New SOLT Statement re: Father Corapi

[chuey55]

Originally Posted by Orogeny

A couple of things. Why do you think he hasn't had a "fair trial"? Second, your really, really need to go back through this thread and read JReducations posts. Really.

Peace

Tim

Who is JReducation? Are you guys in some sort of club or something I didn't know about?

[brumano]

Originally Posted by TheRealJuliane

Brumano,

I am not sure what you are saying here. Are you saying that John Corapi AKA The Black Sheepdog, cannot be recalled by anyone but JPII? Are you saying that he is not under anyone else's authority?

Well I don't claim to know but neither does anyone else except of course Fr. Corapi and certain SOLT members if there was or was not at the time of Fr.'s entrance into their Prelature or over the course of time, discussion of any special conditions regarding the nature of Fr's vocation or other unique considerations, which I'm sure any individual brings to any religious community, which may have resulted in a mutually agreed; adjustment, maybe we could call it, of certain community regulations in his case.
There are certain facts that figure into this charge of disobedience as to whether it is now or will remain a valid charge, okay? Fact: Fr Corapi lived as he did outside of the community houses while satisfying whatever requirements his community superiors allowed and either formally or tacitly agreed to cicumstantially over the course of what is now around twenty five years I think, you know that's a long time in our short lives don't you think, and that twenty fives years of this arrangement means something, it establishes something does'nt it ? This constitutes an agreement of some type, no matter who does or does not wish to recognize it, that's why I call it a fact; because it already has taken place. So if at this point in time one party to that existing agreement wishes to make claim and demand compliance to some item of that entire existing agreement which they have for whatever reason not made demand on for 25yrs. it isn't automatically the other party's wrong doing if they appeal to a higher authority for a ruling prior to complying or if under the circumstances they wish to terminate the agreement in total.
This does not make Fr. guilty of anything; including disobedience.

[TheRealJuliane]

Originally Posted by mom4mary

Yes, as I said, I have seen this analogy crop up several places. I did not mean to imply that you were the original source. I am a new member, and I tried to quote another post in addition to yours, but unfortunately it didn't work.

Nonetheless (and I am *not* addressing this personally to you, whm), I reject the analogy that compares a priest - ANY priest - to a teenager and his order compared to as a parent. These are grown men who we are talking about, men who have been through psychological testing and many years of formation and education prior to ordination. While each of us needs to feel accountable, such adults should not require the kind of oversight from their superiors that a parent would render to a child. It just isn't the same thing.

I brought up the teenager analogy, it is something I have recently been through with my own 17 year old son. That's why I was thinking that Corapi's behavior is like that. No, his order is not his parent. It was his attitude of "I'm not obeying and you can't make me" that seemed to come through his last communication - but I do have a painful history with a teenager who did just that - would leave the house of his own accord and not return until he wanted to.

And may I say, we do not know if SOLT has actually tried to rein him in in some way over the years. He SAYS that he has been allowed to go his merry way, doing his speaking engagements, but we don't have the other side of things, do we? Perhaps this whole thing has been simmering for a long time.

[valient Lucy]

Originally Posted by chuey55

Who is JReducation? Are you guys in some sort of club or something I didn't know about?

He's a Capuchin Friar, who has been posting on this thread. Look for the name JREDucation and for a picture of St. Francis on the bottom. He's incredibly informative about this.

[scoobydoo6v92]

I will say this,,, I for some reason feel real sorrow for SOLT. I don't know why but something inside of me is aching for SOLT and the way John $ Corapi treated them. They took him in they paid for his education I would think when they accepted him. Whatever he did and or failed to do is on him. I just know from my expeirence that he was nasty and arrogant and sent me a nastygram when I asked him where is all the money going when he started his streaming site. Many years before that I asked if I could talk to him for 5 minutes and his nasty secratary Tamra told me basically to go blank myself stand in line like everyone else for your 5 minutes. I also felt that his merchandise was way overpriced. and his DVDs were burned on a computer and not professionaly pressed as you would find with a movie or musical DVD. That is no big deal though recordable DVDs degrade over time and was not professional. But what he did to SOLT what he did to Jesus Christ is to me a terrible thing and I believe SOLT and I think that he was a maverick way too long and the only fault that rests on SOLT is they didin't rein him in until it was too late.
I know some of you are tired of this string or the subject but unfortunatly it is a reality and it happened. It is a slap in the face of Jesus Christ it is a slap in the face of the church it is a slap in the face of all smeinarians studying to be priests it's a slap in the face of the men that discern the priesthood and get rejected and it is a slap in the face of all Catholics that are trying to be good Catholics and it is a scandel of the Church and the order that so lovingly took him in. Scoob

[chuey55]

Originally Posted by valient Lucy

So you've never passed up an opportunity? Ever? You have a perfect record? You've been taken to prison because you were protesting abortion or gay marriage?

If not, how can you judge the bishops or priests for what they may or may not have done? You don't have all the facts about what the bishops, about what they have done or haven't done.

I have had enough of Catholics bashings bishops.

According to you everyone needs a perfect record to preach.

Same logic goes for Father Corapi. Thanks. You are doing the same thing to Father John that you are questioning me about. Shall we go back to the hypocrite conversation again.

Faithful Catholics getting upset and fedup with what bishops not in line with Pope Benedict fail to do? You are clueless.

[catharina]

Originally Posted by mom4mary

That was the inference of your posts. If it is happening elsewhere, address it where it is actually happening

[chuey55]

Originally Posted by valient Lucy

He's a Capuchin Friar, who has been posting on this thread. Look for the name JREDucation and for a picture of St. Francis on the bottom. He's incredibly informative about this.

