Catholic FAQ


Latest Threads
newest posts



Go Back   Catholic Answers Forums > Forums > Apologetics > Social Justice
 

Welcome to Catholic Answers Forums, the largest Catholic Community on the Web.

Here you can join over 400,000 members from around the world discussing all things Catholic. Membership is open to all, Catholic and non-Catholic alike, who seek the Truth with Charity.

To gain full access, you must register for a FREE account. Registered members are able to:
  • Submit questions about the faith to experts from Catholic Answers
  • Participate in all forum discussions
  • Communicate privately with Catholics from around the world
  • Plus join a prayer group, read with the Book Club, and much more.
Registration is fast, simple and absolutely free. So join our community today!

Have a question about registration or your account log-in? Just contact our Support Hotline.

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search Thread Display
  #1  
Old Mar 16, '09, 11:37 am
stringbeanduck stringbeanduck is offline
Regular Member
 
Join Date: August 2, 2007
Posts: 2,644
Religion: Roman Catholic
Default Vatican wealth and church's stance on poverty.

Hello everyone. I have another assignment to find the answer this question. The church clergy take a vow of poverty when they become priests, nuns, bishops, cardinals, pope... Right? Given the church's stance on poverty why does the Vatican have a lot of wealth? Or does it not have a lot of wealth? Do they keep a lot of it? Similar questions are often asked by non Catholics concerning the wealth in the Vatican and it would help know where the church stands on it.
__________________
“Most people choose to have an epigram as their signature.”

-SBD
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old Mar 16, '09, 12:10 pm
SuscipeMeDomine SuscipeMeDomine is offline
Regular Member
 
Join Date: April 19, 2007
Posts: 4,842
Religion: Catholic, Obl.OSB
Default Re: Vatican wealth and church's stance on poverty.

Quote:
Originally Posted by stringbeanduck View Post
Hello everyone. I have another assignment to find the answer this question. The church clergy take a vow of poverty when they become priests, nuns, bishops, cardinals, pope... Right? Given the church's stance on poverty why does the Vatican have a lot of wealth? Or does it not have a lot of wealth? Do they keep a lot of it? Similar questions are often asked by non Catholics concerning the wealth in the Vatican and it would help know where the church stands on it.
Clergy do not take a vow of poverty. (Religious -- e.g., Benedictines, Franciscans, Dominicans, etc. take vows of poverty. But most priests are diocesan priests and do not take such a vow.)

"Why does the Vatican have a lot of wealth?" Does it really?

John Allen has addressed this issue. Here is one excerpt [source]:
• The myth of Vatican wealth. “At the Vatican, everything is for sale, in the popular mind,” Allen said. In reality, the Vatican’s annual operating budget is about $260 million. Allen contrasted that to Harvard University, which has an annual operating budget of $1.3 billion.

“ (Harvard) could run five Vaticans every year and still have pocket change left over for an endowed chair,” Allen said, equating the Vatican’s patrimony - all the assets it could sell - to that of a medium-sized Catholic university. Its total patrimony is $770 million. The University of Notre Dame’s endowment is four and a half times greater, he said.

Allen noted that while people often assume a significant monetary value attached to the artwork the Vatican holds, it is not for sale.

“ The Holy See’s point of view is that the artwork is part of the patrimony of humanity,” Allen said. It is listed as having a cash value of one euro.
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old Mar 16, '09, 1:59 pm
stringbeanduck stringbeanduck is offline
Regular Member
 
Join Date: August 2, 2007
Posts: 2,644
Religion: Roman Catholic
Default Re: Vatican wealth and church's stance on poverty.

I didn't know that before; interesting. Thanks for your imput.
__________________
“Most people choose to have an epigram as their signature.”

-SBD
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old Mar 16, '09, 2:20 pm
Brendan's Avatar
Brendan Brendan is online now
Forum Master
 
Join Date: May 19, 2004
Posts: 13,122
Religion: Catholic
Default Re: Vatican wealth and church's stance on poverty.

One more thing to keep in mind is that a lot of the art work is no longer owned by the Vatican, but by a seperate organization, The Vatican Museum.

This has a similar relation to the Vatican state as the Smithsonian does with the US Federal Government.

Yes, it does one architecural art, such as St. Peter's Basilica. But who exactly would it sell it to, developers?

This would be pretty much the equivalent of the US Government selling Mt. Rushmore to corporate sponsors. Sure, it could fund some poverty programs by selling Bill Gates the rights to put his face up their too. But is that really in the best, long term interests of the nation?

The Church faces similar choices as well in the managment of the architectural art that it holds.
__________________
Brendan
________________________________________ _______
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old Mar 16, '09, 2:21 pm
YADA YADA is offline
Forum Supporter
 
Join Date: October 21, 2004
Posts: 3,674
Religion: Catholic
Default Re: Vatican wealth and church's stance on poverty.

Quote:
Originally Posted by stringbeanduck View Post
I didn't know that before; interesting. Thanks for your imput.

