Petrus Romanus

[Ani Ibi]

Originally Posted by lanza27

Does anyone know where to find or what the Prophesy said about the others????

Yes. In this forum. Lots of Malaci Prophecy threads. You'll have to do the leg work though.

Originally Posted by Conde de Toledo

"Peter the Roman" means a curial cardinal who imposes his rock-solid beliefs on other people, hence a head of the Inquisition: he even took the name Benedict!

The cardinals chose the self-righteous path: the end is near - God save the Catholic Church!!

And as for CdeT who has so generously declared to us pore lil Catholics that Pope Benedict XVI is Petrus Romanus:

W R O N G !


Let me guess. You were sitting there just itching to to fire off a salvo of doom and gloom and you couldn't resist the urge anymore. So rather than read through the absolute plethora of threads on this forum on the Malaci Prophecy (as a well intentioned person might do on introducing himself herself to this forum), you just leapt to your own conclusion that Pope Benedict XVI is Petrus Romanus.

Sound of fireworks fizzling in the rain.

In the absence of any research at all (even a little bitty bit), that was a little self-righteous of yourself. And calling the cardinals self-righteous was ... well ... pot? kettle? mote? log?

Hint: If the Malaci Prophecy is to be believed (and that has been debated thoroughly in this forum) then Pope Benedict XVI is the Gloria Olivae.

[dumspirospero]

While I have not stance on the St. Malachy prophecies...because I am not sure exactly what to believe, we must keep it mind that there is not definite evidence disproving these are St. Malachy's original writings. It is only alleged, with some supporting evidence, that this is the works of some Jesuits and had nothing to do with Malachy...but who knows for sure. There are those who believe in them....those who don't...and finally those who aren't sure. So I do not believe anyone can post with certainty that they are genuine or forgeries...because we just don't know. I must say though it is pretty intriguing that they are accurate when describing the late Pontiff's.

To answer your question about JPII....think about "labor of the sun"....what does the Sun constantly do? What is its primary function? It is constantly circling the world offering light to the entire world...that is its labor. Comparitively, JPII was the most travelled Pope in the history of the Papacy and he brought light to many nations in his travels. That is how the Malachy Prophecy pertains to him.

Originally Posted by amcalabrese

Malachy's "Prophecies" are a 16th Century fabrication. Contemporary biographies of St. Malachy never mention the prophecies. They were not mentioned until about 1595. Interestingly, the prophacies for Popes before 1595 are fairly straightforward, while those after 1595 are very cryptic.

For example, JPII's supposed prophecy is "Labors of the Sun" -- OK, WHAT DOES THAT MEAN?

The final "prophecy" is for Peter of Rome. That "prophecy" did not show up until about 1820.

My verdict -- they are a late 16th Century fabrication with a 19th Century gloss added on.

[TPJCatholic]

John,


Did Jesus make a mistake when He selected Peter? After all, Peter denied Him three times and even attacked with a sword in the Garden. The Holy Spirit guides the Cardinals to choose the person of His will, not human will...we may not always understand the Holy Spirit's choice, and sometimes those people may go on to be deep sinners...yet have no doubt that it is the Holy Spirit that makes the selection through the Cardinals. God chooses imperfect and sinful people to do His work.

[Benedictus]

Originally Posted by pnewton

The conclave did not choose the pope. The Holy Spirit chooses the pope. The conclave merely discerns that choice.

Well, here's what our new Pope said a number of years ago when he was interviewed for Conclave by John Allen.

I would not say so in the sense that the Holy Spirit picks out the pope, because there are too many contrary instances of popes the Holy Spirit would obviously not have picked. I would say that the Spirit does not exactly take control of the affair, but rather like a good educator, as it were, leaves us much space, much freedom, without entirely abandoning us. Thus the Spirit's role should be understood in a much more elastic sense, not that he dictates the candidate for whom one must vote. Probably the only assurance he offers is that the thing cannot be totally ruined.

[Scott_Lafrance]

Originally Posted by Conde de Toledo

"Peter the Roman" means a curial cardinal who imposes his rock-solid beliefs on other people, hence a head of the Inquisition: he even took the name Benedict!

The cardinals chose the self-righteous path: the end is near - God save the Catholic Church!!

Whoa chief, switch to the decaf for a day or two.....

[Melissa]

Originally Posted by ByzCath

So why is the "prophecy" off by two?

Because the "prophecy" includes some of the anti-Popes, too. Funny, you'd think a prophecy from God would've gotten the succession right ... Just another reason why I think it's a forgery that people stretch/cut/manipulate into 'fitting' just the way they do with some of Nostradamus' "predictions" (whose predictive value I put at somewhere below that of the horoscope column in the daily paper).

