Don't Want Kids, Want to Get Married

Brofessor · #1 Feb 21, '12, 3:43 am

Hi guys, I'm a 22 year old dude. I am very much in love with my girlfriend, and honestly could see myself spending my life with her. Now, even though I no longer attend a Catholic church, I still think there's a lot of value to be seen in Catholic teachings. I've been thinking a lot about the implications of marriage. One of the implications of marriage, to Catholics, is that we should have kids.

But I don't want kids. I don't ever see myself wanting kids. Maybe fifteen years down the line I might adopt, but even that's astronomically unlikely. As a result, I'm planning on getting a vasectomy someday (with the consent of my then-spouse, of course).

What does Catholic teaching have to say about something like this? I know the Catholic church forbids contraception, which has never made much sense to me, but this isn't really the same thing. Are there any good arguments why I shouldn't go ahead and have such a procedure done?

Irishmom2 · #2 Feb 21, '12, 5:10 am

I know that you will not agree with what I am going to say. But you are only 22 years old. You think you have what you believe, what you want out of life and what your future may be figured out.

You don't. You have it figured out for now, but not for years down the road. When I was your age, I didn't get why people wanted kids. I didn't get it until I was older, and married.

Don't be in such a rush. You will find that your feelings about many things will change over the years. Your understanding of things will change and so will your beliefs and your desires.

I know you might be sitting there now saying that I don't know you yaddah, yaddah. You're right, I don't. But one of the things I have learned is that while we are all unique, in some ways, we are all just like everyone else.

May God bless you and guide you.

Brofessor · #3 Feb 21, '12, 5:13 am

Quote:

Originally Posted by Irishmom2

I know that you will not agree with what I am going to say. But you are only 22 years old. You think you have what you believe, what you want out of life and what your future may be figured out.

You don't. You have it figured out for now, but not for years down the road. When I was your age, I didn't get why people wanted kids. I didn't get it until I was older, and married.

Don't be in such a rush. You will find that your feelings about many things will change over the years. Your understanding of things will change and so will your beliefs and your desires.

I know you might be sitting there now saying that I don't know you yaddah, yaddah. You're right, I don't. But one of the things I have learned is that while we are all unique, in some ways, we are all just like everyone else.

May God bless you and guide you.

On the contrary, Irishmom, that was very insightful! Sometimes I forget how young I am still. I have a lot to learn! Sometimes it's hard reminding myself to slow down...

Irishmom2 · #4 Feb 21, '12, 5:14 am

There are plenty of people here that are willing to remind you!

Sillara · #5 Feb 21, '12, 5:20 am

At 22, my then-fiance said he didn't want children, but for my sake, he MIGHT be willing to have ONE. We married, and we were both 22.

Now we are 37. We have six daughters.

He changed his mind about children. (And we actually converted to the Church. We used to be Protestants, but we saw the error of our ways.)

Now, it appears that I am about to lose my fertility entirely. It is a bit sad, even now after half a dozen children. I am just grateful to have had them. I nearly lost my uterus after the second.

Spencerian · #6 Feb 21, '12, 5:44 am

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brofessor

Hi guys, I'm a 22 year old dude. I am very much in love with my girlfriend, and honestly could see myself spending my life with her. Now, even though I no longer attend a Catholic church, I still think there's a lot of value to be seen in Catholic teachings. I've been thinking a lot about the implications of marriage. One of the implications of marriage, to Catholics, is that we should have kids.

But I don't want kids. I don't ever see myself wanting kids. Maybe fifteen years down the line I might adopt, but even that's astronomically unlikely. As a result, I'm planning on getting a vasectomy someday (with the consent of my then-spouse, of course).

What does Catholic teaching have to say about something like this? I know the Catholic church forbids contraception, which has never made much sense to me, but this isn't really the same thing. Are there any good arguments why I shouldn't go ahead and have such a procedure done?

Hi.

Marriage, like sex, is not an event that necessarily is designed to make you feel good about yourself. As others have noted, you're younger, so there's time to not only ensure that you will be marrying your best friend, but to understand Church teaching on marriage, sex, babies and contraception.

