wife has given up

tucdoc · #1 Aug 12, '10, 9:02 am

My wife has become emtionally distant after finally telling me she has been unhappy for years. This despite having a comfortable lifestyle and two beautiful healthy children. In fact, she has new "friends" (males) who I believe are meeting her emotional needs. Baseball is her passion and she met these "friends" at games she went to on her own. It has gotten to the point where we cannot go out to dinner, but she has tried to have dinner with these "friends". I told her no, and she was very upset. She sees no problem with them, I accuse her of being in a fog. She won't let me hug or kiss her. I'm concerned that her lack of love in the home is starting to affect the children. I will not move out. It's just hard to see how the marriage can last if she refuses to put any effort into it and refuses to go to counseling.

Micawber · #2 Aug 12, '10, 9:10 am

I am very sorry to hear this tucdoc. My heart goes out to you.

I may be flamed for saying this; and obviously I don't have a full sense of your situation - however, risking presumption: something tells me that if you try to draw her closer, she is going to flee even further away. You need to be very strong now - and she will be drawn to your strength. You need to pray for strength - emotional, perceptive, driving, virile strength. Whatever you do, don't act or speak out of neediness; every hint of that will drive her still further away. Ultimately, however, you cannot "make her" get out of her "fog." Protect the children above all. I shall pray for you.

tucdoc · #3 Aug 12, '10, 9:29 am

A Catholic friend had advised me to take care of myself and that right now my wife will do what she wants. I am seeing a therapist and joined the YMCA. I told the kids that I'm here for them if they want to talk and acknowledged to them that "it's been kinda rough" between my wife and I. I reassured them that I love them both very much.

Scoobyshme · #4 Aug 12, '10, 9:48 am

Every tear we shed, every pain we feel, can be offered up to heaven and put in our treasury waiting for us when we get there. It can also be very powerful as intercession, begging graces from Our Lord to convert souls (like your wife's!).

Prayer, penance, sacrifice. These are the things that will soften her hardened heart. Pray the rosary. Go to Mass during the week if you can. Fast a meal a day or two, or for a whole day or two. Get others to pray and fast and offer sacrifice with you. Consecrate yourself to the Immaculate Heart of Mary and ask her intercession. Then, leave the rest to God.

We must all have a Good Friday before we can expect an Easter Sunday. This may be your Good Friday. Do not fight back or be ugly. Be humble and supportive of your family, especially your children. If they're old enough, maybe you and they could say a Rosary together while your wife is at the games.

If she has female friends that are your friends, too, maybe you could talk to them and share what's going on if they don't already know and have them talk to her. Have them explain that marriage is not about what the other can "do for me" but what one can do for the other. The real meaning of love is service to one another. Always come like a servant, as the saying goes.

Bluegoat · #5 Aug 12, '10, 10:00 am

So, what is making her unhappy?

If things are bad, gestures of affection, especially physical affection, can actually make it worse. It can make the person feel used.

SonCatcher · #6 Aug 12, '10, 10:06 am

You cannot do anything to make her change. I only advise you seek God in prayer. Particularly in Eucharistic Adoration, if available. Encourage your children to pray, too (you have probably already told them enough).

Quote:

Originally Posted by Scoobyshme

If she has female friends that are your friends, too, maybe you could talk to them and share what's going on if they don't already know and have them talk to her. Have them explain that marriage is not about what the other can "do for me" but what one can do for the other. The real meaning of love is service to one another. Always come like a servant, as the saying goes.

Be careful to not let it devolve into gossip (definitely don't suggest wrongdoing to them). Any friends who are close (hopefully, they are orthodox Catholics - Christians, at least) enough likely already know your marriage is strained. Perhaps, though, she will open up to them about where you have failed her. With that knowledge, you can work with your therapist to make changes in yourself to prepare for reconciliation in your marriage.

The Bucket · #7 Aug 12, '10, 10:19 am

Quote:

Originally Posted by Micawber

I am very sorry to hear this tucdoc. My heart goes out to you.

I may be flamed for saying this; and obviously I don't have a full sense of your situation - however, risking presumption: something tells me that if you try to draw her closer, she is going to flee even further away. You need to be very strong now - and she will be drawn to your strength. You need to pray for strength - emotional, perceptive, driving, virile strength. Whatever you do, don't act or speak out of neediness; every hint of that will drive her still further away. Ultimately, however, you cannot "make her" get out of her "fog." Protect the children above all. I shall pray for you.

