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  #1  
Old Nov 25, '07, 4:17 am
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TraderTif TraderTif is offline
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Default How much can a priest change/add to the mass?

So I went to a different parish last night, and the priest had a very....unusual.....style. And I got to wondering about how much can a priest add to the mass? And is there some place where I can look up which prayers are supposed to be said? Because I know that for some parts of the mass, the priest can choose from a number of different approved prayers.....but I just wanted to check.....

Also, I noticed that when the priest gave the Eucharist to the Eucharistic ministers, he just held out the plate (I know the plate has a special name, but I can't remember it now), and the ministers took their Hosts right off the plate. I've never seen that before......are they supposed to do that?
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  #2  
Old Nov 25, '07, 6:07 am
Br. Rich SFO Br. Rich SFO is offline
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Default Re: How much can a priest change/add to the mass?

Quote:
Originally Posted by TraderTif View Post
So I went to a different parish last night, and the priest had a very....unusual.....style. And I got to wondering about how much can a priest add to the mass? And is there some place where I can look up which prayers are supposed to be said? Because I know that for some parts of the mass, the priest can choose from a number of different approved prayers.....but I just wanted to check.....

Also, I noticed that when the priest gave the Eucharist to the Eucharistic ministers, he just held out the plate (I know the plate has a special name, but I can't remember it now), and the ministers took their Hosts right off the plate. I've never seen that before......are they supposed to do that?
Yes, the Sacramentary, also the Roman Missal.

No, they (EMHC) are not permitted to do this.
The only ministers (EM) to be permitted to do this would be a concelebarting priest.
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  #3  
Old Nov 25, '07, 7:33 pm
Manfred Manfred is offline
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Default Re: How much can a priest change/add to the mass?

Quote:
Originally Posted by TraderTif View Post
So I went to a different parish last night, and the priest had a very....unusual.....style. And I got to wondering about how much can a priest add to the mass? And is there some place where I can look up which prayers are supposed to be said? Because I know that for some parts of the mass, the priest can choose from a number of different approved prayers.....but I just wanted to check.....

Also, I noticed that when the priest gave the Eucharist to the Eucharistic ministers, he just held out the plate (I know the plate has a special name, but I can't remember it now), and the ministers took their Hosts right off the plate. I've never seen that before......are they supposed to do that?
From Sacrosanctum Concilium, straight out of Vatican II itself:

22:
1. Regulation of the sacred liturgy depends solely on the authority of the Church, that is, on the Apostolic See and, as laws may determine, on the bishop.

2. In virtue of power conceded by the law, the regulation of the liturgy within certain defined limits belongs also to various kinds of competent territorial bodies of bishops legitimately established.

3. Therefore no other person, even if he be a priest, may add, remove, or change anything in the liturgy on his own authority.

Isn't it simply amazing how those who possess "the spirit of Vatican II" NEVER EVER remember this ruling?
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  #4  
Old Nov 25, '07, 7:49 pm
benedictgal benedictgal is offline
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Default Re: How much can a priest change/add to the mass?

The Mass is not something that we cobble up for ourselves, as Pope Benedict has said many times, most especially in Spirit of the Liturgy.

While there are options that a priest may use for the Mass (Confiteor, Prefaces and Eucharistic Prayers), he cannot deviate from the norm. Furthermore, he cannot use, for example, the Eucharistic Prayers for Children when a majority of the faithful are adults. He also cannot change the words of the Insitution Narrative (Consecration) of the Eucharistic Prayer.

Everything he does is governed by the Roman Missal and the General Instruction of the Roman Missal.

Incidentally, regarding the Distribution of Holy Communion, Francis Cardinal Arinze answered a question (as posted in Adoremus). While the question deals with intinction, he makes some very telling remarks regarding the fact that we receive, not take when we go to Communion:

Quote:
One thing I've seen before [is] where they have the ciborium out, and people come up and take our Precious Lord out of there and dip our Lord into the Precious Blood and place it on their own tongue themselves.

Forbidden. Not correct. Because the nature of the Holy Eucharist is such that the person who is not a priest celebrating the Mass must be given the Body of Christ. You say "amen". And you receive, on the tongue or in the hand. If you are not the priests celebrating Mass -- if you are the deacon assisting -- you must be given [Communion]. You may not take.

Even if you are bishop or cardinal, and you are not celebrating that Mass, you must be given. You must not take.

For example, if you watch us in Rome in St. Peter's basilica or square, when the pope is saying a major Mass, there may be 40 cardinals, 100 bishops. When we are not concelebrating -- we are wearing red vestments but we are not concelebrating -- we are just assisting at Mass as all of you who are baptized. When it is time for Communion, we receive, exactly as everybody else. A deacon comes to us and says "the Body of Christ". I say "amen". He gives to me, and the same for all.

