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  #1  
Old Dec 2, '10, 6:00 pm
ComeHome2Rome ComeHome2Rome is offline
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Default What is the meaning of "World Without End" at the end of the Gloria? Why do some think the world will come to an end?

As Catholics “We pray what we believe and believe what we pray”

In the Glory be to the Father and to the Son and to the Holy Spirit as it was in the beginning is now and ever shalt be WORLD WITHOUT END.

How are we to understand the WORLD WITHOUT END? Is it what some of the approved Marian Apparitions (Akita, Our Lady of All Nations, Fatima, etc.) have taught that the world will not end nor will it be completely destroyed, BUT there will definitely be an "end of this age" in which "the world WILL be completely CHANGED"?

Dr. Courtney Bartholomew, faithful Catholic Author and famous Scientist, has explained scientifically how that real and complete change could take place leave us with a truly “New Earth”, as described in the New Testament, by means of the Oceans & Land Masses completely changing due to massive hits by like asteroids or meteors or something.

Why do some people speak about the world actually ending at some point when one of our most common prayers, the Gloria, teaches us that the world is without end?
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  #2  
Old Dec 2, '10, 6:32 pm
Nita Nita is offline
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Default Re: What is the meaning of "World Without End" at the end of the Gloria? Why do some think the world will come to an end?

Quote:
Originally Posted by ComeHome2Rome View Post
..........Why do some people speak about the world actually ending at some point when one of our most common prayers, the Gloria, teaches us that the world is without end?
Probably because the world in its present state will come to an end. Here is a link to the Catechism section that speaks of the end of the world.
http://www.vatican.va/archive/catechism/p123a12.htm#VI
I'll just quote the first two paragraphs:

1042 At the end of time, the Kingdom of God will come in its fullness. After the universal judgment, the righteous will reign for ever with Christ, glorified in body and soul. The universe itself will be renewed:
The Church . . . will receive her perfection only in the glory of heaven, when will come the time of the renewal of all things. At that time, together with the human race, the universe itself, which is so closely related to man and which attains its destiny through him, will be perfectly re-established in Christ.
1043 Sacred Scripture calls this mysterious renewal, which will transform humanity and the world, "new heavens and a new earth."630 It will be the definitive realization of God's plan to bring under a single head "all things in [Christ], things in heaven and things on earth."
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  #3  
Old Dec 2, '10, 7:40 pm
DavidKays DavidKays is offline
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Default Re: What is the meaning of "World Without End" at the end of the Gloria? Why do some think the world will come to an end?

Quote:
Originally Posted by ComeHome2Rome View Post
As Catholics “We pray what we believe and believe what we pray”

In the Glory be to the Father and to the Son and to the Holy Spirit as it was in the beginning is now and ever shalt be WORLD WITHOUT END.

How are we to understand the WORLD WITHOUT END? Is it what some of the approved Marian Apparitions (Akita, Our Lady of All Nations, Fatima, etc.) have taught that the world will not end nor will it be completely destroyed, BUT there will definitely be an "end of this age" in which "the world WILL be completely CHANGED"?

Dr. Courtney Bartholomew, faithful Catholic Author and famous Scientist, has explained scientifically how that real and complete change could take place leave us with a truly “New Earth”, as described in the New Testament, by means of the Oceans & Land Masses completely changing due to massive hits by like asteroids or meteors or something.

Why do some people speak about the world actually ending at some point when one of our most common prayers, the Gloria, teaches us that the world is without end?
Hi! Jesus said to Pontus Pilate that my kingdom is not of this world. The world at the end of the Gloria is different from the world we see today. In some sense yes this world will not end but be changed. When Jesus talks about the 2nd Coming, He is referring to a moment in the future when He will come to end this world. However the end is not because of destruction or of wars or of massive hits by astreroids but because the world at that time the majority of it has rejected Him. He comes because He can no longer save it by the means He is saving it now that is by His Grace and Mercy. The 2nd Coming will be a terrifying time because God needs to come to judge it. Sadly the majority on earth who are still living at the 2nd Coming are in a state of judgement and will be condemned by God for refusing to accept salvation. He comes also to save the small minority before they too are succumbed by the evil in the world. When He does come Jesus will announce the General Ressurection and the world we see now will be changed. No more will people sin, no more will evil continue, and the former things have gone away that is death and sin and eternity begins for everyone. For the Blessed they will have eternity with God and for the condemned an eternity without Him. God does not end anything. But He will change the world for the better. Hopefully you will have merited Heaven so that you will be able to be with God forever. In some sense those who have rejected God will inherit Hell and total seperation from Him. For these the world has ended. But for the Blessed it is the world without end.
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  #4  
Old Dec 3, '10, 3:22 am
patrick457 patrick457 is offline
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Default Re: What is the meaning of "World Without End" at the end of the Gloria? Why do some think the world will come to an end?

