Is smoking in moderation OK?

[LemonAndLime]

Originally Posted by John21652

And you and your ilk believe in your opinions so much you ram them down other people's throats, thereby creating a maternalistic nanny state and overriding free will and the exercising of personal choice and good manners. In the process you created a bureaucracy to force people to behave in a certain way and the notion of instilling good manners into people has been circumvented and even made redundant by legislation.

They're not opinions . It is scientific fact that smoking is damaging to your health and if my government or anyone elses wants to ban people from smoking in public (damaging the lungs of people who don't want to smoke) then that has my full support. My government is actually protecting my freedom by doing so, not limiting it.

Also, you seem to be sticking to your catch phrase "materanlistic nanny state" a bit without really seeming to know what it means. You keep throwing words like "bureaucracy" and "legislation" around while making wild, imprecise statements also. Seems to me like you're ranting about something you know no detail about.

[tomarin]

Originally Posted by Lilsheep88

I smoke a stick Or two like once a week.. Much like I have a beer on a friday or Saturday especially when I go to a bar with friends... And no I am not peer pressured. i know it doesnt glorify God, but I also need to be a human being once in a while.

Should I confess this ? i just had a confession yesterday too

I think it's bad for your health but I don't know that it's sinful per se.

I'm a runner and a few years ago I thought I could experiment with cigars and not lose any cardiovascular fitness in the bargain because the smoke stayed in one's mouth, in theory. Boy was I wrong. After a few puffs on one cigar I lost what seemed like months of training. So I think even smoking in moderation is much worse than drinking beer, which is arguably a healthful drink.

[LemonAndLime]

Originally Posted by John21652

Proved my point exactly.

Now English citizens complain they can hardly scratch themselves without permission from Occhealth!

What?

Smoking near others has been proven beyond doubt to harm people, so tell me, how is that similar to crazy health and safety laws that go too far?

[tassitus]

Originally Posted by LemonAndLime

Apart from the damage from tobacco is well documented and happens whether you have one or 50 cigarettes/pipes/cigars a day. So there is no sensible amount you can have as they are all dangerous.

Poppycock. Anytime you apply "research" or "science" on cigarettes and their use to cigars/pipes and their use, lumping all research under the general term "tobacco", you're bound to say something foolish. This is a politician's mistake, and leads them to seek laws further regulating the use of premium cigars because "tobacco use" (read cigarette use and exposure) causes high death rates. The two different uses are not comparable.

I read your first statement as equating one daily cigar/pipe (minimal or no inhaling of secondary smoke) with a 2-pack per day cigarette (direct inhalation) habit. While I could go so far as to concede that a single inhaled cigarette per day is significantly harmful to one's health (type of exposure + chemical additions to the tobacco), I would deny that a single pipe or cigar is SIGNIFICANTLY harmful to one's health (all things have SOME health risk, even the butter on your toast, after all).

In fact, I read a study about a year ago that showed casual cigar or pipe smokers (however defined, I think it was one or fewer cigars/pipes per day) actually have LONGER life expectations than nonsmokers. The key reason? The reduction of stress to the casual cigar/pipe smoker brought about by the "use" (as opposed to the "misuse" involved in cigarette addiction) offered a benefit to his/her overall health that outweighed whatever negative effect the tobacco exposure might bring about. In other words, stress is more dangerous to one's health than casual tobacco use of the type involved with cigars and pipes..

[tassitus]

Originally Posted by LemonAndLime

What?

Smoking near others has been proven beyond doubt to harm people, so tell me, how is that similar to crazy health and safety laws that go too far?

Those who do not want to inhale smoke should not have to. Agreed. I limit my smoking to my own front porch (or open garage if it's cold out) and cigar lounges - everyone in the cigar lounge has consented to the exposure, which actually is fairly minimal since the air filtration systems or "scrubbers" work almost too well.

But those who occasionally enjoy tobacco in a public setting should also be allowed a place to do so - teetotalism in this area is not very Catholic.

[bcra]

as a former smoker (i use to smoke a pack a day from my early teen life to my heart attack at age 62) it took a lot of prayers to bring me to quiting. i pray for you also with God s help all things are possible. if my father called it quits at age 65 and he smoked 2 packs a day. you also can. (even if God took him 4 years after) you will be in my prayers. jesus help this person to quit smoking.

[John21652]

Originally Posted by LemonAndLime

They're not opinions . It is scientific fact that smoking is damaging to your health and if my government or anyone elses wants to ban people from smoking in public (damaging the lungs of people who don't want to smoke) then that has my full support. My government is actually protecting my freedom by doing so, not limiting it.

