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  #1  
Old Sep 14, '11, 9:38 pm
jmj1984 jmj1984 is offline
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Question Our Lady of Good Success?

So I recently found about another approved apparition, Our Lady of Good Success. At least people claim it was approved by the local bishop and every bishop since then has renewed this approval.

Quote:
During the fifteenth and sixteenth centuries there lived in Quito, Ecuador, a Spanish nun whose little-known but extraordinary life has a direct connection with our days. Mother Mariana of Jesus Torres y Berriochoa, a nun of the Conceptionist Order, surpassed the already strict discipline of her congregation in the traditional penances she undertook. Beyond even those, she lovingly accepted unprecedented sacrifices and sufferings directly asked of her by Our Lord and Our Lady.

Click here for a novena to Our Lady of Good Success

Her frequent contact with heavenly beings and her supernatural sufferings stand in such contrast to the ways of our impious century and are so extraordinary in themselves that a word needs to be said of their credentials.

Mother Mariana left a full written account of her life at the command of her superiors. This account was approved by the Most Reverend Pedro de Oviedo, Quito’s tenth bishop, who was privileged to know and direct her. Additionally, with fresh memories of all the extraordinary facts not only of her life but also of those of her eight holy companions, the Franciscan Fathers who had been their spiritual directors and brothers wrote their biographies.

In 1650, fifteen years after Mother Mariana’s death, Diego Rodríguez Docampo published a story of her life endorsed by an official document from the King of Spain and the Royal Court of Quito.

Between 1760 and 1770, after new facts and more abundant documentation surfaced, Fr. Bartholomew Ochoa de Alacano, O.F.M., a Spaniard living in Quito, published a series of articles that formed a large volume about Mother Mariana. This work received widespread circulation and enthusiastic response in the Franciscan monasteries of Spain and Portugal. This book includes chronicles from the convent and the sermon preached by Bishop Oviedo at Mother Mariana’s funeral.

In 1790, Fr. Manuel Souza Pereira, O.F.M., published an extensive work based on the earlier documents. Father Souza Pereira, of illustrious Portuguese lineage, joined the military as a young man. A series of Providential events and several apparitions of Mother Mariana of Jesus convinced him that his true calling was to the Franciscan Order. Later, having been sent to Quito, he became known there for the austerity of his life and solid virtue. A decisive moment for him was an invitation to accompany his Bishop into the Papal cloister where his holy protectress had lived and died. There he traced her footsteps and venerated her incorrupt body. With his heart aflame, he vowed not to rest until he had finished a complete account of what he was to title The Admirable Life of Mother Mariana of Jesus. It is largely on this account that we have based this article.
Has anyone heard of this? And does anyone know if its genuine?

I've looked at the references made in other articles for example on Tradition In Action and the Our Lady of Good Success website and I know the books exist but thats about it. I haven't managed to find any 'official' sources approving or in fact saying anything on it. The closest I've come is a post on here http://the-hermeneutic-of-continuity...d-success.html
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  #2  
Old Sep 14, '11, 10:46 pm
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JM3 JM3 is offline
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Default Re: Our Lady of Good Success?

It is not approved.

http://forums.catholic.com/showthrea...f+good+success
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  #3  
Old Sep 14, '11, 11:11 pm
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beehumble beehumble is offline
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Default Re: Our Lady of Good Success?

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Originally Posted by jmj1984 View Post
So I recently found about another approved apparition, Our Lady of Good Success. At least people claim it was approved by the local bishop and every bishop since then has renewed this approval.



Has anyone heard of this? And does anyone know if its genuine?

I've looked at the references made in other articles for example on Tradition In Action and the Our Lady of Good Success website and I know the books exist but thats about it. I haven't managed to find any 'official' sources approving or in fact saying anything on it. The closest I've come is a post on here http://the-hermeneutic-of-continuity...d-success.html
It is genuine and I have a book on it: Here is a link:

http://www.miraclehunter.com/marian_...ito/index.html
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  #4  
Old Sep 15, '11, 2:15 am
jmj1984 jmj1984 is offline
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Default Re: Our Lady of Good Success?

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Originally Posted by JM3 View Post
Yes I did see that thread but frankly it was quite unhelpful, there was no discussion of facts just 'schismatics support it, it must be wrong and that woman made it all up' I was hoping for some facts.
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  #5  
Old Sep 15, '11, 7:54 am
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Monica4316 Monica4316 is offline
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Default Re: Our Lady of Good Success?

