Tithing and/or giving to the Church

[Holly3278]

Does the Church require that we tithe or give monetarily to the Church? What if we can't afford to do so because we have little or no income?

[JRKH]

Originally Posted by Holly3278

Does the Church require that we tithe or give monetarily to the Church? What if we can't afford to do so because we have little or no income?

So far as I know there is no requirement, nor is there a set amount. Each is to give as they are able.

That being said, there are ways to give that do not involve money. Volunteering is a great way to give back for all we recieve from the Church.

Peace
James

[StillWondering]

Yep, there is no requirement to tithe. Especially when one does not have an income or ability to give to the Church, the Church will benefit a great deal more for that person to feed and nourish themselves and live a good life. We are a community, so every good thing we do strengthens us all. And the Church is here to help us reach God, so the money we donate is for this purpose -- even when it is indirect. On the other hand, a wealthy person cannot bring their worldly wealth with them so it would be logical that they use their money well to aid others, by donating to the Church or aiding truly loving and productive civil services.

Also mentioned is the truth that besides giving money there are many other ways of giving. One that is important and often neglected is prayer. A small prayer here and a small prayer there can have tremendous impact for the Church and the local parish. Another way is to volunteer time, or skills such as cooking or artistry.

This conversation reminds me of the "Logic of Gratuity". I just recently watched this clip and really thought it was simple explanation to me. Below is a clip and complementary article from wordonfire.org where Fr. Barron talks about Pope Benedict XVI's encyclical that really gets the the heart of this giving.

Video clip:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3TzfJ...embedded#t=411
Article:
http://www.wordonfire.org/Written-Wo...-Gratuity.aspx

[steve975]

I've been strongly considering tithing myself and came here today to ask about this.

For those who tithe, can you provide some input as you how you do it? Do you calculate 10% of your gross income and then give that amount to the Church? Do you do it in installments throughout the year? And do you give it to your local parish or somewhere else? Does giving to another charity count towards the tithe?

I'm also wondering if it's possible to tithe anonymously so that the Church (or charity) doesn't know it's you.

I'm also wondering how this works for tax purposes. When you do your annual taxes, do you deduct the amount that you tithed? And do you do this for both federal and state taxes? Is this even allowed for federal and state tax returns?

My analysis seems to indicate that if you can deduct a tithe from federal taxes, then not only does the Church get the tithe, but the government ends up getting less from you in taxes. This seems like an added benefit in that you can lessen the amount the government gets, which I think is great because the government often spends corruptly and immorally.

I'm strongly considering this and would like some input on what the entire process entails. Thanks.

[JRKH]

Originally Posted by steve975

I've been strongly considering tithing myself and came here today to ask about this.

For those who tithe, can you provide some input as you how you do it? Do you calculate 10% of your gross income and then give that amount to the Church? Do you do it in installments throughout the year? And do you give it to your local parish or somewhere else? Does giving to another charity count towards the tithe?

I'm also wondering if it's possible to tithe anonymously so that the Church (or charity) doesn't know it's you.

I'm also wondering how this works for tax purposes. When you do your annual taxes, do you deduct the amount that you tithed? And do you do this for both federal and state taxes? Is this even allowed for federal and state tax returns?

My analysis seems to indicate that if you can deduct a tithe from federal taxes, then not only does the Church get the tithe, but the government ends up getting less from you in taxes. This seems like an added benefit in that you can lessen the amount the government gets, which I think is great because the government often spends corruptly and immorally.

I'm strongly considering this and would like some input on what the entire process entails. Thanks.

Since there is no requirement for tithing I can only say that the process entails whatever seems best to you.
My only suggestion in this would be Christ's observation regarding the widow's mite. That is, Giving only from ones excess versus giving what we truly are able. Only the individual and God can decide what is just.

Peace
James

[Vision]

That is a very good question. Alms giving is not just about giving money, but also about giving up your time. In reality, time is money in today's world. There are a lot of ways in which the Church can benefit more from your time than it can with your money. You have talents that nobody else has that would benefit the Church greatly.

I wrote a piece about this concept on my blog. If you want to view it, you can check it out here: Help the Church by Tithing Smarter

Let me know what you think.

[RosalieM]

Now I'm confused. I thought it was mandatory to give to the Church. Last week I was really hard pressed. I'm in the Church choir. Would that be considered giving? It amounts to about 4 hours a week in ordinary time. During the holidays it's more.

[StillWondering]

Originally Posted by steve975

I've been strongly considering tithing myself and came here today to ask about this.

For those who tithe, can you provide some input as you how you do it? Do you calculate 10% of your gross income and then give that amount to the Church? Do you do it in installments throughout the year? And do you give it to your local parish or somewhere else? Does giving to another charity count towards the tithe?