Why would you be flamed for this? You're absolutely right. Women need to feel comfortable in the nests they've created and while they love for their men to do beta-type tasks like the laundry and the dishes from time to time, they don't want their men to turn into the typical Western panzy. Women yearn for independence... the independence to CHOOSE to serve their husbands! But at the same time, they need a reason to make that choice and the reason is that their husbands are strong, firm, successful in one way or another and fiercely love them. Sure, turn on that softer side once in awhile but make it only once in awhile!

It's not easy to be sure because that means all the responsibility is on us as men. It means we have to lead and if we screw up it's on us. That's a frightening position but it's one we are called to be in as husbands and fathers. My first officer, my wife, gives good advice and runs day to day operations smoothly, but that nevertheless means I'm ultimately the one that makes the big decisions and has the final say. If you give that away women first become uncomfortable, then scared, then they find you repulsive because you can't live up to the call of manhood. Sure that gets cloaked in various ways, but that's the bottom line my friend.

tucdoc · #8 Aug 12, '10, 10:27 am

Bluegoat, she says she's unhappy because I've been insensitive and uncaring towards her. She remembers incidents from our 14 years of marriage when I disappointed her. One episode that still makes her cry is that I was not with her when her mom died 6 years ago. This happened out of state and I couldn't leave work, but I did go to the funeral. I apparently don't compliment her on her appearance or act as I care about her. She also feels that I've coerced her into having sex with me. I admitted and apologized for those times, but prior to this year sex had not been an issue. Now that I'm more aware of her needs she basically says it's too late because she doesn't want to get hurt again. I'm concerned that she is just recalling my shortcomings to justify having these new "friends", one of which she has described as "so kind".

Several of our friends know that things aren't right, and they actually wanted to do an intervetion. I'm not sure that would be very productive.

Responding to The Bucket, I've made most of the money decisions for the family. I have gotten upset with her when I feel she spends too much. She has never wanted to have a fixed budget (she says she's not good with numbers), so I'm left to react to the credit card statements. She says I treat her like s***, and I admitted that money issues are probably a big part of that, but she doesn't come up with a solution.

The Bucket · #9 Aug 12, '10, 10:37 am

Quote:

Originally Posted by tucdoc

Bluegoat, she says she's unhappy because I've been insensitive and uncaring towards her. She remembers incidents from our 14 years of marriage when I disappointed her. One episode that still makes her cry is that I was not with her when her mom died 6 years ago. This happened out of state and I couldn't leave work, but I did go to the funeral.

Not much to say about that. She had certain expectations about life and they fell apart. I'm sure you did all you could; when people die suddenly you can't be there and when they linger for awhile you can't sit around for months "waiting." It's tough.

Quote:

I apparently don't compliment her on her appearance or act as I care about her.

Classic nonsense test. Women who say that have insecurities and almost any verbal answer is a trap. The right answer is physical escalation.

Quote:

She also feels that I've coerced her into having sex with me. I admitted and apologized for those times, but prior to this year sex had not been an issue.

Wives should never be coerced into sex, but if you had to be "pushy" about it, there has to be a reason. It's either because of something serious in which case you should sit down and talk about it or it's because she's not as attracted to you as she once was. Right answer? Improve yourself physically and delve into a task big time. Show that you're making yourself better but say nothing about it. Talking with your wife about why you might be less subconsciously attractive to her is NEVER a good idea.

Quote:

Now that I'm more aware of her needs she basically says it's too late because she doesn't want to get hurt again. I'm concerned that she is just recalling my shortcomings to justify having these new "friends", one of which she has described as "so kind."

Tell her to go ahead and basically burn your marriage contract. Tell her that you'll pray for her. And then just go out a few nights and do whatever. If she asks, just casually say you met some new female friends and leave it at that. Gets the hamster wheels turning.

Of course, this advice is predicated on there not being a genuinely serious issue (infidelity, abuse, long-term breakdown of communication) and you genuinely not screwing something up.