I think it's not false... here's another article on it; it seems some of the prophesies actually came true..

http://olrl.org/prophecy/goodsuccess.shtml

It also says that it's been approved

and this article here:

http://www.miraclehunter.com/marian_...ito/index.html

(definitely not a schismatic website)

it says,

Church Approval

Bishop Salvador de Ribera of Quito attested in official documents to the miraculous completion of the Statue by St. Francis of Assisi and the three Archangels – St. Michael, St. Gabriel and St. Raphael – and presided over the anointing of the solemn consecration of the Statue in the Church of the Royal Convent of the Immaculate Conception on February 2, 1611. The devotion and apparitions were also authorized and promoted by the next Bishop of Quito, Pedro de Oviedo, who governed the Diocese from 1630 to 1646.

A prayer to the Our Lady of Good Success has the imprimatur of a bishop, Carlos Maria, archbishop of Quito, who provided it in 1941 as a partial approval.

The Feast of Our Lady of Good Success is celebrated on Februrary 2nd, the Feast of the Purification of Mary.


and the messages are discussed as well: http://www.miraclehunter.com/marian_..._messages.html

"Excerpts taken from the 18th Century manuscript entitled The Admirable Life of Mother Mariana of Jesus Torres, written a century after her death by Prior Manuel de Souza Pereira, Franciscan Provincial in Quito, Ecuador and director of the Convent Mother Mariana founded. "
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  #6  
Old Sep 15, '11, 9:08 am
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JM3 JM3 is offline
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Default Re: Our Lady of Good Success?

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Originally Posted by jmj1984 View Post
frankly it was quite unhelpful.

You don't find it curious that Marian Horvat is the only source for this? Do you think Butler's Lives of the Saints is wrong?

http://forums.catholic.com/showpost....52&postcount=4

Quote:
There is a St. Mariana of Quito. Born Mariana Paredes y Flores in 1618, also known as 'the lily of Quito'. She died in 1645, at the age of 26. Her feast day is May 26, according to Butler's Lives of the Saints Vol II p.401.

As for the miracle hunter, Catholic culture says this:

http://www.catholicculture.org/cultu...earchid=784114

Quote:
This website catalogs apparitions that have been approved by the Church as worthy of belief as well as those which have either been disapproved or not decided upon.
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  #7  
Old Sep 15, '11, 9:41 am
Warloff Warloff is offline
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Default Re: Our Lady of Good Success?

My problem with Our Lady of Good Success is there no documentation before 1930. You won't find a single piece of paper on the apparition before that date as all were destroyed. The document that is the basis for the apparition is supposedly a 20th century copy made by a very old nun from another document written in a secret code that no one but her could crack which in turn was a copy of a eighteenth century document which in turn was a copy of a seventeenth century document. However, only the 1930s document still exists.

Contemporary documents from the period confirm that the various people involved did indeed exist and there was a huge fight between the bishops and the Franciscans over the control of the convent (which went all the way to the Pope) but no mention is made of Our Lady of Good Success.

Another document refers to Sister Marianna de Jesus as a very holy woman but does not mention the apparition. Many state that John Paul declared her venerable, but I have found no newspaper articles or church documents that actually state this. If anyone has an official document regarding her venerable status I would appreciate it.

In the 1940s when the current document was made public the Bishop of Quito investigated the matter and was satisfied enough to declare a novena for Our Lady of Good Success.

I am skeptical because I find it hard to believe that ALL the documents regarding this event written before the 20th century were lost. The prophecies are much less impressive when you realize the most recent document is from the 20th century.

And all my sources for this are not online or in English so I can't share them with you.
But if you don't believe me do your own snooping. See what manuscript documents exist regarding this apparition and where these documents are located. Find out on what date Sister Marianna de Jesus was declared venerable.

Last edited by Warloff; Sep 15, '11 at 9:55 am.
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  #8  
Old Sep 15, '11, 9:52 am
Warloff Warloff is offline
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Default Re: Our Lady of Good Success?

Saint Mariana of Quito was not involved in the story of Our Lady of Good Success.
Your confusing her with Sister Mariana de Jesus. As she is not a saint she is not mentioned in Butler's Lives of Saints.
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  #9  
Old Sep 15, '11, 12:52 pm
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beehumble beehumble is offline
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Default Re: Our Lady of Good Success?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Warloff View Post
My problem with Our Lady of Good Success is there no documentation before 1930. <snip>

I am skeptical because I find it hard to believe that ALL the documents regarding this event written before the 20th century were lost. The prophecies are much less impressive when you realize the most recent document is from the 20th century.