I'm also wondering if it's possible to tithe anonymously so that the Church (or charity) doesn't know it's you.

I'm also wondering how this works for tax purposes. When you do your annual taxes, do you deduct the amount that you tithed? And do you do this for both federal and state taxes? Is this even allowed for federal and state tax returns?

My analysis seems to indicate that if you can deduct a tithe from federal taxes, then not only does the Church get the tithe, but the government ends up getting less from you in taxes. This seems like an added benefit in that you can lessen the amount the government gets, which I think is great because the government often spends corruptly and immorally.

I'm strongly considering this and would like some input on what the entire process entails. Thanks.

As for tithing itself, if you will to commit to it and are financially blessed to have this calling then go for it. The will really helps in staying strong from my experience/failures =).

I heard on the car radio just yesterday while getting gas at Costco that the priest suggest donating from your disposable income, because government taxes and certain necessity are forced upon us. Some things may seem to be necessity but are really luxuries, well then they would be part of the disposable income. Things such as setting money aside to visit your kids far away or to pay for CCD classes for your kids would be necessity from my understanding. Other things such as going to an upscale restaurant to praise oneself and buying unneeded clothes and jewelry would be luxuries from my understanding.

So then you take your income, subtract taxes and cost of needs for a healthy family and self, then you get your personal disposable income in terms of tithing. Take 10% from this and give at once or spread out. This is only a suggestion to give a perspective.

As for donating to the parish or others, as long as they all work to bring about salvation directly or indirectly and are not contradictory to the Church's teachings which comes through Christ's teaching and ministry, then either will work fine. In general, helping your parish more would be more useful. This depends on the parish, but your kids will be attending there, the kids of the other parishioners will be attending there, and all the people that has a local and personal help for you in the parish will be attending there. We are all called to do small things with great love and a parish is a nice place to place that love. In what you give, make sure it goes towards salvation in love than I think you will be good.

In regards to some details. Giving all at once could provide for larger projects for those you will be helping such as replacing the old stereo system for your parish so that everyone can hear the liturgy more clearly or funding a missionary trip for a priest to reach out to a very poor area such as Haiti or Cambodia. At the same time, small funds given regularly help keeps parishes running smoothly and pay for operational costs of charities. So both is great, it just depends on how you would like the money spent. In the end though, after you give the money you are not the administrator of that money anymore. Your intentions would be respected but sometimes it may need to be worked out in a different way then what you plan.

And as for having tax reductions, some parishes and charities can definitely do this for you. They are non-profit organizations and can get the letters that you will need on your tax return forms. I am not fortunate enough to give in any noticeable amount so I am unsure of where on the form. There should be a place for tax deductions due to charitable giving. Just another note, some parishes may not have the personal knowledgeable in doing tax exemptions or some type of gifts do not qualify such as paper cash, but if you you feel this is important, the diocese can help the individual parish with the proper paperwork so you can give as you wish and as God calls you to.

[RosalieM]

The fifth precept ("You shall help to provide for the needs of the Church") means that the faithful are obliged to assist with the material needs of the Church, each according to his own ability. . . The faithful also have the duty of providing for the material needs of the Church, each according to his own abilities. (CCC 2043)

Just found this. It's mandatory after all.

[StillWondering]

Originally Posted by RosalieM

Now I'm confused. I thought it was mandatory to give to the Church. Last week I was really hard pressed. I'm in the Church choir. Would that be considered giving? It amounts to about 4 hours a week in ordinary time. During the holidays it's more.

Yes this is definitely a way to give to the Church. From what I understand it is not mandatory to give to the Church but it is a practice of virtue. The Church needs our donations since it is not a company running on worldly products but a spiritual developer existing in a physical way with physical costs and duties. At the same time, the Church, from my understanding, acts as a child -- helpless and in need of care in the same way as the child referenced by Jesus in the Gospel last Sunday -- so that we may care for and support the Church and in turn grow in ourselves.

Your example of serving in the choir is a way to serve the Church, which is both the physical ecclesiastical community as well as all of it's members as the Body of Christ, as well as a way to receive the graces of God through the virtue of giving. It's the logic of gratuity.

[StillWondering]

Originally Posted by RosalieM

The fifth precept ("You shall help to provide for the needs of the Church") means that the faithful are obliged to assist with the material needs of the Church, each according to his own ability. . . The faithful also have the duty of providing for the material needs of the Church, each according to his own abilities. (CCC 2043)

Just found this. It's mandatory after all.

I stand corrected =).

In the case of those without means, would they not be dispensed from service and material support? If so then maybe both is true. It is mandatory but for some the mandatory amount may be nothing more than being faithful. Like children who are dependent to their parents, if their family is poor and they do things to help out the family all the time, what they can give is there total respect and attention on the days they are able to attend Mass.

