Warnings about Harry Potter

[JharekCarnelian]

As I remarked previously I have no desire to get drawn into an endless maze of nuanced debates on the Potter novels

How.... surprising.

[Portrait]

Originally Posted by cyberwolf001

Honestly. Go take a look at the industry of why Harry Potter and the like are a threat to your kids soul and why you need our (read their) books/DVDs/CDs/Activity book to make sure the souls of these little ones is safe. THEN look at the prices they charge,

My good sir can you say cashing in?

Dear cyberwolf001,

Cordial greetings.

I was not aware that books, CD's etc. written or produced by Christian commentators opposed to the Potter phenomenom were prohibitively expensive. For example, Michael O' Brien's recent book, Harry Potter and the Paganization of Culture (Fides et Traditio Press, 2010) is only just over $20:00. That does not seem excessive as far as religious books of this size go.

Can you give some examples of exorbitant prices that you had in mind, by Christian publishers, Catholic or protestant?



Warmest good wishes,



Portrait



Pax

[Joe 5859]

Originally Posted by cyberwolf001

Honestly. Go take a look at the industry of why Harry Potter and the like are a threat to your kids soul and why you need our (read their) books/DVDs/CDs/Activity book to make sure the souls of these little ones is safe. THEN look at the prices they charge,

My good sir can you say cashing in?

Originally Posted by JharekCarnelian

Why CW how cynical of you.............and truthful.

Well, I am in agreement with the "cynical" modifier, but less so with the "truthful" one.

People like Michael O'Brien are not seeking to "cash in", they are coming from a place of genuine concern over the state of our culture (and the salvation of souls). O'Brien's anti-Potter book is published by some obscure Polish publishing company (and it is only available from them). I don't think he's raking the money in hand over fist. I'm sure his novels from Ignatius Press net him much more revenue (as they should because they really are great books).

I disagree with O'Brien's views of Harry Potter, but I don't question his motives. I don't think his position has earned him many new fans. Quite the opposite. I would bet that people like John Granger are making much more money writing in support of Harry Potter than vice versa.

I think the anti-Da Vinci Code market was a bit more lucrative.

As an aside, I also think it says something that Ignatius Press (who publishes pretty much all of O'Brien's stuff) seems to have taken a pass on his anti-Potter book. In fact, all the Catholic publishers in the U.S. seem to have passed on producing anti-Potter books in general. Many of them (Ignatius Press, OSV, Bridegroom Press, etc.) have published books criticizing "The Da Vinci Code" but not one of them (that I am aware of) has published something similar denigrating Harry Potter.

[JharekCarnelian]

Quite possibly because the Da Vinci code apart from been jaw-dropping in terms of how poor the writing style does contain outright lies and mistruths and fantasies about the Church. Whereas HP so far as I recall does not at any point attack or slander the Church.

[Joe 5859]

Originally Posted by JharekCarnelian

Quite possibly because the Da Vinci code apart from been jaw-dropping in terms of how poor the writing style does contain outright lies and mistruths and fantasies about the Church. Whereas HP so far as I recall does not at any point attack or slander the Church.

Exactly right.

[SamH]

Originally Posted by JharekCarnelian

Quite possibly because the Da Vinci code apart from been jaw-dropping in terms of how poor the writing style does contain outright lies and mistruths and fantasies about the Church. Whereas HP so far as I recall does not at any point attack or slander the Church.

Having read the Da Vinci code (has anyone filed a class action lawsuit over the time wasted on that book yet?) I have to agree. Long, laborious and reaching for credibility that it never attains. The South Park episode about the origins of the Easter Bunny has makes much more sense.

I watched the latest HP movie, not nearly as good as previous installments. The main characters are isolated for long periods of the movie with boring dialog. They just can't carry the movie without the detailed sets and interaction with other interesting/eccentric characters.

[Portrait]

Originally Posted by Joe 5859

Well, I am in agreement with the "cynical" modifier, but less so with the "truthful" one.

People like Michael O'Brien are not seeking to "cash in", they are coming from a place of genuine concern over the state of our culture (and the salvation of souls). O'Brien's anti-Potter book is published by some obscure Polish publishing company (and it is only available from them). I don't think he's raking the money in hand over fist. I'm sure his novels from Ignatius Press net him much more revenue (as they should because they really are great books).

