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  #271  
Old Dec 9, '09, 12:13 pm
Jimzz12 Jimzz12 is offline
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Default Re: Major scandal; Now proven that the entire global warming threat is based on fabricated data

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Originally Posted by Aboveallbereal View Post
I find the Global Warming farrago utterly fascinating. It is a amalgam of two utterly disctict non Christian viewpoints...humanism and pagan Gaia/Earth mother worship.

Humanism in that it insists "we" create our circumstances. Gaia worship in that it transposes the notion of sin to be anything which increases Global warming. Thus travelling by car is sinful as is dyeing clothes.

These viewpoints are utterly divergent but share a loathing of an acceptance that God is Our Father nd that He charts the course of history.

Nevermind the poltics of the secular and God denying world, I have this little ditty of a book published by the Maryknolls that embraces liberation theology through the mode of ecology. This is enough to show us how much of an albatross the environmental theories have become. The book was published circa 1989.

I've approached the whole concept of being green with a great deal of caution over the last, say, 20 years since we were all told to love the earth. If I remember correctly it came on with such vigor and force that even for a 10 year old I could clearly discern something amiss was at work. Yerra, with this said it is important to remember that we do have a certain responsiblity to 'keep the garden' as this was the first commandment. When it comes to chopping down a tree, I always stop and ask myself if it is the right thing to do. If the tree really needs to come down, let us say, it is blocking sunlight to a garden or it has begun to shade the southern winter sun exposure to my house (thereby increasing my heating fuel consumption) then the tree should indeed come down. If the tree presents no real interference with the required task of the land, then the tree can stay. And, as always I can hold that tree in reserve letting it grow larger so that someday it might be felled for cordwood.

Clearly there are some environmental issues that need addressing. Hadn't there been fuel for the fire, the issue never would have caught aflame. I remember when the Boston Harbour was an absolute filthy mess and we have improved the quality of our breathing air markedly.

The danger is in the ravenous approach used by certain groups in promoting the agenda. There is some real money to be made. Con men are around every corner. It is plausible that certain men of popular regard stand to make a great deal of money for speaking arrangments. But perhaps a greater danger is that we do have a president that wrote a paper several years ago on how using the issue of ecology to push social reform not as an ends for improved ecology but only as a catalyst in the equation. This reminds me quite remarkedly of the liberation theologists.

The discovery of certain cover-ups should not be and is to be of no suprise. Human frailty is at work. Forgive them and try to wrap your head around what perhaps their postive intentions might have been. In the meantime we really should continue to recycle, not litter, not vandalize, and treat our natural surroundings with a proper deserving Christian of respect of Our Father's Creation. It is afterall a sin to strew garbage about and dump oil in a river and kill squirrels just for fun.


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  #272  
Old Dec 9, '09, 12:14 pm
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Callin Callin is offline
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Default Re: Major scandal; Now proven that the entire global warming threat is based on fabricated data

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Notice the AGW people - they have no intention of finding any truth that disagrees with their preconceived hoax.
You know, in all these threads, I'm STILL waiting for some pro-AGW person to explain the number-fudging happening in these programs and data that have been leaked. I was on the fence until I saw them with my own eyes, leaked from one of the institutions responsible for the three main global temperature datasets.

But apparently now I'm being lumped in with people who deny evolution and being labeled a "skeptic". But I think I'd rather be one, since the opposite of skepticism is gullibility.
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  #273  
Old Dec 9, '09, 12:29 pm
Don L Don L is offline
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Default Re: Major scandal; Now proven that the entire global warming threat is based on fabricated data

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Originally Posted by StAnastasia View Post
Your referring to it as a "preconceived hoax" sounds like a preconception that would blind you to any facts in support of AGW.
Facts? To loosely quote CS Lewis "Satan uses a pint of poison in a lake of clear (facts) water."