SuscipeMeDomine Great post .....

StringBean also consider this .... if the vatican did decide to sell al of the art master pieces and vatican property ... consider what that would entail ...

Who in this world could/would step up to purchase them? ... Bill Gates, George Soros, Warren Buffett ... what would private ownership do, lock away from public view this heritage of Art? FOR Public purchase only? How about - Arab States [look at what they did to the Budha's?] ... the Russians? .... Even France or Great Brittian .. they would have to place them in a place where they would pay for themselves ...

the average bloke would probably never have the opportunity to view them [and yes, I know you haveto purchase tickets for the Vatican Museums but much is in free public viewing and the Vatican is not for profit] .... and even if he could, now they might be scattered around the world ...

When sold - then what ... the money could be spent on food and other anti-poverty concerns ... even if all of it got to the needy people [and was not stolen or lost - Thugs, Dictators, Black Market] in a short time [very short time IMHO] poverty would be back in the forefront of humanities problems ......

This is not to mention that the faithful [over hundreds of years] have contributed to create the "Vatican" ...

What if you are told that your church and all it contains should be placed upon the auction block .. afterall you can meet together in your homes/garage/yards and celebrate the mass - you could feed the poor in your community withthe assets tied up in your parish church and school [plus you do not need to waste resources on a school - send the kids to public school] you should feed the poor instead ....

How would you respond to seeing your church on the auction block, the statues carted off, the altar bought by someone for a dining room or the stainglass windows appearing in the new subdivision at the edge of town? .....
__________________
Living the Journey,

YADA
Respect Christ - Vote Life
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old Mar 17, '09, 10:43 am
Mark77's Avatar
Mark77 Mark77 is offline
Regular Member
 
Join Date: February 6, 2008
Posts: 2,278
Religion: Roman Catholic
Default Re: Vatican wealth and church's stance on poverty.

Soon it will be taken to pay the attorneys who are now suing the Vatican for the abuse cases.

"And I tell you, you are Peter, and on this rock I will build my church, and the gates of Hades will not prevail against it." Mt 16:18.

While preserving the beautiful artwork as a testimony to the Glory of God and our family heritage as shown through the Communion of Saints is wonderful, it is not necessary.

Jesus is our Treasure, Perfect, Priceless and Eternal in His Love for all.

Sancta Maria, Mater Dei, Ora Pro Nobis Peccatoribus!

Mark
__________________
"EGO SUM PANIS VITAE" "ἐγώ εἰμι ὁ ἄρτος τῆς ζωῆς"
"I AM THE BREAD OF LIFE"

(JOHN 6:35 & 48)



"For man has in his heart a law inscribed by God. . . . His conscience is man's most secret core and his sanctuary. There he is alone with God whose voice echoes in his depths." (CCC 1776).
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old Mar 17, '09, 1:45 pm
rpp rpp is offline
Radio Club Member
Forum Supporter
 
Join Date: October 19, 2006
Posts: 11,713
Religion: Catholic with Traditional leanings
Default Re: Vatican wealth and church's stance on poverty.

One thing to keep in mind about the Church's "wealth" is that the VAST majority of this "wealth" is in property and art. These are not mere non-liquid assets, the Church is actually charged with protecting and preserving them. Do we really want to go tearing down 200, or 1200, year old churches and monasteries because we could make a killing in the real-estate market?

The reality is that the Catholic Church is the largest non-governmental source of emergency aid, medical, educational, housing and food aid and protecting at risk people in the world with billions spent annually. Furthermore, because of the nature of the Church, the clergy and religious, and a volunteer, overhead costs are generally lower than nearly any other organization in the world. The difference is that there is no single entity that does all this. Rather you have organizations like Catholic Charities, Birthright (not strictly Catholic), Catholic Relief Services, Caritas International, various religious orders and societies and dozens of other lay organizations in countries and regions throught the entire world.
Reply With Quote
Reply

Go Back   Catholic Answers Forums > Forums > Apologetics > Social Justice

Bookmarks

Thread Tools Search Thread
Search Thread:

Advanced Search
Display

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


Prayer Intentions

Most Active Groups
8307Meet and talk,talk talk
Last by: Carlos1994
5071CAF Prayer Warriors Support Group
Last by: mountee
4360Devotion to the Sorrowful Mother
Last by: lsbar
4035OCD/Scrupulosity Group
Last by: 3DOCTORS
3853SOLITUDE
Last by: Prairie Rose
3617Let's empty Purgatory
Last by: RJB
3264Poems and Reflections
Last by: PathWalker
3213Catholic Vegetarians & Vegans
Last by: tina777
3205Petitions Before the Blessed Sacrament
Last by: Amiciel
3071For seniors and shut- ins
Last by: tammany



All times are GMT -7. The time now is 9:48 pm.

Home RSS Feeds - Home - Archive - Top

Copyright © 2004-2014, Catholic Answers.