Annulment process in Los Angeles

JNo · #1 Sep 26, '09, 12:34 pm

Does anyone have experience or knowledge of how long, on average (I know every case is different, but just an average), it takes for the annulment process in the Archdiocese of Los Angeles? Any experience with the Marriage Tribunal you can share?

Thanks so much!

dulcissima · #2 Sep 26, '09, 3:17 pm

I was told 12 to 15 months by someone on the Tribunal. He recommended that if your case could be heard by a Tribunal in a smaller diocese, that would probably be quicker because the Archdiocese of Los Angeles has its hands full not only with all of the nullity petitions but also with the sexual abuse scandal.

You can have your case heard in either the diocese in which you were married, the diocese in which the respondent lives, or the diocese in which you currently live.

JNo · #3 Oct 3, '09, 4:31 pm

The annulment is for a non-Catholic living in LA, was married in LA, with the Catholic Respondent also living in LA, so I don't think there are any other options. The Petition was filed in April and as of this last week, the Petitioner was told they were getting ready to phone witnesses. How much longer after this? Obviously, the non-Catholic doesn't have a Parish Priest to help them out, so the case is with someone at the Marriage Tribunal. Getting updates tends to be challenging. Any thoughts on how much longer or how to get the process moving faster?

plato3 · #4 Oct 5, '09, 8:49 am

Interesting case. The non-Catholic is getting the annulment? If there is no contesting of the facts, some cases take as little as 6 months and some up to 2 years. A recent case that I am familiar with caused quite a stir because one of the parties was trying to cite conduct after the marriage as means for the annulment. An annulment is not a Catholic divorce. An annulment declares that there was never a Sacramental marriage in the first place. There has to be some problem found that existed before the marriage such as form, information kept from one party about having children Etc. You can phone the tribunal.

OLHope · #5 Oct 5, '09, 9:19 am

I have heard 6-months the shortest as well for an American annulment. Three years the longest... I have heard there is a bit of testimony and paperwork, so my guess is that is moves along like the American legal system..., as soon as all your homework is done, it just takes the process of going through the tribunal system, that may depend on who is already ahead of you in the process. You do need a legal divorce decree before filing for your annulment.

Count your lucky stars, most places in EU take over 10 years for a legal divorce, and then another 10 years for an annulment, IF you are granted one. They make it impossible for you to break off the marriage.

dulcissima · #6 Oct 5, '09, 9:53 am

Really, the only thing that you can do to make the process move any faster is to encourage any witnesses to submit their testimony promptly.

I wouldn't anticipate the case taking any less than a year. The process itself is long, and the length of time varies widely since witnesses are contacted. The Tribunal in Los Angeles is also swamped.

I would see if they have a preference for email or phone call contact. Really though, they have a system set up for handling it. Its best to just sit tight and wait, since there isn't anything you can do to make it go faster.

LaLucia · #7 Oct 5, '09, 12:30 pm

Hi Everybody, I am also going through the annulment process in L.A. There was a problem that I was assigned to a different priest and a different parish by my Tribunal Advocate. When I called the Advocate he was totally clueless. So I sent him my second set of papers with my parish priest signing the papers who is helping me. I also sent him a Church Newsletter with the printed name of my church and the printed name of my priest because the Advocate didn't seem to know that my catholic church exsisted.LOL.

My Advocate sounds like a senior who should be retired from working at the Tribunal. Yes, I am being very critical of the process and the mistakes that the Tribunal makes.

This is why I am asking all of you to pray that the L.A. Tribunal does a better job of processing the annulment papers and also stays in touch with all the L.A. Catholic parishes with the latest information that is needed for an annulment.

My church still had the old annulment papers that have been revised recently by the L.A. Tribunal. The process fees have gone up and I paid the old process fee that was accepted by the Tribunal. So.... that was good. Plus, I had to pay more money for the next set of papers that needed to be sent to the Tribunal. Plus, they said in my letter that if there were extra fees due to asking a doctor or a counselor to speak to me that it would cost me $75. per hour. I had to sign papers saying I would pay it. But I have 100% insurance to pay for therapy counselors. If I have to see a counselor I will ask the Tribunal that I plan to pay it with my insurance.

My two witnesses are out of town working and will not return until sometime in December.
That will slow down my annulment too.

I was hoping to get my annulment before Christmas so it would be a gift to my ex-spouse who is Catholic and married to his Catholic wife. They are able to attend church but not receive the presence of Christ in the Eucharist.

I would like for my annulment to open the door for my ex-spouse to get married by the Catholic church. He got married by the civil court.

My ex-spouse is very ill and is an alcoholic that is creating medical problems for him. He is too ill to file for the annulment so my adult son asked me to do it for his father.

My marriage was not blessed by God so I have a good case. We were both teenagers wanting to get away from our alcoholic parents. There were a lot of other problems too.