Quote:
Originally Posted by ComeHome2Rome View Post
Why do some people speak about the world actually ending at some point when one of our most common prayers, the Gloria, teaches us that the world is without end?
Simple answer:

The original Greek and Latin of this phrase is καὶ εἰς τοὺς αἰῶνας τῶν αἰώνων (kai eis tous aiōnas ton aiōnōn), and et in saecula saeculorum, respectively. Literally translated: "and to the ages of the ages". Nothing about worlds ending in the literalistic sense here, it's just a Hebrew idiom (ule'olamei olamim), that is equivalent to our English "forever and ever". The Greek aion originally meant 'life'; i.e. a human's life or lifespan, and/or 'being' (say, in Homer). Later, the word then tended to mean 'age', and by extension 'forever' or 'for eternity'; more or less similar to the Sanskrit word kalpa and Hebrew olam (from 'alam, 'hidden'; the idea being what is 'hidden' in the very distant future or in the distant past).

Sometimes olam/aion/saeculum is rendered as "world," which explains why the traditional version of the Gloria Patri (which originally came from Cranmer's Book of Common Prayer) has "world without end", and why in the KJV Jesus promises to be with His followers "even unto the end of the world" (literally: until the completion of the age).

Now, the word world comes from the Anglo-Saxon woruld/worold, which in turn derives from Proto-Germanic *wer-alt (wera- 'man' + alt 'age'; Anglo-Saxon eald). Broken down, it literally means 'man-age' and thus denotes 'a man's existence/life-span' (and by extension, the human race) as well as the affairs of life.
Originally worold meant '(a man's) life on earth, this world (as opposed to the afterlife),' which was then extended to mean 'the known world,' and eventually then to 'the physical world, the universe' around the 13th century. You can see the original senses being used in the aforementioned phrase "world without end" and the adjective worldly (of or relating to man; physical as opposed to spiritual). Cognates include Old Saxon werold (Dutch wereld), Old High German weralt (German Welt), Old Norse verǫld (Swedish värld). When referring to the physical world, Old English used the term middangeard (Old Norse midgard), lit. "the middle enclosure" (cf. yard), which is rooted in Germanic cosmology and myth. Old Norse often also used heimr, lit. 'abode' (cf. English home - from OE ham, Swedish hem, and German Heim), to refer to the physical world.

Thus, when translated literally, the Latin form of the Gloria Patri actually runs: "Glory to the Father, and the Son, and the Holy Spirit, as it was in the beginning, and now and ever, and to the ages of the ages." The difference with the Greek form is that the Latin has sicut erat in principio (as it was in the beginning) added. The point of the prayer is that the Holy Trinity is to be glorified now, and forever and ever.
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  #5  
Old Dec 10, '10, 10:01 pm
wjp984 wjp984 is offline
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Default Re: What is the meaning of "World Without End" at the end of the Gloria? Why do some think the world will come to an end?

What I wonder is why other languages do not have this phrase in the prayer? For example Spanish ends with por los siglos de los siglos which I think means from centuries to centuries or I'm guessing this basically means forever and ever. But it does not include mundo sin fin. I wonder if other languages have the phrase world without end or if English is the only one.
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  #6  
Old Dec 10, '10, 10:07 pm
patrick457 patrick457 is offline
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Default Re: What is the meaning of "World Without End" at the end of the Gloria? Why do some think the world will come to an end?

Quote:
Originally Posted by wjp984 View Post
What I wonder is why other languages do not have this phrase in the prayer? For example Spanish ends with por los siglos de los siglos which I think means from centuries to centuries or I'm guessing this basically means forever and ever. But it does not include mundo sin fin. I wonder if other languages have the phrase world without end or if English is the only one.
Because many of them render "to the ages of the ages" (which is what the original Greek and Latin have) word-for-word. English must be the only language graced with such a loose paraphrase as "world without end".
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  #7  
Old Dec 11, '10, 12:15 pm
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Katholish Katholish is offline
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Default Re: What is the meaning of "World Without End" at the end of the Gloria? Why do some think the world will come to an end?

Excellent post Patrick. You explained the translation problem better than I could have.
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