Let's start with contraception. The Church has always prohibited contraception in all its forms, which includes abortion, condoms, the Pill, vasectomies and tubal ligation. These acts are grave matter which, if you know it's grave and do it anyway, become mortal sins, which is the worst thing of all to do (See the Catechism of the Catholic Church, #2366-2372). By doing these acts you are intentionally changing God's design to allow the possibility of new life. Please don't think of "gaming the system" by doing such things and then going to Confession--such an act is also grave, for you make the presumption that God automatically forgives you. Testing God, in other words, is a bad idea.

In that passage, you will also note that the Church prohibits sex outside of marriage. This is because sex is meant not just for fun, but to bring new life. That does not mean that all sex must bring in life, but that you align your behavior to the opportunity when conditions are right. What conditions? Well...marriage, to start. (CCC 2373 to 2379) To marry in the Catholic Church means you are open to new life by definition.

I'm sure that my comments are the last thing you want to hear, but the Church and her teachings have been around far, far longer than you and I have. It may not be easy to consider, much less do. But if you are serious about your faith and your dedication to God, these are very important matters to ponder.

God did not bring you to this Earth to be an end to yourself. He desires all of us to make a better version of ourselves and to teach that child to bring good and joy to the world. You seem an intelligent, reasonable person, and it would be a shame for you to write off the idea of marrying and creating a family with smart kids that can make a difference in someone's life someday.

God bless, study up, and do consider. It's radical, but it's also a right action.

cathlikrn · #7 Feb 21, '12, 5:47 am

God bless you for coming to this site for advice at age 22! I wish that I would have that at your age.
I can tell you, without hesitation, if you follow Catholic teachings on marriage and contraception, you will be abundantly blessed. You will not have regrets when you are older and will have a better understanding of what it means to unconditionally love when you accept children in your marriage. When we consider the great love that our Lord Jesus has for us, to suffer and die for us, to forgive us our sins, it is so hard to comprehend. Having a child of your own, helps you to realize how deeply you can love another human being. Wow, the love you have for your own child is beyond words. It enables us to better understand God's love for us.

FightingFat · #8 Feb 21, '12, 6:07 am

I think you have some lovely posts and advice here. I would echo that what you think you want now may change diametrically before long.

Children are the fruit of the love you share with your wife and a tremendous gift from God.

Captain America · #9 Feb 21, '12, 8:48 am

Folks, we gotta just realize that there are many young men out there is a situation similar to this guys.

Me, for instance. I wasn't too keen on kids. I think many guys are raised this way. I also think that spectator sports keep men juvenile---perhaps that childish element is prolonged in men by virtue of the Couch Sports, video games and consumer stuff. (Not talking of the OP here, but generally).

Anyway, OP, trust me here when I say that children are enormously valuable to your development as a full person. They will expose you to greater awareness of the awesomeness of human life, and the depths of human emotion. Kids are an enormously positive influence, a major factor in personal development, on their parents!

It is an experience that must be experienced to be experienced. . . and understood. Unless you have kids, you just won't get it.

Captain America · #10 Feb 21, '12, 8:49 am

Oh yeah, OP, why not go to mass? The big difference between the Catholic Church and the Prots is that we've got the real presence in the holy Eucharist.

It makes a difference.

shainski · #11 Feb 21, '12, 9:55 am

I know 22 is a full-grown adult, but you are in store for a lot of changes.

If i were to turn the clock back five years, what was your world view then? what did you want? what would your ideal world have looked like? You were 17 and probably convinced that you were pretty grown up.

Now, if i go back another 5 years, what did your ideal world look like? At age 12, you probably wondered what more could you possibly learn. You were pretty smart - what did you want? You were probably smarter than your parents at that age (or at least you may have thought so).

Now, if we go ahead 5 years, you may be surprised that your own world will look just as foreign as that one five years ago looks now.

That's the problem with doing anything permanent at a young age. Your interests right now may seem just as silly in five years as if you had gotten a "Pokeman" tatoo at age 12.

When you fall in love - Really fall in love. I know you really think you are in love, but when i see

Quote:

I am very much in love with my girlfriend, and honestly could see myself spending my life with her.

that just doesn't seem the same as

Quote:

I am very much in love with my girlfriend. I can't imagine my life without her.

You have a lot of life ahead of you. Enjoy the journey, and don't do anything that can't be undone until you are sure - absolutely sure.

Captain America · #12 Feb 21, '12, 6:00 pm

Respectfully differ. At 22, you'll likely have as much good sense as you ever will have, particularly when it comes to big decisions.