I do not wish to get married again because I have physical and psychological problems.

It doesn't really matter to me how long my annulment takes to be granted because I have plenty of time to get it done. Plus, it seems like my case will be taking some time due to all of the information I sent to the Tribunal.

I think my Tribunal Advocate is thinking....Oh my gosh! He most likely put my case file under the easier cases.LOL. I truly believe that because I wrote a lot of pages telling my life story before and after my marriage it will take longer to check things out to see if it is the truth.
Looking back I think I should have written some simple answers on the questions.

As you all can see.... I love to write and tell my annulment story. Please pray for me. Lucia

JNo · #8 Oct 5, '09, 8:33 pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by plato3

Interesting case. The non-Catholic is getting the annulment? You can phone the tribunal.

The non-Catholic is my boyfriend/soon-to-be fiance. I am the Catholic. We weren't planning on getting engaged until he has an annulment, because we can't plan for anything until/unless he gets an annulment. I want to be married in the Catholic church.

He just needs to get through the annulment process though. He was married civally and then got married in the church 5 years later and then divorced 2 years after that. His ex just wanted the big white, church wedding...she wasn't even a regularly practicing Catholic. Because of that, he needs the annulment in order to marry me.

We live 1500 miles apart (I live in Kansas City) and would like to get married soon so we can be together (I absolutely will not live together before marriage). Our ideal is to get married next October, but if the annulment doesn't even come through until next April or beyond, I don't see how we'll be able to get married in my church since they want 9-12months notice prior to the tentative wedding date. Sigh... Anyway, this is why I want this to move along as quickly as possible, but without a priest helping my boyfriend along, I feel like his case is just kind of floating around aimlessly. The Tribunal never returns his phone calls. It's only after many calls that he finally gets to talk to the person handling his case.

Do you think asking my priest in KC to follow up on it would help any?

LaLucia · #9 Oct 5, '09, 9:26 pm

Since your fiance is a non-Catholic he has to be confirmened in the Catholic church first before he can marry you in the catholic church. He has to attend RCIA meetings in order to become Catholic.
Hey everybody....am I wrong in this information. Can a non-Catholic get married in the Catholic church with a Catholic? I am confused. Lucia

JNo · #10 Oct 6, '09, 3:50 am

Yes, a non-Catholic can marry a Catholic in the Catholic church. This happens all the time. The only difference comes along when the non-Catholic party has not been baptized in a Christian religion that believes in the Trinity. When this happens, a special dispensation from the Bishop is required in order to be married in the Catholic. It is called Dispensation from Disparity of Worship. It basically says that the non-Catholic party won't interfere with the Catholic party's faith, or try to pull them away from the church and that any children born of the marriage will be raised in the Catholic church. When a marriage like this occurs, between a non-baptized person and a Catholic, the marriage is not considered a Sacramental Marriage. It is a marriage nonetheless and fully accepted by the church (in addition to the fact that it is a marriage performed in the church when a Dispensation has been granted).

Seatuck · #11 Oct 6, '09, 4:49 am

Quote:

Originally Posted by LaLucia

Since your fiance is a non-Catholic he has to be confirmened in the Catholic church first before he can marry you in the catholic church. He has to attend RCIA meetings in order to become Catholic.
Hey everybody....am I wrong in this information. Can a non-Catholic get married in the Catholic church with a Catholic? I am confused. Lucia

Yes Catholics can marry non catholics with a dispensation. Non catholics do not have to receive any sacraments. They do not have to attend RCIA although it is a good thing for them to do so they can understand being married to a Catholic. Most non catholics are quite surprised by many things we teach about marriage such as contraception being a mortal sin and so on.

Seatuck · #12 Oct 6, '09, 4:51 am

Quote:

Originally Posted by LaLucia

Hi Everybody, I am also going through the annulment process in L.A. There was a problem that I was assigned to a different priest and a different parish by my Tribunal Advocate. When I called the Advocate he was totally clueless. So I sent him my second set of papers with my parish priest signing the papers who is helping me. I also sent him a Church Newsletter with the printed name of my church and the printed name of my priest because the Advocate didn't seem to know that my catholic church exsisted.LOL.

My Advocate sounds like a senior who should be retired from working at the Tribunal. Yes, I am being very critical of the process and the mistakes that the Tribunal makes.

This is why I am asking all of you to pray that the L.A. Tribunal does a better job of processing the annulment papers and also stays in touch with all the L.A. Catholic parishes with the latest information that is needed for an annulment.