<snip>
So are you saying the known version is from the 1930s - the latest document? If so, it would still be a remarkable prophecy about the twentieth century since much of what it says happened after 1930. The priest scandal mentioned could easily be the pedophilia sex scandal, and it could refer to the 1960s when religious fell away from their vocation in droves. The Prelate could easily be JP II. And the destruction of marriage mentioned in the prophecy is a late-twentieth century phenomenon.

I have the little book on it, and here is what is in the book but taken from the miracle hunter website (since I don't want to type it all) on the message about the twentieth century, and one can see that it applies more to the 1960s and beyond, in my opinion. If from the 1930s, these prophecies of what occurred more towards the latter half of that century are very impressive indeed:

Our Lady purportedly said (and the Miracle Hunter website says this is an approved apparition, is my understanding):
"During this time insomuch as this poor country will lack the Christian spirit, the Sacrament of Extreme Unction will be little esteemed. Many people will die without receiving it either because of the negligence of their families or their false sentimentality that tries to protect the sick from seeing the gravity of their situations, or because they will rebel against the spirit of the Catholic Church, impelled by the malice of the devil. Thus many souls will be deprived of innumerable graces, consolations and the strength they need to make that great leap from time to eternity..."

"As for the Sacrament of Matrimony, which symbolizes the union of Christ with His Church, it will be attacked and profaned in the fullest sense of the word. Masonry, which will then be in power, will enact iniquitous laws with the objective of doing away with this Sacrament, making it easy for everyone to live in sin, encouraging the procreation of illegitimate children born without the blessing of the Church. The Christian spirit will rapidly decay, extinguishing the precious light of Faith until if reaches the point that there will be an almost total and general corruption of customs. The effects of secular education will increase, which will be one reason for the lack of priestly and religious vocations..."

"The Sacred Sacrament of Holy Orders will be ridiculed, oppressed and despised. ...The demon will try to persecute the Ministers of the Lord in every possible way and he will labor with cruel and subtle astuteness to deviate them from the spirit of their vocation, corrupting many of them. These corrupted priests, who will scandalize the Christian people, will incite the hatred of the bad Christians and the enemies of the Roman, Catholic and Apostolic Church to fall upon all priests. This apparent triumph of Satan will bring enormous sufferings to the good Pastors of the Church...."

"Moreover, in these unhappy times, there will be unbridled luxury which, acting thus to snare the rest into sin, will conquer innumerable frivolous souls who will be lost. Innocence will almost no longer be found in children, nor modesty in women, and in this supreme moment of need of the Church, those who should speak will fall silent."

.....

"The secular Clergy will leave much to be desired because priests will become careless in their sacred duties. Lacking the divine compass, they will stray from the road traced by God for the priestly ministry, and they will become attached to wealth and riches, which they will unduly strive to obtain. How the Church will suffer during this dark night! .... many priests will lose their spirit, placing their souls in great danger. This will mark the arrival of My hour."

....."
And I read one passage in the book that said after leaving school, Catholic children would rarely go to confession in the 20th century. I found this all too true in my case - in Catholic school I went to confession once a month; after I did not go until I was older - I think it was upon reading the messages of Medjugorje in the 1980s that prompted me to go to confession.

All of that sounds dead-on accurate, as I view the state of marriage and the state of the priesthood, sexting among children, and women wearing low-rise jeans and thong bikinis to the beach, etc.

God bless you.
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  #10  
Old Sep 15, '11, 3:02 pm
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Monica4316 Monica4316 is offline
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Default Re: Our Lady of Good Success?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Warloff View Post
My problem with Our Lady of Good Success is there no documentation before 1930.


"Bishop Salvador de Ribera of Quito attested in official documents to the miraculous completion of the Statue by St. Francis of Assisi and the three Archangels – St. Michael, St. Gabriel and St. Raphael – and presided over the anointing of the solemn consecration of the Statue in the Church of the Royal Convent of the Immaculate Conception on February 2, 1611. The devotion and apparitions were also authorized and promoted by the next Bishop of Quito, Pedro de Oviedo, who governed the Diocese from 1630 to 1646."
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  #11  
Old Sep 15, '11, 3:17 pm
jmj1984 jmj1984 is offline
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Default Re: Our Lady of Good Success?

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Originally Posted by Monica4316 View Post


"Bishop Salvador de Ribera of Quito attested in official documents to the miraculous completion of the Statue by St. Francis of Assisi and the three Archangels – St. Michael, St. Gabriel and St. Raphael – and presided over the anointing of the solemn consecration of the Statue in the Church of the Royal Convent of the Immaculate Conception on February 2, 1611. The devotion and apparitions were also authorized and promoted by the next Bishop of Quito, Pedro de Oviedo, who governed the Diocese from 1630 to 1646."
I have bought both books on the subject I guess the problem is actually finding non-bias or fringe sources that approve of the apparition, I found that out the hard way when trying to start a wikipedia post on it.
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  #12  
Old Sep 15, '11, 4:58 pm
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Default Re: Our Lady of Good Success?