[atsheeran]

Originally Posted by ByzCath

I have seen this numbers for the popes but it seems that Pope John Paul II was the 264th pope, or the 263rd successor of St Peter , and Pope Benedict XVI is the 265th pope, or the 264th successor of St Peter.

So why is the "prophecy" off by two?

First of all, oops. I meant to put that St. Malacy's alleged prophecy predicted a total of 267 Popes and that Benedict XVI was the 266th.

That still puts it off by one.

The New Advent list agrees with you and puts Benedict XVI at #265. However this EWTN list puts him at #266 (technically it doesn't place him at all, but it does put JPII at #265 which would logically out BXVI at #266). Maybe someone out there who has a little more time on their hands than I do can try and find the discrepancy and reconcile the two.

[Friar David, O.Carm]

Originally Posted by Melissa

Because the "prophecy" includes some of the anti-Popes, too. Funny, you'd think a prophecy from God would've gotten the succession right ... Just another reason why I think it's a forgery that people stretch/cut/manipulate into 'fitting' just the way they do with some of Nostradamus' "predictions" (whose predictive value I put at somewhere below that of the horoscope column in the daily paper).

Thanks!

Originally Posted by atsheeran

First of all, oops. I meant to put that St. Malacy's alleged prophecy predicted a total of 267 Popes and that Benedict XVI was the 266th.

That still puts it off by one.

The New Advent list agrees with you and puts Benedict XVI at #265. However this EWTN list puts him at #266 (technically it doesn't place him at all, but it does put JPII at #265 which would logically out BXVI at #266). Maybe someone out there who has a little more time on their hands than I do can try and find the discrepancy and reconcile the two.

And there is the rub, if a prophecy needs to be reconciled, then how can it be a prophecy?

The list I saw for the "prophecy" is two off.

[Trelow]

Originally Posted by dumspirospero

It is only alleged, with some supporting evidence, that this is the works of some Jesuits and had nothing to do with Malachy...but who knows for sure. .

Funny how them Jesuits always come up.

[dumspirospero]

Oh you know it...you know the Jesuits always have their hands in something

Originally Posted by Trelow

Funny how them Jesuits always come up.

[La Chiara]

The original poster "Conde de Toledo" has posted exactly one other message on CA Forums.

http://forums.catholic.com/showthrea...742#post569742

In this post, he claims to be of the Sangreal family--as in descendents of Mary Magdalene and Christ (from the DaVinci Code)!

Yep. And I'm the Pope's wife.

[atsheeran]

Originally Posted by ByzCath

Thanks!




And there is the rub, if a prophecy needs to be reconciled, then how can it be a prophecy?

The list I saw for the "prophecy" is two off.

I have no idea if there is any truth or validity whatsoever to St. Malachy's "prophecy". Notice that I always used the adjective "alleged" when describing it. I know that there is not consensus on whether it is authentic.

That being said, it is not the prophecy that needs to be reconciled. It is the two lists of all the popes, one from New Advent and one from EWTN. Neither of these lists had anything to do with St. Malachy. These two lists put Pope Benedict XVI as the 265th and 266th popes respectively. I don't know which one is correct.

[Melissa]

I just found where the lists go off w/ the numbering.
EWTN's list

91. St. Zachary (741-52)
92. Stephen II (March 752)
93. Stephen III (752-57)

New Advent's List

91. St. Zachary (741-52)
Stephen II (752) -- Omitted from many lists (including the Vatican's) because he died before being consecrated.
92. Stephen III (752-57)

[Theodora]

Originally Posted by lanza27

I have a question since we are on the topic of St. Malachy's Prophecy.

Often Prophesies are cryptic and hard to decipher and only become apparent after they come true. "Gloria Olivae" could have something to do with the Benedictines and their offshoot the Olivetans. Hence the choice of Pope Benedict could be construed to fulfill this part of the prophesy.

Does anyone know what the prophesy said about the last 4 Popes? What was the prophesy's description John Paul the Great? How about the short lived John Paul I. Even Paul VI and John XXIII? Surely we should be able to find some correlation to the prophesy.

Does anyone know where to find or what the Prophesy said about the others????

You might want to try this website

http://www.worldnetdaily.com/news/ARTICLE_ID=43899

SpiritDaily has it under Controversy of Malachy Visions.

[atsheeran]

Originally Posted by Melissa

I just found where the lists go off w/ the numbering.
EWTN's list


New Advent's List

Thanks!