannot verify the source, but nothing seems wrong with it to me, but it would help, especially for the young, to have clarity on this issue.
  • We genuflect to the Blessed Sacrament (not to the Crucifix).
  • It's only necessary to genuflect when entering and leaving the church, not every single time you go out of the pew.
  • Bend on one knee, the right knee, and it should actually touch the floor, and slightly bow the head.
  • It's not necessary to make the sign of the Cross, but permissible if customary.
  • If moving about the church for activities, etc, a slight pause before the crucifix or altar, with a bow of the head is respectful. This is of course not the same as genuflecting, but a way to be attentive to God's presence and not have the atmosphere of an auditorium.
  • When the Blessed Sacrament is exposed (Adoration, or as some now call it "Exposition"), we enter the church and genuflect on BOTH knees, and then enter the pew. When leaving, also fully kneel on the ground, bow the head and then rise to leave.
  • Also, some folks come to church now but only stand and bow their head and then sit down. They do not genuflect. Unless age or infirmity prevents genuflection, this is wrong and disrespectful to the Blessed Sacrament.
  • No genuflecting is done if there is no Tabernacle (such as in some Chapels) or on Good Friday when the Tabernacle is empty.
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  #30  
Old Jun 4, '04, 2:37 am
misericordie misericordie is offline
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Smile Re: Placement of the Tabernacle

One of the Vatican II Documents states that the Tabernacle is to be placed in a place of reverence and suitable for prayer. However, NO WHERE in the Vatican II Documents is there any mention that the Tabernacle MUST be all the way in some side corner (some ill-read priests maintain that) or worse yet, in the back of the parish church(Next to the rear entrance). Why is it that the ACTUAL Vatican II Documents have been interpreted according to certain agendas? Why not just follow what the Vatican II Documents ACTUALLY say, insted of what some wish or think it says? In other words the heretical saying by some: the "spirit" of Vatican II. Lets look at the LACK of reverence to Jesus Christ in the Tabernacle in the last 40 years. Has there been for the most part MORE reverence, or less? I think less, and this may also have to do with the Tabernacles being put to the side or to the back. Where have they taken my Lord?
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