You and your ilk try to 'protect' your freedoms by restricting the freedoms of others. And you have indeed instituted a bureacracy to enforce the law. Britains outrageous occupation health and safety regulations and inspectors have severely and rediculously restricted people's freedoms.

Also, you seem to be sticking to your catch phrase "materanlistic nanny state" a bit without really seeming to know what it means. You keep throwing words like "bureaucracy" and "legislation" around while making wild, imprecise statements also. Seems to me like you're ranting about something you know no detail about.

I am actually part of a movement that is desperately trying to prevent importing even more of what we call "the British disease" into Australia. That "British disease" includes a bloated bureacracy and a welfare mentality that makes us cringe at what Britain has become. I'm sure you wont like reading that, but that's how others see you. The adjective "maternalistic", as contrasted to "paternalistic" indicates Australians views on British culture, with its rules and regulations.

Sir Walter Raleigh and Sir Francis Drake would have been so busy filling out Occ Health forms, they'd have never gotten out to sea!!

[Baelor]

Originally Posted by tassitus

But those who occasionally enjoy tobacco in a public setting should also be allowed a place to do so - teetotalism in this area is not very Catholic.

I disagree. I lived in Europe for a time, and was constantly inhaling other people's smoke. It was disgusting. No one should have to avoid a public space because someone is smoking there; no one has a "right" to smoke in a given area.

Originally Posted by John21652

You and your ilk try to 'protect' your freedoms by restricting the freedoms of others.

Your "freedom" does not including smoking in a public area. And that train of thought is immediately demonstrably absurd. Why then can I not shoot shotguns in the air in a public space? Kill other people in a public space? Run around naked in a public space? Most of our legal system that affects us on a daily basis involves a hierarchy of rights like you describe.

[chypmonk]

Have you considered e-cigaretts? That way you get the kick without all the other stuff
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ysGyfLwwr1s

[LemonAndLime]

Originally Posted by Baelor

I disagree. I lived in Europe for a time, and was constantly inhaling other people's smoke. It was disgusting. No one should have to avoid a public space because someone is smoking there; no one has a "right" to smoke in a given area.




Your "freedom" does not including smoking in a public area. And that train of thought is immediately demonstrably absurd. Why then can I not shoot shotguns in the air in a public space? Kill other people in a public space? Run around naked in a public space? Most of our legal system that affects us on a daily basis involves a hierarchy of rights like you describe.

[MindOverMatter2]

Originally Posted by Lilsheep88

I smoke a stick Or two like once a week.. Much like I have a beer on a friday or Saturday especially when I go to a bar with friends... And no I am not peer pressured. i know it doesnt glorify God, but I also need to be a human being once in a while.

Should I confess this ? i just had a confession yesterday too

Cigarettes cause cancer. Its not a secret. Smoking is not good. Your lungs are not really designed for that usage.

[Lilsheep88]

Originally Posted by chypmonk

Have you considered e-cigaretts? That way you get the kick without all the other stuff
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ysGyfLwwr1s

LOL. .. e-cigarettes.

[Lilsheep88]

Yeah but alchohol also causes kidney failure, liver damage, car crashes, depletion of brain cells, if not used in moderation. We often hear of Mothers Against Drunk Driving, but never against Mothers Against Smoking and Driving because the fact of the matter is, alchohol is not, if just as, deadly as smoking ciggarettes. The key word is moderation.

Originally Posted by MindOverMatter2

Cigarettes cause cancer. Its not a secret. Smoking is not good. Your lungs are not really designed for that usage.

And who is to say that smoking one or two sticks can lead to smoking a pack a day? The scientific community? Im sorry, but I dont trust the garbage so called scientific community releases to the public at all, which often makes up fake diseases such as restless legs syndrome, fake medicines for the sake of profit, or publishing fake studies to advance powerful interests of society. Dont buy everything the so called scientific communiy tells you because chances are, not everything they say is true. The more you believe what they tell you, the more your subconscious mind will make it a reality = placebo effect.

I dont buy that. If you are self controlled, then stick with the quota. In my hypothetic case, one or two smokes a week with the company of friends. The same can be said for drinking beer too.. if you know your limit you stop there. We can also say alchohol has this "addicting" effect in the same way nicotine has. Its all about willpower and knowing when to stop.

[Lilsheep88]

I LOL'd

Originally Posted by tassitus

I think the risks associated with cigarette smoking can in no way justify anything close to frequent use. However, I do feel cigar and pipe smoking can be enjoyed sensibly. Moderation is the key - just ask these fine Brothers of the Leaf:

[Catholic90]

Just one makes ya stink. That does not change.