[RosalieM]

I think this might bring to mind the poor widow who gave a tiny amount; but it was all she had. The point was to give something according to means or lack thereof.
It might mean that some people can give a lot and others, very little. But everyone should try to give something and if they are without means, then a small amount....a dollar...fifty cents...a quarter.
To tell the truth, I've been conflicted about this of late. I see our pastor and vicar taking vacations to europe and one drives a Mercedes...and I struggle with giving a paltry amount in the weekly envelope. For all I know, the pastor and vicar could have saved their pennies all year and the Mercedes could have been a gift.
That's my problem recently and I wondered why my parish would need my donation at all especially since I give of my time and energy in the choir. I've decided to divide my alms giving between my parish and charitable organizations like SVDP and Food for the Poor; giving less to the parish and more directly to those in need. Organizations like Food for the Poor can somehow translate five dollars into hundreds of dollars worth of help. I also plan to carry change in my pocket at all times for street beggars who I avoided in the past. A dollar can buy a bean burrito at Taco Bell.

[puzzleannie]

Originally Posted by RosalieM

Now I'm confused. I thought it was mandatory to give to the Church. Last week I was really hard pressed. I'm in the Church choir. Would that be considered giving? It amounts to about 4 hours a week in ordinary time. During the holidays it's more.

it is a law of the Church that we support our parish and the universal Church and her ministries according to our means. It is not and never has been required that Catholics tithe, i.e. devote a certain dollar amount or percent of income. Many parishes and dioceses have stewardship campaigns that use guidelines based on income and ask for pledges, as a way of reminding us of our priorities, but those are guidelines, not laws.

Yes a spirituality of stewardship means we count our time, talent and treasure as gifts from God, on loan, not as our own possessions or earned through our own merits, and that in recognition of this we give back to the Church and God's poor, out of our material wealth, sharing our talents and our time.

This is a call of our baptism, not a confirmation project, by the way.

bear in mind the parish that appears wealthy may in fact be made up of people who are now struggling financially, or conversely, may be the source of much of the material aid to the poor in surrounding communities.

The amount of your gift is irrelevant, what counts is the spirit behind the gift, as with any other spiritual sacrifice. a rich person who gives $100 each week that represents .0001 of his income gives less than a poor person who gives his last dollar and goes without breakfast, because he was moved by the story of the missionary who made his appeal this week.

[StillWondering]

Originally Posted by RosalieM

I think this might bring to mind the poor widow who gave a tiny amount; but it was all she had. The point was to give something according to means or lack thereof.
It might mean that some people can give a lot and others, very little. But everyone should try to give something and if they are without means, then a small amount....a dollar...fifty cents...a quarter.
To tell the truth, I've been conflicted about this of late. I see our pastor and vicar taking vacations to europe and one drives a Mercedes...and I struggle with giving a paltry amount in the weekly envelope. For all I know, the pastor and vicar could have saved their pennies all year and the Mercedes could have been a gift.
That's my problem recently and I wondered why my parish would need my donation at all especially since I give of my time and energy in the choir. I've decided to divide my alms giving between my parish and charitable organizations like SVDP and Food for the Poor; giving less to the parish and more directly to those in need. Organizations like Food for the Poor can somehow translate five dollars into hundreds of dollars worth of help. I also plan to carry change in my pocket at all times for street beggars who I avoided in the past. A dollar can buy a bean burrito at Taco Bell.

I have a couple of thoughts. There was a really great priest I knew when I was younger. He was really pious and loving from what I can see. He was also very well loved by the parish community. We all know this priest does not have much money and the community is relatively pretty poor. However he would give gifts to us an we would not accept. The more wise people would ask him to pray instead. He loves us so much and have so little yet still want to give us gifts each time he spends time with us. I felt bad for not accepting his gift that time he was visiting our youth group. That's how loving he is, but he is also very humble and took back his gift. He had a frown on his face when he had to take his gift back but he still did.

Now at the same time many parishioners keep giving gifts to the priest and he has so much trouble turning them down when they keep coming. So one day he felt very guilty and accepted this very beautiful chasuble. Well I do not know what others may think after he leaves to another parish but the people that were there with him when he receive the gift was really happy for him when he accepted the gift. If he was working at a rich parish he may have to accept a few very pricey gift. But I know him so I would not worry about him so much. I hope your priests are like him or even more wonderful.

[Holly3278]

Ok, I'm confused. What if I don't have any money to give? I currently have no income except for the $26 a week that my grandparents give me for gas. I usually have some left over though. Should I give what I have left over? Also, I am trying to pay back my boyfriend for some money he loaned to me. Which should be my priority? Paying him back or giving to the Church?