I disagree with O'Brien's views of Harry Potter, but I don't question his motives. I don't think his position has earned him many new fans. Quite the opposite. I would bet that people like John Granger are making much more money writing in support of Harry Potter than vice versa.

I think the anti-Da Vinci Code market was a bit more lucrative.

As an aside, I also think it says something that Ignatius Press (who publishes pretty much all of O'Brien's stuff) seems to have taken a pass on his anti-Potter book. In fact, all the Catholic publishers in the U.S. seem to have passed on producing anti-Potter books in general. Many of them (Ignatius Press, OSV, Bridegroom Press, etc.) have published books criticizing "The Da Vinci Code" but not one of them (that I am aware of) has published something similar denigrating Harry Potter.

Dear Joe,

Cordial greetings and hope all is well.

Hear, hear, well said. Mr. O' Brien is definitely not making any serious money out of writing against the Potter novels. He writes only out of a deep conviction and because he is very concerned, as I and many others are also, about the deplorable paganization of children's culture.

That the Catholic publishers have declined publishing any anti-Potter book might just back-up what I said about there being a conspiracy to silence those who feel compelled, for very genuine reasons, to critique the Potter series. In the interests of fairness and impartiality they surely ought to allow the opposing arguments to be heard, especially from a reputable author and thoroughly decent man like Michael O' Brien.

What People should be asking is why the mainstream Catholic press are so fearful of publishing a book that intelligently and, in the opinion of many of us, cogently argues against this culturally unhealthy series of books. Perhaps they also have some anxiety that their reputation will be seriously undermined by publishing such a hard-hitting and provocative attack against a series of books that enjoys world-wide popularity, even among many Catholics. It really does look that way.

Jolly good too see you on the boards again Joe - deep in controversy yet again!



Warmest good wishes,



Portrait



Pax

[JharekCarnelian]

Originally Posted by Portrait

Dear Joe,

Cordial greetings and hope all is well.

Hear, hear, well said. Mr. O' Brien is definitely not making any serious money out of writing against the Potter novels. He writes only out of a deep conviction and because he is very concerned, as I and many others are also, about the deplorable paganization of children's culture.

That the Catholic publishers have declined publishing any anti-Potter book might just back-up what I said about there being a conspiracy to silence those who feel compelled, for very genuine reasons, to critique the Potter series. In the interests of fairness and impartiality they surely ought to allow the opposing arguments to be heard, especially from a reputable author and thoroughly decent man like Michael O' Brien.

What People should be asking is why the mainstream Catholic press are so fearful of publishing a book that intelligently and, in the opinion of many of us, cogently argues against this culturally unhealthy series of books. Perhaps they also have some anxiety that their reputation will be seriously undermined by publishing such a hard-hitting and provocative attack against a series of books that enjoys world-wide popularity, even among many Catholics. It really does look that way.

Jolly good too see you on the boards again Joe - deep in controversy yet again!



Warmest good wishes,



Portrait



Pax

They probably don't wish to be regarded as laughing stocks akin to Jack Chick's infamous tracts aout such things as the Satanic roots of Dungeons and Dragons.

[John of Woking]

Originally Posted by JharekCarnelian

They probably don't wish to be regarded as laughing stocks akin to Jack Chick's infamous tracts aout such things as the Satanic roots of Dungeons and Dragons.

Never thought I'd say this................but I actually agree with Jack on the 'Dungeons and Dragons' thing.

It always seem to be heavy metal IT geeks who are into it anyway

[Lost Wanderer]

Originally Posted by John of Woking

Never thought I'd say this................but I actually agree with Jack on the 'Dungeons and Dragons' thing.

It always seem to be heavy metal IT geeks who are into it anyway

I can't tell if you're serious but just in case, let me tell you that the people I play it with all the time are all trading card game junkies with a fondness for Japanese comics/cartoons. :P They're pretty much more into J-pop and stuff than metal. :P

[JharekCarnelian]

Originally Posted by John of Woking

Never thought I'd say this................but I actually agree with Jack on the 'Dungeons and Dragons' thing.

It always seem to be heavy metal IT geeks who are into it anyway

Lost Wanderer is rather fond of RPG games and he doesn't strike me as a heavy metal fan. I might fit that category more as I'm kind fond of rock music of many varieties, but then again I'm quite fond of music from a variety of other genres as well.