None of us is allowed to take. We must be given. This is the Church law. It is not to lower anybody, it is just the nature of the sacrament. Even when Christ multiplied bread and fish, He told the apostles to distribute it. It was a sign.

So the Church that regulates Eucharistic practice says that the holy Body and Blood of Christ will be given us. We will not take. Only the celebrating priests or the concelebrating communicate themselves. Everybody else must be given it, even if that person is a bishop or a priest.
In other words, we just can't take. We must receive. Furthermore, the Extraordinary Ministers of Holy Communion must receive the vessels from the celebrant and/or deacon. What you described is not supposed to happen.
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  #5  
Old Nov 25, '07, 7:59 pm
Manfred Manfred is offline
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Default Re: How much can a priest change/add to the mass?

Quote:
Originally Posted by benedictgal View Post
The Mass is not something that we cobble up for ourselves, as Pope Benedict has said many times, most especially in Spirit of the Liturgy.

While there are options that a priest may use for the Mass (Confiteor, Prefaces and Eucharistic Prayers), he cannot deviate from the norm. Furthermore, he cannot use, for example, the Eucharistic Prayers for Children when a majority of the faithful are adults. He also cannot change the words of the Insitution Narrative (Consecration) of the Eucharistic Prayer.

Everything he does is governed by the Roman Missal and the General Instruction of the Roman Missal.

Incidentally, regarding the Distribution of Holy Communion, Francis Cardinal Arinze answered a question (as posted in Adoremus). While the question deals with intinction, he makes some very telling remarks regarding the fact that we receive, not take when we go to Communion:



In other words, we just can't take. We must receive. Furthermore, the Extraordinary Ministers of Holy Communion must receive the vessels from the celebrant and/or deacon. What you described is not supposed to happen.

May Benedict XVI live and reign as Pope forever!

But on the off-chance that he doesn't and a new Pope is needed, Cardinal Arinze would be the only sensible choice.
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  #6  
Old Nov 26, '07, 3:20 am
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TraderTif TraderTif is offline
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Default Re: How much can a priest change/add to the mass?

Thanks for all the answers! I've learned a lot!!

Oh, and I wanted to ask about another thing. At the part of the mass where the faithful bring up the gifts, and then the priest holds each one up, and starts praying about "through your goodness we have this bread to offer".......you know that part? At every other mass I can remember, the priest held the bread and prayed, and then held the wine and prayed. But at this mass, the priest held both up and sort of combined "through your goodness we have this bread and wine and these other gifts to offer". Can he do that? Or are they supposed to be seperate?

Where can I get my hands on the proper prayers that the priest is supposed to say......because it sounded to me like the priest really changed a lot.......(in small ways, but I still found it very distracting.)

Last edited by TraderTif; Nov 26, '07 at 3:33 am. Reason: add another question
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  #7  
Old Nov 26, '07, 4:46 am
Br. Rich SFO Br. Rich SFO is offline
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Default Re: How much can a priest change/add to the mass?

Quote:
Originally Posted by TraderTif View Post
Thanks for all the answers! I've learned a lot!!

Oh, and I wanted to ask about another thing. At the part of the mass where the faithful bring up the gifts, and then the priest holds each one up, and starts praying about "through your goodness we have this bread to offer".......you know that part? At every other mass I can remember, the priest held the bread and prayed, and then held the wine and prayed. But at this mass, the priest held both up and sort of combined "through your goodness we have this bread and wine and these other gifts to offer". Can he do that? Or are they supposed to be seperate?

Where can I get my hands on the proper prayers that the priest is supposed to say......because it sounded to me like the priest really changed a lot.......(in small ways, but I still found it very distracting.)
See post #2
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  #8  
Old Nov 26, '07, 6:10 am
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TraderTif TraderTif is offline
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Default Re: How much can a priest change/add to the mass?

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Originally Posted by Br. Rich SFO View Post
See post #2
lol, I'm sorry, what I meant to say was "where can I find a roman missal and/or sacramentary?"
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  #9  
Old Nov 26, '07, 6:36 am
Br. Rich SFO Br. Rich SFO is offline
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Default Re: How much can a priest change/add to the mass?

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Originally Posted by TraderTif View Post
lol, I'm sorry, what I meant to say was "where can I find a roman missal and/or sacramentary?"
A Roman Missal can be purchased at a Catholic book store. The Sacramentary and Roman Missal are books found at the church which you can ask to sit down with and look at when the parish is open. The texts may be on the internet I do not know if they are.
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