I pity those who temporize, waltz around, for their lives; without a longer sense of direction, they amble about and don't amount to much more than a hill of beans.

To be sure, I'm putting it starkly, harshly, super contrasty. But I doubt the OP is immature. He's a man, not a boy.

The sad thing is that there is an idea that the 20s are the New Teen Years. . . the dire social consequence is a diminishing population (compare European statistics here). OP, wait until you're 30 to marry and 35 to have kids. . . and you'll learn your wife's become infertile!

But the basic point, and I doubt we'll find any serious disagreement, is that kids are good for you, good for your heart, good for your undestanding of what humanity is all about.

sainthumbert · #13 Feb 21, '12, 6:42 pm

Congratulations on seeking out answers from those within the Church. You can read Casti Connubii, Humanae Vitae, and Envangelium Vitae and they will tell you why such an action (sterilization) is sinful and why the opposite (fruitfullness) is proper. Why don't you want children? Are you pursuing a career? Are you pursuing a passion? What do you thing the Lord might say if you spent your life pursuing a career and getting promotions to the detriment of having children and raising them in the faith? What will your career profit you when you are 80 years old and on your death bed? On the contrary, think of how much 3, 4, 6, or 8 children all raised properly in the faith would benefit you on your death bed. God bless and thank you for considering the thoughts of those within the Church.

Brofessor · #14 Feb 22, '12, 4:45 am

Thank you for your incredibly charitable and kind responses. You're right in that a lot of guys like me think this way when we're young, but change our minds further down the line. I especially liked the post from Sillara, because that's exactly the situation I'm in right now! My girlfriend has made "when I have kids" sentences before, and although we're not discussing it I'm thinking along the lines of "well, if she won't be happy otherwise, maybe one, if we adopt".

I guess my main argument against having kids is that there are so many children in need, it would be selfish to have children ourselves instead of adopting. Does anyone else have thoughts on this?

Quote:

Oh yeah, OP, why not go to mass? The big difference between the Catholic Church and the Prots is that we've got the real presence in the holy Eucharist.

It makes a difference.

Well, I go to an Episcopal Church (USA) now, which obviously Catholics wouldn't see as being a valid Mass. I'm put off by the Catholic Church's teaching that her magisterium is infallible and must be obeyed, even if we personally struggle. I don't think I could see myself not standing up to a teaching that I found unethical. On the other hand, churches like the Anglican Communion and Old Catholics seem to foster a culture of questioning and tolerance for different interpretations of teaching.

You know, Spencerian talked about how the Catholic teaching has been around a lot longer, and has been worked out by people much smarter than me. This is absolutely true, but I feel it would be inconsistent to firmly believe something that may be contrary to Church teaching, but submit myself to this teaching nonetheless.

glamourdollxoxo · #15 Feb 27, '12, 8:16 pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brofessor

Thank you for your incredibly charitable and kind responses. You're right in that a lot of guys like me think this way when we're young, but change our minds further down the line. I especially liked the post from Sillara, because that's exactly the situation I'm in right now! My girlfriend has made "when I have kids" sentences before, and although we're not discussing it I'm thinking along the lines of "well, if she won't be happy otherwise, maybe one, if we adopt".

I guess my main argument against having kids is that there are so many children in need, it would be selfish to have children ourselves instead of adopting. Does anyone else have thoughts on this?

Well, I go to an Episcopal Church (USA) now, which obviously Catholics wouldn't see as being a valid Mass. I'm put off by the Catholic Church's teaching that her magisterium is infallible and must be obeyed, even if we personally struggle. I don't think I could see myself not standing up to a teaching that I found unethical. On the other hand, churches like the Anglican Communion and Old Catholics seem to foster a culture of questioning and tolerance for different interpretations of teaching.

You know, Spencerian talked about how the Catholic teaching has been around a lot longer, and has been worked out by people much smarter than me. This is absolutely true, but I feel it would be inconsistent to firmly believe something that may be contrary to Church teaching, but submit myself to this teaching nonetheless.

I don't see myself having kids until I'm least 28 I'm 23 right now and I don't think for me kids are something I need to rush into the same goes for marriage. I know some people who do the get married and have a kid nine months later, but I don't see that happening for me and due to health issues.