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  #1  
Old Mar 22, '11, 5:49 am
Patty RM Patty RM is offline
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Default RCIA First Scrutiny

At the First Scrutiny we give our Catechumenates a copy of the Apostles Creed. What is the signifiance of this and why is it not the Nicene Creed or could it be?
Some places give a copy of the Creed at regular RCIA session during the week, what is the best why to present?
Patty RM
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  #2  
Old Mar 22, '11, 6:27 am
puzzleannie puzzleannie is offline
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Default Re: RCIA First Scrutiny

this is called the Presentation of the Creed and is part of the rite. The elect memorize it, have catechesis on it reviewing what they have hopefully learned earlier in the catechumenate, and "give it back" when the make their profession of Faith, and this is one of the optional rites of Holy Saturday, to have them recite the creed. Don't have the RCIA book here but I believe there is a version of all the rights for children of catechetical age that uses the Apostles Creed, and the other uses the Nicene Creed. I know our catechetical materials for this week use the Nicene Creed but I just copied the rite and it has the Apostles Creed so I will have to check it out. For Holy Saturday, the RCIA retreat, we ask all the elect to memorize the Apostle's Creed because it is shorter and we usually have more children than adults. We print the creed on parchment for the presentation, which is done during the class, not during Mass. Just follow the rite, and look at the options, decide what works best (actually here the pastor decides I simply execute).

welcome to the forums, hope this means we have another RCIA catechist on board
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  #3  
Old Mar 22, '11, 7:07 am
Joannm Joannm is offline
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Default Re: RCIA First Scrutiny

We didn't ask our Elect to memorize the Creed this year because of the changes in it come Advent. Instead of handing them the Creed, we have the team recite it to them. I got this from a Fourum workshop. It was very powerful. It is called the traditio or handing over of the Creed, and then the redditio or handing it back. St. Abrose tells us that the creed should not be written down. You have to be able to repeat it back but it must not be written down. St. Cyril thought of writing it down as sort of a betrayal of a secret.
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Old Mar 22, '11, 8:44 am
puzzleannie puzzleannie is offline
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Default Re: RCIA First Scrutiny

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Originally Posted by Joannm View Post
St. Abrose tells us that the creed should not be written down. You have to be able to repeat it back but it must not be written down. St. Cyril thought of writing it down as sort of a betrayal of a secret.
well in their day of possible persecution that makes sense. Also in those days almost all instruction was oral since people did not have books commonly, nor writing materials or laptops. Every RCIA resource I have ever seen includes written forms of the Creed, and in fact all the materials we use in all catechetical programs this year discuss the upcoming changes so they will not be a surprise, and most teaching these days includes oral and written instruction, the best includes several methods. Your way also has value but at some point they need concrete instruction in the elements of the Creed.
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Old Mar 22, '11, 12:25 pm
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KarenElissa KarenElissa is offline
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Default Re: RCIA First Scrutiny

I was curious, so I went looking through the Rite. The Rite does seem to specify which creed is used, in the presentation of the Creed is just says "the Creed." In the directions for the recitation of the Creed is says "The elect then recite the Creed. Depending o nthe version that was entrusted to them at the presentation, they recite either the Apostles' creed, option A, or the Nicene Creed, option B."

I can see the reasoning for either one. The Apostles' Creed makes sense since that is the creed used in baptism. The Nicene makes sense because it is the one we usually proclaim in Mass.
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  #6  
Old Mar 22, '11, 3:03 pm
Joannm Joannm is offline
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Default Re: RCIA First Scrutiny

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Originally Posted by puzzleannie View Post
well in their day of possible persecution that makes sense. Also in those days almost all instruction was oral since people did not have books commonly, nor writing materials or laptops. Every RCIA resource I have ever seen includes written forms of the Creed, and in fact all the materials we use in all catechetical programs this year discuss the upcoming changes so they will not be a surprise, and most teaching these days includes oral and written instruction, the best includes several methods. Your way also has value but at some point they need concrete instruction in the elements of the Creed.
I am not talking about instruction on the Creed (which I agree must be taught) but on the actual handing over the creed to the Elect following the first scrutiny. Instead of just handing them a scroll or paper, have the team, or if done at Evening Prayer, all in the Assembly recite it to them. On Holy Saturday morning they recite it back. It is very powerful for both the Elect and the Assembly. We receive the Creed back following MOrning Prayer on HS morning so we have a good number of people there.
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Old Mar 23, '11, 4:50 am
puzzleannie puzzleannie is offline
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Default Re: RCIA First Scrutiny

Quote:
Originally Posted by Joannm View Post
I am not talking about instruction on the Creed (which I agree must be taught) but on the actual handing over the creed to the Elect following the first scrutiny. Instead of just handing them a scroll or paper, have the team, or if done at Evening Prayer, all in the Assembly recite it to them. On Holy Saturday morning they recite it back. It is very powerful for both the Elect and the Assembly. We receive the Creed back following MOrning Prayer on HS morning so we have a good number of people there.
yes that is how we do it. I did not say we neglected this.
We also give them the "handouts" with the words of the creed and some instruction (obviously this is not their first instruction). I wish we could do the handing back in the assembly but there is no gathering on HS morning except our retreat, so the parents and sponsors become the assembly. I am doing good if the deacon can step over for a few minutes to officiate.
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  #8  
Old Mar 23, '11, 6:55 am
Patty RM Patty RM is offline
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Default Re: RCIA First Scrutiny

Thank you all for your imput. Because we have the Apostle Creed already printed on parchment we will use. Baptism connection makes sense as well as what we do weekly. I guess there is no right or wrong. Pastor gives the direction and this is what we should go by.
Thank you.
Patty RM
ps glad to be part of RCIA as well as any Faith Formation group.
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