My church still had the old annulment papers that have been revised recently by the L.A. Tribunal. The process fees have gone up and I paid the old process fee that was accepted by the Tribunal. So.... that was good. Plus, I had to pay more money for the next set of papers that needed to be sent to the Tribunal. Plus, they said in my letter that if there were extra fees due to asking a doctor or a counselor to speak to me that it would cost me $75. per hour. I had to sign papers saying I would pay it. But I have 100% insurance to pay for therapy counselors. If I have to see a counselor I will ask the Tribunal that I plan to pay it with my insurance.

My two witnesses are out of town working and will not return until sometime in December.
That will slow down my annulment too.

I was hoping to get my annulment before Christmas so it would be a gift to my ex-spouse who is Catholic and married to his Catholic wife. They are able to attend church but not receive the presence of Christ in the Eucharist.

I would like for my annulment to open the door for my ex-spouse to get married by the Catholic church. He got married by the civil court.

My ex-spouse is very ill and is an alcoholic that is creating medical problems for him. He is too ill to file for the annulment so my adult son asked me to do it for his father.

My marriage was not blessed by God so I have a good case. We were both teenagers wanting to get away from our alcoholic parents. There were a lot of other problems too.

I do not wish to get married again because I have physical and psychological problems.

It doesn't really matter to me how long my annulment takes to be granted because I have plenty of time to get it done. Plus, it seems like my case will be taking some time due to all of the information I sent to the Tribunal.

I think my Tribunal Advocate is thinking....Oh my gosh! He most likely put my case file under the easier cases.LOL. I truly believe that because I wrote a lot of pages telling my life story before and after my marriage it will take longer to check things out to see if it is the truth.
Looking back I think I should have written some simple answers on the questions.

As you all can see.... I love to write and tell my annulment story. Please pray for me. Lucia

I am praying for you now. This is a good and kind thing you are doing.

LaLucia · #13 Oct 6, '09, 12:47 pm

Seatuck, thank you so much for your prayers. I hope that other people who read my annulment case here in this website will pray that I get the annulment for my ex-spouse and for myself.
I am praying and hoping to get the annulment by Christmas so it will be a gift to my ex-spouse. It is a possitive thing that I am doing.

I truly believe in prayers so starting today I am going to ask my Bible class friends to pray for me and also ask as many people as possible to pray that I get my annulment.
PEACE, Lucia

JNo · #14 Oct 6, '09, 6:29 pm

My boyfriend called today to tell me he got a letter in the mail from the Case Coordinator at the Tribunal advising him that they want him to see a psychologist. It said something about getting a better understanding of the circumstances around the marriage. It gave the name of the counselor and said that he needed to find out the terms of the sessions, etc... before he agrees to anything. That doesn't make much sense. If the Tribunal has told him he needs to see this particular counsel for an evaluation, why are there "terms" that need to be reviewed? It doesn't say anything about whether this is just a one time visit or what. I'm assuming the Tribunal sends paperwork to the counselor??? What kind of evaluation are they talking about?

He's going to call the counselor's office tomorrow and find out more details and what the cost is. He doesn't have medical insurance and funds are rather tight. The letter did say that if you can't afford to pay, then just send in the bills along with documentation of the visits. He is to call the Tribunal back by 11/9 and let them know when he has made his appointment. I'm wondering if it takes weeks and weeks to get in to this counselor. If he gets an appointment right away, I would assume he would call the Case Coordinator now rather than waiting until 11/9.

Thoughts anyone? Anyone with experience in this?

LaLucia · #15 Oct 6, '09, 11:39 pm

Hi Jen, I think that this is a new procedure that the L.A. Tribunal has presently due to Pope Benedict who wants the Tribunals to check out carefully if people have real psychological problems that caused their marriage not to work out.

I have a friend at my church who is also going through an annulment. Her processing of her papers seem to be way in front of mind. I will ask her if she has received any letters stating she has to see a psychologist.

Psychologists have Ph.d's which is higher than a Masters college degree. Most likely the psychologist is Catholic and can tell if a person has good reasons for an annulment.

My Tribunal letter told me that the cost would be $75. per session. It doesn't bother me going since I have been seeing therapists since 1975. Most therapist are really nice and very good at their job.

Tell your boyfriend to go for one session and if it looks like it is a waste of his time he should complain to the Tribunal Office. That is what I plan to do.
Tell him to stay positive and go see his medical doctor to give him some anxiety meds.

If I have to go for counseling I plan to take my anxiety meds so I will be in an easy going personality mood. I happen to be a strong verbal fighter like a lawyer. I plan to quote the Canon laws codes that apply to my case.

I am so sorry.... your boyfriend must be real upset about having to see a psychologist.

My advise is to tell your boyfriend to call the Tribunal if he is given a late date of Nov. as an appointment. Tell him to ask for a counselor who has an earlier appt. time.
I am sure they have several psychologist on their list.
We have tons of psychologists in L.A.

I hope someone has been through the experience of having to see a psychologist for their annulment. Oh..... what a mess. I don't like it. Lucia