It's not the "facts" as much as the fact of who's determining things as facts and the asinine conclusions they draw from them, such as Al Gore stand in front of a calving glacier (which only calve when excess cold causes freezing weight which then pushes them outwards into the sea where they break off in brittle chunks and become icebergs) and he calls that melting. Melting glaciers recede not calve. My fourth grade kids are intellegent enough to laugh at that ignorant hoax.

How come none of those AGW expert scientists didn't catch that little deception?
  #274  
Old Dec 9, '09, 12:36 pm
StAnastasia StAnastasia is offline
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Default Re: Major scandal; Now proven that the entire global warming threat is based on fabricated data

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Originally Posted by Barry Gabriel View Post
You say you find that "global warming deniers are frequently also evolution deniers". On what do you base that statement? What does one have to do with the other?
That's what I'm curious about.
  #275  
Old Dec 9, '09, 1:07 pm
Ender Ender is offline
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Default Re: Major scandal; Now proven that the entire global warming threat is based on fabricated data

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Originally Posted by kimmielittle View Post
Here is what some top American Physical Society Scientist say:
http://www.openletter-globalwarming....en_letter.html

The list of over two hundred APS Members signers

http://www.openletter-globalwarming....Statement.html

MSM Coverage
http://www.cbsnews.com/blogs/2009/12...y5933353.shtml
One of the things this episode points out is the speed with which the global warming position is unraveling. Given that over 230 APS members have already signed the petition, the myth of scientific consensus will surely be one of the first dominoes to fall. We've all heard about tipping points in regard to the climate, well we have now seen one with regard to climate theory.

Ender
  #276  
Old Dec 9, '09, 1:10 pm
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kimmielittle kimmielittle is offline
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Default Re: Major scandal; Now proven that the entire global warming threat is based on fabricated data

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Originally Posted by Don L View Post
Facts? To loosely quote CS Lewis "Satan uses a pint of poison in a lake of clear (facts) water."

It's not the "facts" as much as the fact of who's determining things as facts and the asinine conclusions they draw from them, such as Al Gore stand in front of a calving glacier (which only calve when excess cold causes freezing weight which then pushes them outwards into the sea where they break off in brittle chunks and become icebergs) and he calls that melting. Melting glaciers recede not calve. My fourth grade kids are intellegent enough to laugh at that ignorant hoax.

How come none of those AGW expert scientists didn't catch that little deception?


That's one that stated me asking and researching
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It always has bothered me...that us kids get more truthful information on the package of a bread-wrapper or happy meal...than we get about abortions -kimmie

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  #277  
Old Dec 9, '09, 1:12 pm
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kimmielittle kimmielittle is offline
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Default Re: Major scandal; Now proven that the entire global warming threat is based on fabricated data

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Originally Posted by Ender View Post
One of the things this episode points out is the speed with which the global warming position is unraveling. Given that over 230 APS members have already signed the petition, the myth of scientific consensus will surely be one of the first dominoes to fall. We've all heard about tipping points in regard to the climate, well we have now seen one with regard to climate theory.

Ender


Yeppers
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It always has bothered me...that us kids get more truthful information on the package of a bread-wrapper or happy meal...than we get about abortions -kimmie

Common sense conservation hints shared here.
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  #278  
Old Dec 9, '09, 2:00 pm
CJFrancis CJFrancis is offline
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Default Re: Major scandal; Now proven that the entire global warming threat is based on fabricated data

Jimxx12 is concerned about the amount of money that people will make from fighting global warming. I'm guessing he is talking about companies that make solar panels, windmills, etc. Also, public transportation providers and advertising companies that will show us ways to car pool, etc.

I'm more concerned about the trillions of dollars that go to foreign dictators and oil companies. Does anyone remember the ESSO oil tanker spill? That kind of thing goes on frequently in developing countries.

The Kyoto protocol included money from developed countries going to developing countries to help them use new energy sources and cope with climate change. Droughts hit us hard - imagine how hard they are for people who barely have enough to eat when times are good!