Jack talks complete nonsense about Dungeons and Dragons, as he does on a wide variety of subjects.

[JharekCarnelian]

There ya go LW confirms he's not big metal fan for you himself. As to Dark Dungeons by Jack Chick, it's even more absurd than I remembered. I googled it up and re-read it.

Some classic quotes from it below.

THE INTENSE OCCULT TRAINING THROUGH D&D PREPARED DEBBIE TO ACCEPT THE INITIATION TO ENTER A WITCHE'S COVEN. Note, I type it in caps as that is how it was originally presented.

'I used the mind bondage spell on my father. He was trying to stop me from palying D&D.'

'Your spiritual growth through the game is more important than some loser's life' (said by the naughty DM after one young girl expresses regret that her friend commits suicide because her character was killed off in the game.)

How can anyone take junk like that as a critique seriously.Much of the pontificating about Harry Potter seems to come from the same sort of place .

[John of Woking]

Originally Posted by JharekCarnelian

There ya go LW confirms he's not big metal fan for you himself. As to Dark Dungeons by Jack Chick, it's even more absurd than I remembered. I googled it up and re-read it.

Some classic quotes from it below.

THE INTENSE OCCULT TRAINING THROUGH D&D PREPARED DEBBIE TO ACCEPT THE INITIATION TO ENTER A WITCHE'S COVEN. Note, I type it in caps as that is how it was originally presented.

'I used the mind bondage spell on my father. He was trying to stop me from palying D&D.'

'Your spiritual growth through the game is more important than some loser's life' (said by the naughty DM after one young girl expresses regret that her friend commits suicide because her character was killed off in the game.)

How can anyone take junk like that as a critique seriously.Much of the pontificating about Harry Potter seems to come from the same sort of place .

Larf. Jack Chick does go overboard. I have no clue about D&D. Always struck me as a bit dark though? Anyway let's not derail the thread....

Now....Back to Fr.Euteneur's comments

[Lost Wanderer]

Originally Posted by JharekCarnelian

There ya go LW confirms he's not big metal fan for you himself. As to Dark Dungeons by Jack Chick, it's even more absurd than I remembered. I googled it up and re-read it.

Some classic quotes from it below.

THE INTENSE OCCULT TRAINING THROUGH D&D PREPARED DEBBIE TO ACCEPT THE INITIATION TO ENTER A WITCHE'S COVEN. Note, I type it in caps as that is how it was originally presented.

'I used the mind bondage spell on my father. He was trying to stop me from palying D&D.'

'Your spiritual growth through the game is more important than some loser's life' (said by the naughty DM after one young girl expresses regret that her friend commits suicide because her character was killed off in the game.)

How can anyone take junk like that as a critique seriously.Much of the pontificating about Harry Potter seems to come from the same sort of place .

You know, that actually reminds me that I have the parody-plot bunny of that tract still locked up in my head. Instead of DnD though, I'm thinking of using Yu-Gi-Oh!. XD

I find it humorous though that Chick Publications hasn't spoken on the matter of fantasy fiction for quite some time now. Is it just me or do I detect a scent of fear that they've been exposed as the idiots that they are?

[JharekCarnelian]

Originally Posted by Lost Wanderer

You know, that actually reminds me that I have the parody-plot bunny of that tract still locked up in my head. Instead of DnD though, I'm thinking of using Yu-Gi-Oh!. XD

I find it humorous though that Chick Publications hasn't spoken on the matter of fantasy fiction for quite some time now. Is it just me or do I detect a scent of fear that they've been exposed as the idiots that they are?

Have you ever seen the Cthulu parody someone did of some of his tracts?

John, much of Dungeons and Dragons is your generic fantasy world with Dragons and Elves and Orcs as borrowed from Tolkien and a variety of various myths.

So far we seem to be generating an absurd number of false dilemmas yet again. As usual it's you can't like HP and be a good Catholic which is the motivating factor behind many of the arguments against the books. Personally I'm no great fan of them, I could live with or without them but I am bemused at the strong feelings they generate. And quite honestly John is unusual in been one of the few non-Americans I've seen to have strong feelings about the issue. As I've said before much of this anti HP/fantasy literature/RPG games etc. seems to be bleed-over from fundamentalist Christians. It is certainly totally alien to me as no-one ever regarded my like for fantasy literature or sci-fi as Satanic when I was younger.