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  #1  
Old Jul 2, '11, 7:04 pm
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henrikhank henrikhank is offline
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Default Coptic

Nofri!
How does the liturgy of the Coptic Catholic Church differ from the Coptic Orthodox Liturgy and is there a video with the Coptic Catholic Liturgy?
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  #2  
Old Jul 2, '11, 7:34 pm
ciero ciero is offline
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Default Re: Coptic

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Originally Posted by henrikhank View Post
Nofri!
How does the liturgy of the Coptic Catholic Church differ from the Coptic Orthodox Liturgy and is there a video with the Coptic Catholic Liturgy?
Coptic catholic liturgy is VERY Latinized.........looks almost like a Novos Ordo Mass......along with the music.....and musical instruments.
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  #3  
Old Jul 2, '11, 7:41 pm
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henrikhank henrikhank is offline
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Question Re: Coptic

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Originally Posted by ciero View Post
Coptic catholic liturgy is VERY Latinized.........looks almost like a Novos Ordo Mass......along with the music.....and musical instruments.
please explain
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  #4  
Old Jul 2, '11, 9:00 pm
dzheremi dzheremi is offline
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Default Re: Coptic

The choir of St. Mary's Coptic Catholic Church is perhaps a good indication of what Ciero is talking about...awful, just awful. I could not find any example of a Coptic Catholic liturgy on the internet. The church is rather small, so the web presence is correspondingly small.
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  #5  
Old Jul 3, '11, 2:43 am
malphono malphono is offline
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Default Re: Coptic

FWIW, I've viewed several broadcasts of a few Coptic CC liturgies in the past 18 or so months, and from what I've seen, it seems to be a mixed bag.

I freely admit that I'm anything but an expert on Coptic usage, but two of them were quite nice. From my limited knowledge, they both seemed to be more or less "authentic" and were offered ad orientem, though without an iconostasis, were done at least partially in Coptic, and were sung to traditional Coptic chant.

However, there were others that were anything but authentic. These used a Novus Ordo-style versus populum table instead of an ad orientem altar, and were totally devoid of so much as one word in Coptic. One was also concelebrated with non-Coptic clergy which isn't a big problem in and of itself, but prayers and music from non-Coptic Churches were incorporated in the liturgy. The other was free of non-Coptic prayers, but still lacked any vestige of traditional Coptic chant (in whatever language). Both most definitely had the "look and feel" of the Novus Ordo.
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  #6  
Old Jul 3, '11, 9:22 am
ciero ciero is offline
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Default Re: Coptic

Quote:
Originally Posted by malphono View Post
FWIW, I've viewed several broadcasts of a few Coptic CC liturgies in the past 18 or so months, and from what I've seen, it seems to be a mixed bag.

I freely admit that I'm anything but an expert on Coptic usage, but two of them were quite nice. From my limited knowledge, they both seemed to be more or less "authentic" and were offered ad orientem, though without an iconostasis, were done at least partially in Coptic, and were sung to traditional Coptic chant.

However, there were others that were anything but authentic. These used a Novus Ordo-style versus populum table instead of an ad orientem altar, and were totally devoid of so much as one word in Coptic. One was also concelebrated with non-Coptic clergy which isn't a big problem in and of itself, but prayers and music from non-Coptic Churches were incorporated in the liturgy. The other was free of non-Coptic prayers, but still lacked any vestige of traditional Coptic chant (in whatever language). Both most definitely had the "look and feel" of the Novus Ordo.
Any idea where the authentic Liturgy was served? In LA I have only seen the very Latinized Liturgy.
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  #7  
Old Jul 3, '11, 9:46 am
malphono malphono is offline
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Default Re: Coptic

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Originally Posted by ciero View Post
Any idea where the authentic Liturgy was served? In LA I have only seen the very Latinized Liturgy.
The broadcasts I saw were all from Lebanon.
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  #8  
Old Jul 3, '11, 6:34 pm
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henrikhank henrikhank is offline
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Default Re: Coptic

Quote:
Originally Posted by malphono View Post
FWIW, I've viewed several broadcasts of a few Coptic CC liturgies in the past 18 or so months, and from what I've seen, it seems to be a mixed bag.

I freely admit that I'm anything but an expert on Coptic usage, but two of them were quite nice. From my limited knowledge, they both seemed to be more or less "authentic" and were offered ad orientem, though without an iconostasis, were done at least partially in Coptic, and were sung to traditional Coptic chant.

However, there were others that were anything but authentic. These used a Novus Ordo-style versus populum table instead of an ad orientem altar, and were totally devoid of so much as one word in Coptic. One was also concelebrated with non-Coptic clergy which isn't a big problem in and of itself, but prayers and music from non-Coptic Churches were incorporated in the liturgy. The other was free of non-Coptic prayers, but still lacked any vestige of traditional Coptic chant (in whatever language). Both most definitely had the "look and feel" of the Novus Ordo.
Where did you view the several broadcasts?
When reading what people say here on this forum it's like the Catholic Church doesn't know enough when it comes to Liturgy. Well, if you think of it. Sometime this church can be really ****** and bad.
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  #9  
Old Jul 4, '11, 1:46 am
malphono malphono is offline
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Default Re: Coptic

Quote:
Originally Posted by henrikhank View Post
Where did you view the several broadcasts?
The broadcasts I saw were on Télé-Lumière-Noursat.
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  #10  
Old Jul 4, '11, 9:27 am
Peter Mogila Peter Mogila is offline
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Default Re: Coptic

I'd be interested in seeing some video of a Catholic Coptic Liturgy. Also, do the Catholic Copts use leavened or unleavened bread?
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  #11  
Old Jul 4, '11, 9:43 am
malphono malphono is offline
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Default Re: Coptic

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Originally Posted by Peter Mogila View Post
I'd be interested in seeing some video of a Catholic Coptic Liturgy.
Have you searched youtube? Else perhaps mardukm has another idea.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Peter Mogila View Post
Also, do the Catholic Copts use leavened or unleavened bread?
Leavened.
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  #12  
Old Jul 4, '11, 10:25 am
Peter Mogila Peter Mogila is offline
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Default Re: Coptic

Thanks! Seemed like I read once that at one point they had switched to unleavened bread. Glad they are using leavened.
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