The fact is that most people don't like change, so our natural instinct is to oppose a viewpoint that tells us that we should change. So, even though we know that reducing pollution, including greenhouse gasses, is a good thing, we are concerned about having to change.

Doing the right thing isn't always easy. However, God loves His Creation and we have to respect and look after it.

Smokers with integrity listened to the majority of scientists who said that smoking and second-hand smoke are killers. Smokers who didn't want to change agreed with the scientists paid by the cigarette companies. Let's do the right thing now and listen to the scientists who are collecting data and analysing it. Let's not get distracted by the columnists and posters who are telling us to ignore the vast majority of the scientists.
  #279  
Old Dec 9, '09, 2:24 pm
Ender Ender is offline
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Default Re: Major scandal; Now proven that the entire global warming threat is based on fabricated data

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Originally Posted by CJFrancis View Post
The fact is that most people don't like change, so our natural instinct is to oppose a viewpoint that tells us that we should change. So, even though we know that reducing pollution, including greenhouse gasses, is a good thing, we are concerned about having to change.
This is not about whether the people who reject the scientific theory of AGW are reluctant to change, are concerned with the environment, or are working for an oil company. It is about whether their objections are valid. The science either does or does not confirm the theory and most people should be able to recognize that that fact is utterly disconnected from the personal integrity of the people who oppose the theory. You cannot defend a scientific claim by maligning those who reject it. In fact, resort to deprecation is a strong indicator that no better argument is available.

Ender
  #280  
Old Dec 9, '09, 2:24 pm
CJFrancis CJFrancis is offline
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Default American Physical Society says that global warming is occurring

See the following APS web-site for the official position of that organization, which is that global warming is occurring and that "We must reduce emissions of greenhouse gases beginning now."
http://www.aps.org/policy/statements/07_1.cfm

Climate change deniers ignore the official position of the APS and instead want you to read an open letter that was written in 2007 and signed by some physicists. This is their evidence "proving" that global warming is not scientifically correct.

This example shows the low quality of the climate change deniers' arguments.
  #281  
Old Dec 9, '09, 2:35 pm
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kimmielittle kimmielittle is offline
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Default Re: American Physical Society says that global warming is occurring

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Originally Posted by CJFrancis View Post
See the following APS web-site for the official position of that organization, which is that global warming is occurring and that "We must reduce emissions of greenhouse gases beginning now."
http://www.aps.org/policy/statements/07_1.cfm

Climate change deniers ignore the official position of the APS and instead want you to read an open letter that was written in 2007 and signed by some physicists. This is their evidence "proving" that global warming is not scientifically correct.

This example shows the low quality of the climate change deniers' arguments.
Evidently you missed this link

http://www.cbsnews.com/blogs/2009/12...y5933353.shtml

dated 12 08 29 The letter is on going because the head of APS is a Gore Friend and won't change it en spite of the signatures.

BTW...I give it MORE credence because it was started in 2007.....BEFORE this other stuff came out

Read my link /post below in this thread
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It always has bothered me...that us kids get more truthful information on the package of a bread-wrapper or happy meal...than we get about abortions -kimmie

Common sense conservation hints shared here.
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  #282  
Old Dec 9, '09, 2:54 pm
TheWalsh TheWalsh is offline
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Thumbs up Re: Major scandal; Now proven that the entire global warming threat is based on fabricated data

Copenhagen Snuffed

You may have heard of the exposé of fraud involving the Climate Research Unit at East Anglia, UK. There is convincing evidence of a conspiracy to manipulate data, predetermine peer review, and suppress dissent concerning global warming. On the other hand, you may not have heard about it due to the widespread suppression of inconvenient truth in the media here in the USA.

The essence of the story not found in many American newspapers is the content of one thousand emails and three thousand other documents stolen from the University of East Anglia’s computers and published from a server located in, of all places, Russia.

One recalls that back in the days of the Soviet Union, Russians were hungry for bits of truth from free-world newspapers. Now, it appears that we are in the same position and hungry for scraps of truth printed in the foreign press. Now we must seek truth from Russia. How galling?