**1ke** · #10 Aug 12, '10, 10:43 am

Quote:

Originally Posted by tucdoc

Bluegoat, she says she's unhappy because I've been insensitive and uncaring towards her. She remembers incidents from our 14 years of marriage when I disappointed her. One episode that still makes her cry is that I was not with her when her mom died 6 years ago. This happened out of state and I couldn't leave work, but I did go to the funeral.

A holy priest needs to smack your wife on the head with his bible, while open to 1 Corinthians 13: 4-6:

Love is patient, love is kind. It does not envy, it does not boast, it is not proud. It is not rude, it is not self-seeking, it is not easily angered, it keeps no record of wrongs. 6Love does not delight in evil but rejoices with the truth. 7It always protects, always trusts, always hopes, always perseveres.

She should be on her knees in confession asking forgiveness for her bad behavior. The penance should be to write this verse on the blackboard 100 times. Sheesh. Yeah, you are such a terrible guy, you did something that hurt her feelings 14 years ago.

And, as for not being there when her mother died, but coming for the funeral. Oh, if only Dr. Laura could get hold of your wife and slap her silly. How unreasonable.

Quote:

Originally Posted by tucdoc

I apparently don't compliment her on her appearance or act as I care about her.

From the sound of it (having only heard your side of it) I think your wife needs to grow up and put on her big girl panties. She has been reading too much feminist nonsense.

Quote:

Originally Posted by tucdoc

She also feels that I've coerced her into having sex with me. I admitted and apologized for those times, but prior to this year sex had not been an issue.

She is forgetting marital relations are a right in marriage and one she is not at liberty to withhold.

Quote:

Originally Posted by tucdoc

Now that I'm more aware of her needs she basically says it's too late because she doesn't want to get hurt again. I'm concerned that she is just recalling my shortcomings to justify having these new "friends", one of which she has described as "so kind".

Again, big slap on her head by a holy priest. Your wife is being ridiculous.

Quote:

Originally Posted by tucdoc

Several of our friends know that things aren't right, and they actually wanted to do an intervetion. I'm not sure that would be very productive.

Hopefully they want to do an intervention on her, not you. Have them read 1 Corinthians 13 to her along with Ephesians 5.

Seriously, my point is that you aren't the problem here. She is. That doesn't help you any, because she's decided everything is your fault. But, sanity check: it's not you.

The Bucket · #11 Aug 12, '10, 11:06 am

I wouldn't go so far to say that he hasn't contributed to problems. We don't know the full story and frankly the full story is none of our business. However, you are right to point out that love "keeps no records of wrongs."

We're all human. We're going to disappoint people, we're going to disappoint our loved ones. It happens and at a certain point you have to forgive and move on knowing that even if your spouse disappointed you, he/she still loves you and you love him/her.

SonCatcher · #12 Aug 12, '10, 11:20 am

Quote:

Originally Posted by tucdoc

Several of our friends know that things aren't right, and they actually wanted to do an intervetion. I'm not sure that would be very productive.

Did you stop them? Is your wife aware they were planning this?

There is no way to tell if an intervention would help. However, it is doubtful one (that you didn't instigate

) would push her away unless she were already gone in her heart.

Seatuck · #13 Aug 12, '10, 11:25 am

Consider going on a Retrouvaille Weekend.

www.retrouvaille.org

tucdoc · #14 Aug 12, '10, 11:26 am

The problems is she can't or won't forgive. The "straw" was when I called her a b**** after she kept complaining about her life right before Easter. I asked her how many other women would want to be in her position. It turns out she had already told one of her "friends" that she was unhappy, rather than telling me or one of her close female friends. I did apologize for the insult, although not right away. Since then I've advised her to just let it go, as I only called her a name once, while she is calling it to herself over and over again each time she remembers. She has cried so much remembering all of my faults that she now has a stye in her eye. I've sent her numberous links from our diocese's website regarding marriage, but she just ignores them. She would rather be upset at me than talk to a counsilor. It's just so frustrating that we can't move forward with our relationship.

She already told me she doesn't love me and that she will never have sex with me again. So, I suppose I don't have much to lose if our friends intervene.

SonCatcher · #15 Aug 12, '10, 11:27 am

Quote:

Originally Posted by tucdoc

One episode that still makes her cry is that I was not with her when her mom died 6 years ago. This happened out of state and I couldn't leave work, but I did go to the funeral.

And how would things be better if you sacrificed your job? (OTOH - are you a workaholic?)