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  #136  
Old Oct 12, '09, 3:09 pm
PeterMuz PeterMuz is offline
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Default Re: Ethics of Fur

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Originally Posted by 4elise View Post
It is the utmost of vanity to kill something so as to impress others with one's wealth or status. I can understand that there was a time when people didn't have options, but really today I can think of NO reason to justify the wearing of fur for fashion.
So let's say the fur only cost $5.00... That would eliminate the vanity side of things. Do you still think it is wrong?
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  #137  
Old Oct 12, '09, 3:11 pm
JoeJetson JoeJetson is offline
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Default Re: Ethics of Fur

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I looked it up and the pope does wear luxurious ermine fur robes.
Yeah but it's not new. The ermine garments that he wears are from the 1960's. He did get some flack from an Italian animal group about it. He is an animal lover. There's some story about some book/biography about Pope Benedict "written by a cat". Anybody know anything about that? I have to check it out.
  #138  
Old Oct 12, '09, 3:12 pm
PeterMuz PeterMuz is offline
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Default Re: Ethics of Fur

So what about leather? Or eating a nice steak?
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  #139  
Old Oct 12, '09, 3:14 pm
JoeJetson JoeJetson is offline
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Default Re: Ethics of Fur

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Originally Posted by PeterMuz View Post
So let's say the fur only cost $5.00... That would eliminate the vanity side of things. Do you still think it is wrong?
How does that eliminate the vanity? You're killing an animal to wear it for fashion, whether it's high couture or trailer park duds.
  #140  
Old Oct 12, '09, 3:52 pm
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4elise 4elise is offline
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Default Re: Ethics of Fur

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So let's say the fur only cost $5.00... That would eliminate the vanity side of things. Do you still think it is wrong?
Perhaps not on the basis of vainty - if one wore the $5. tag like a Minnie Pearl hat tag, this would then just be applicable to the 'needless' suffering issue then wouldn't it?
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  #141  
Old Oct 12, '09, 3:54 pm
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4elise 4elise is offline
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Default Re: Ethics of Fur

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So what about leather? Or eating a nice steak?

To me this is the same, I don't wear leather, I don't eat steak.
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  #142  
Old Oct 12, '09, 3:55 pm
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Default Re: Ethics of Fur

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How does that eliminate the vanity? You're killing an animal to wear it for fashion, whether it's high couture or trailer park duds.
good point -
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  #143  
Old Oct 12, '09, 4:24 pm
Feanor2 Feanor2 is offline
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Cool Re: Ethics of Fur

I don't know if wearing fur is exactly sinful but it is unbecoming and makes women look gaudy and pretentious.

On the other hand, Benedict looks snazzy in that ermine-trimmed hat!
  #144  
Old Oct 12, '09, 4:34 pm
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athansor athansor is offline
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Default Re: Ethics of Fur

Here's an article that may be relevant to this discussion: Is Eating Meat A Catholic Sin?
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  #145  
Old Oct 12, '09, 4:39 pm
fultonfish fultonfish is offline
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Default Re: Ethics of Fur

WWJE?
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  #146  
Old Oct 12, '09, 5:13 pm
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4elise 4elise is offline
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Default Re: Ethics of Fur

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Here's an article that may be relevant to this discussion: Is Eating Meat A Catholic Sin?
Thanks so much for posting this - I hadn't seen this article.
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  #147  
Old Oct 12, '09, 5:17 pm
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Default Re: Ethics of Fur

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WWJE?
If Jesus was here, say in the US, right now? Do you think he'd be eating veal and fois gras? Would he be eating factory farmed beef? Of would he take advantage of living at a time when we no longer need meat to survive and choose a vegetarian diet?
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  #148  
Old Oct 12, '09, 5:35 pm
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4elise 4elise is offline
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Default Re: Ethics of Fur

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WWJE?
I know that Marfran has posted information on another thread on what is understood to have been the primary diet of the people of the middle east at the time that Jesus lived - and it was indeed for the most part a plant based diet, olives, fruit, bread, nuts, wine, - with some fish, (of course not part of the current over fishing)

But if you are asking what WOULD Jesus eat today... I would have to think he would find the current practice of factory farming objectionable - What I've learned about it just indicates to me that it just is not in keeping with the dignity of creation.
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  #149  
Old Oct 12, '09, 5:36 pm
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Default Re: Ethics of Fur

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Originally Posted by athansor View Post
If Jesus was here, say in the US, right now? Do you think he'd be eating veal and fois gras? Would he be eating factory farmed beef? Of would he take advantage of living at a time when we no longer need meat to survive and choose a vegetarian diet?
This gets my vote as the likely answer!
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  #150  
Old Oct 12, '09, 6:13 pm
severus68 severus68 is offline
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Default Re: Ethics of Fur

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Originally Posted by fultonfish View Post
Sinning animals alive is impractical because they squirm around too much.

Besides usually the pelt or skin is a byproduct of meat production. So you stun the animal to stop it from squirming and then you want to bleed it with the heart still going because leaving the blood inside will spoil the meat.

You also want to have the animal calm because an excited animal will result in a mean condition known as PSE. All that adrenalin and other hormones causes the meat to taste funny.

In a lot of Middle Eastern countries, they hold the animal down and cut its throat without first stunning it. But in the United States, we are humane and knock the animal out, with a bolt to the brain or by electric shock.



I was being cynical Animals feel pain and suffer. I am shocked when you tell the animal is not killed outright but left to bleed out.

It is not only in the middle east. Most Muslims follow a version of animal slaughter in the OT. They believe the animal can't be stinned first. There is someone from the Alazar University in Egypt who goes around the world telling Muslims it is Islamic to stun the animals first.

Thank you for the info but I have long lost any taste for meat.
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