The Telegraph in the United Kingdom carried articles, Fox News has reported on the story, and if you Google “Climate Gate” on your computer, you will learn much more than is available at the local newsstand.

Do you know that ninety-five percent of the greenhouse gas is water vapor, and that of the remaining five percent, carbon dioxide constitutes only 3.6%? Furthermore, only 3.2% of that is resultant of human activity. Therefore, all our burning of fossil fuel and so on cannot have more than a 0.117% impact on climate, if any at all.*

Do you know that atmospheric carbon dioxide is a fertilizer? It makes vegetation grow. Vegetation converts carbon dioxide into oxygen. Do you know that there are five times as many polar bears as there were in 1950? Are you aware that our recent warming trend has abated since 1998? Have you read of the dearth of sunspots having a dramatic effect on the climate of the Earth and other planets? Check it out.

Now ask yourself why anyone would want to falsify climate data. Could it be about money, politics, position, power, and prestige?

Bill Walsh
Newport, NH

* Source:
Dr. S. Fred Singer, atmospheric physicist
Professor Emeritus of Environmental Sciences at the University of Virginia,
and former director of the US Weather Satellite Service.

(The foregoing is from a letter I sent to several papers in New Hampshire. I might add, that it seems, the less one believes in orthodox religion, the more disposed is such an one to believe in nonsense. The instinctive desire for our Creator is present even when we deny His existence. It is sad when it is expressed in mere gullibility. ~bw.)
  #283  
Old Dec 9, '09, 4:10 pm
CJFrancis CJFrancis is offline
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Default Re: Major scandal; Now proven that the entire global warming threat is based on fabricated data

Ender said "One of the things this episode points out is the speed with which the global warming position is unraveling. Given that over 230 APS members have already signed the petition, the myth of scientific consensus will surely be one of the first dominoes to fall.

Ender"

It seems impressive that 230 members of the American Physical Society have signed a petition written in 2007, until you find out the Society has 46,000 members.

Here is the APS statement on climate change. I copied the second paragraph in here:
http://www.aps.org/policy/statements/07_1.cfm
"The evidence is incontrovertible: Global warming is occurring. If no mitigating actions are taken, significant disruptions in the Earth’s physical and ecological systems, social systems, security and human health are likely to occur. We must reduce emissions of greenhouse gases beginning now."

It appears that Ender is deliberately trying to mislead, or he is for some reason impressed that less than 1% of APS members are questioning the APS statement on climate change.
  #284  
Old Dec 9, '09, 5:13 pm
StAnastasia StAnastasia is offline
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Default Re: Major scandal; Now proven that the entire global warming threat is based on fabricated data

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Originally Posted by CJFrancis View Post
It seems impressive that 230 members of the American Physical Society have signed a petition written in 2007, until you find out the Society has 46,000 members. .
The is reminiscent of the Discovery Institute's claim that "over 700 scientists disagree with Darwin." The National Center for Science Education has a list of over 1,100 PhD biologists only with the name "Steve" (1% of the population).
  #285  
Old Dec 10, '09, 4:54 am
vz71 vz71 is offline
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Default Re: Major scandal; Now proven that the entire global warming threat is based on fabricated data

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Originally Posted by StAnastasia View Post
4elise, nice reflection. But the US will be impacted. An eighteen inch sea level rise would put two of the SF Bay Area's airports under water during storms, ramshackling the economy. Every major seaport would be faced with costly infrastructure changes; New Orleans might be very soggy again, Holland would have to pay enormous amounts to raise and shore up its dikes, and we could probably kiss most of Florida goodbye. Even Republicans should be worried about that last prosect!
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Originally Posted by kimmielittle View Post
Are you telling us that what they purpose will stop it?

Prove it so, please
Actually, let's step back even more.
Prove this rise in sea level will happen as a result of anything man is doing.
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