I didn't realize there was an eyewitness friar alongside Father Corapi the whole time, geez, where have I been

[valient Lucy]

Originally Posted by chuey55

According to you everyone needs a perfect record to preach.

No. I'm saying Fr. Corapi's supporters have a double standard. When Fr. Corapi messes up, he's just making a human mistake. When the bishops or other priests screw up, it's because they're evil.

What you said in your post was hypocritical. You were criticizing the bishops for not preaching the faith, when you yourself have failed to preach the faith perfectly yourself.

[chuey55]

Originally Posted by valient Lucy

No. I'm saying Fr. Corapi's supporters have a double standard. When Fr. Corapi messes up, he's just making a human mistake. When the bishops or other priests screw up, it's because they're evil.

What you said in your post was hypocritical. You were criticizing the bishops for not preaching the faith, when you yourself have failed to preach the faith perfectly yourself.

No comment.

[mom4mary]

Originally Posted by chuey55

Yes, they all deserve it. Never said Corapi was the only one. Why would he admit guilt if nothing has been proven? I'm sorry, but you sound like the crooked media.

Yes, by your own statements you inferred that Fr. Corapi is not only being bashed here at CAF, but also that there is no grounds for believing any of the charges against him, and that there is some kind of "hidden agenda" against him, as you yourself put it. As for the crooked media comment

[valient Lucy]

Originally Posted by chuey55

I didn't realize there was an eyewitness friar alongside Father Corapi the whole time, geez, where have I been

He understands the canonical processes, but I guess you're really not interested in learning about that.

If you want to think that Fr. Corapi is innocent, that's fine. But you have to also be willing to think the best about others, and not engage in slander and judgemental comments about how everyone is happy to see Fr. Corapi in this situation, how the bishops and his superiors are corrupt or conspiratorial, and how the other bishops and priests are neglecting their duties to preach and teach.

I have seen all of these comments from Fr. Corapi's supporters.

[TheRealJuliane]

A very timely passage from 2nd Peter - I happened to tune in to one of the evangelical preachers from CORPUS CHRISTI today on the way to a meeting....He was discussing FALSE TEACHERS...Read this from 2nd Peter. My ears perked up when I heard the parts I highlighted. Especially the "despise authority" part.

2 Peter 2
The Rise of False Prophets
1 But false prophets also arose among the people, just as there will also be false teachers among you, who will secretly introduce destructive heresies, even denying the Master who bought them, bringing swift destruction upon themselves. 2 Many will follow their sensuality, and because of them the way of the truth will be maligned; 3 and in their greed they will exploit you with false words; their judgment from long ago is not idle, and their destruction is not asleep.

4 For if God did not spare angels when they sinned, but cast them into hell and committed them to pits of darkness, reserved for judgment; 5 and did not spare the ancient world, but preserved Noah, a [a]preacher of righteousness, with seven others, when He brought a flood upon the world of the ungodly; 6 and if He condemned the cities of Sodom and Gomorrah to destruction by reducing them to ashes, having made them an example to those who would live ungodly lives thereafter; 7 and if He rescued righteous Lot, oppressed by the sensual conduct of unprincipled men 8 (for by what he saw and heard that righteous man, while living among them, felt his righteous soul tormented day after day by their lawless deeds), 9 then the Lord knows how to rescue the godly from [b]temptation, and to keep the unrighteous under punishment for the day of judgment, 10 and especially those who [c]indulge the flesh in its corrupt desires and despise authority.

Daring, self-willed, they do not tremble when they revile angelic [d]majesties, 11 whereas angels who are greater in might and power do not bring a reviling judgment against them before the Lord. 12 But these, like unreasoning animals, born as creatures of instinct to be captured and killed, reviling where they have no knowledge, will in [e]the destruction of those creatures also be destroyed, 13 suffering wrong as the wages of doing wrong. They count it a pleasure to revel in the daytime. They are stains and blemishes, reveling in their [f]deceptions, as they carouse with you, 14 having eyes full of adultery that never cease from sin, enticing unstable souls, having a heart trained in greed, accursed children; 15 forsaking the right way, they have gone astray, having followed the way of Balaam, the son of Beor, who loved the wages of unrighteousness; 16 but he received a rebuke for his own transgression, for a mute donkey, speaking with a voice of a man, restrained the madness of the prophet.

17 These are springs without water and mists driven by a storm, for whom the [g]black darkness has been reserved. 18 For speaking out arrogant words of vanity they entice by fleshly desires, by sensuality, those who barely escape from the ones who live in error, 19 promising them freedom while they themselves are slaves of corruption; for by what a man is overcome, by this he is enslaved. 20 For if, after they have escaped the defilements of the world by the knowledge of the Lord and Savior Jesus Christ, they are again entangled in them and are overcome, the last state has become worse for them than the first. 21 For it would be better for them not to have known the way of righteousness, than having known it, to turn away from the holy commandment handed on to them. 22 [h]It has happened to them according to the true proverb, “A DOG RETURNS TO ITS OWN VOMIT,” and, “A sow, after washing, returns to wallowing in the mire.”

If this is the wrong version to use, please feel free to correct - this is the NAS translation I think.

[Orogeny]

Originally Posted by chuey55

I didn't realize there was an eyewitness friar alongside Father Corapi the whole time, geez, where have I been

Read his posts in this thread.

Maybe you missed this in my first post to you, so I'll ask again. Why do you think he hasn't had a "fair trial"?

Peace

Tim

[mom4mary]

Originally Posted by chuey55

I didn't realize there was an eyewitness friar alongside Father Corapi the whole time, geez, where have I been