Sorry, JM3 but you are mistaken; Our Lady of Good success was indeed approved a long time ago by the Bishop in Quito see below;

Quito, Ecuador (1594)

Title: Our Lady of Good Success

Feast Day: February 2nd

Investigated: 1666, 1723
First Apparition:
Feb 2, 1594

Approved: Feb 2, 1611 - Bishop Salvador de Riber
Last Apparition:
Dec 8, 1634

Visionaries: Venerable Mother Mariana de Jesus Torres (31)
Number of Apparitions: 4

Miracles & Signs: Blind girl cured at Mariana's wake; incorruptible body of Mariana

Summary: Our Lady of Good Success appeared to Spanish-born Mother Mariana de Jesus Torres at her Conceptionist Royal Convent in Quito, Ecuador. She requested that a statue be made in her likeness and warned of diminishing faith and vocations in the 20th century.

Check out www. miraclehunter.com/marian_apparitions/index.html
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  #13  
Old Sep 15, '11, 6:01 pm
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Default Re: Our Lady of Good Success?

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Originally Posted by corsair View Post
Sorry, JM3 but you are mistaken.

I don't consider miracle hunter the final authority. Let me know when the CDF approves it.

http://forums.catholic.com/showthread.php?t=273735
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  #14  
Old Sep 15, '11, 7:31 pm
nordskoven nordskoven is offline
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Default Ask your bishop!

One may ask one's bishop for clarification RE: Marian apparitions. I have had a Marian apparition: Marian Therese Horvat, the sedevacantist ("We Resist You to the Face") who was formerly associated with the Moonie-esque Tradition, Family & Property/TFP and whose splinter group, Tradition in Action/TIA, seems to follow the same policy of cashing in on Marian apparitions (as noted by the Brazilian bishops' condemnation of TFP). Instead of Fatima flogged for cash by TFP, TIA has "Our Lady of Good Success."

TFP, FYI, has had no priestly vocations in their decades of guiding the formation of young men. That's because they disdain the priesthood--something that ties in nicely with "Our Lady of Good Success'" prophecy about the sad state of vocations. TFP promotes the "warrior-monk" as a "higher" vocation than the priesthood--that if you can get the full facts behind their secretive group. OK. May the Most High grant us discernment. Selling books and Catholiciana is one of TFP's central fundraising means and TIA is probably putting out a lovely coffee table book. I can't vote my cash for Gnostics who think they have insider info on Catholicism apart from pastoral oversight.
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Old Sep 16, '11, 9:27 am
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Default Re: Ask your bishop!

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Originally Posted by nordskoven View Post
One may ask one's bishop for clarification RE: Marian apparitions. I have had a Marian apparition: Marian Therese Horvat, the sedevacantist ("We Resist You to the Face") who was formerly associated with the Moonie-esque Tradition, Family & Property/TFP and whose splinter group, Tradition in Action/TIA, seems to follow the same policy of cashing in on Marian apparitions (as noted by the Brazilian bishops' condemnation of TFP). Instead of Fatima flogged for cash by TFP, TIA has "Our Lady of Good Success."

TFP, FYI, has had no priestly vocations in their decades of guiding the formation of young men. That's because they disdain the priesthood--something that ties in nicely with "Our Lady of Good Success'" prophecy about the sad state of vocations. TFP promotes the "warrior-monk" as a "higher" vocation than the priesthood--that if you can get the full facts behind their secretive group. OK. May the Most High grant us discernment. Selling books and Catholiciana is one of TFP's central fundraising means and TIA is probably putting out a lovely coffee table book. I can't vote my cash for Gnostics who think they have insider info on Catholicism apart from pastoral oversight.
Apparently this apparition has its own "Fr. Gruner" of Fatima fame. Regardless of Fr. Gruner, Fatima is considered true. Are you saying Our Lady of Good Success and its messages and prophecies are all a hoax? Admittedly I did not hear much about it until recently, so I don't purport to know. The messages about the twentieth century sure seem spot on though (not in a sedevacantist way) - just that we do have the priest-sex scandal, other priests falling (the black dog thing), vocations in the West had been very low, marriage is on the rocks, etc. and the restoration mentioned could allude to the Triumph of the Immaculate Heart of Mary.
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