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  #46  
Old Feb 23, '12, 3:14 pm
Bubba Switzler Bubba Switzler is offline
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Default Re: Social Issues and the Santorum Surge

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Originally Posted by poker10 View Post
So by your account, all taxes are evil. Roads are evil, police are evil, any kind of government is evil. Because it's all paid by taxes, just like a single-payer system would be.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Subsidiarity_(Catholicism)
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  #47  
Old Feb 24, '12, 8:39 am
Bubba Switzler Bubba Switzler is offline
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Default Re: Social Issues and the Santorum Surge

A higher-brow version of the theocracy-is-just-around-the-corner argument:

Quote:
Santorum, who makes Mitt Romney look blandly secular by comparison, has a well-known animus against accepted sexual practices that he believes defy Gods law his words, not mine. He opposes sex for reasons other than producing babies, sex outside of marriage, homosexuality, prenatal testing, and on and on. Contraception, he has said, gives people a license to do things in a sexual realm that is counter to how things are supposed to be.

Most Americans wont begrudge him his beliefs; hes free to practice them, and imbue his children with them, as he did by home-schooling his family. But most Americans also will part ways with him when he advocates that civil code should adhere to his religious beliefs.
http://opinionator.blogs.nytimes.com...s-discontents/
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  #48  
Old Feb 24, '12, 10:52 am
Bubba Switzler Bubba Switzler is offline
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Default Re: Social Issues and the Santorum Surge

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Majorities of Americans (or in some polls, clear pluralities) call themselves "pro-life." Every state that has held a referendum on recognizing homosexual relationships as "marriages" has voted not to do so (or, more precisely, has voted to define marriage as being only between a man and woman). Wholesome movies regularly do better at the box office than sleazy ones do. Americans prefer being "tough on crime" to being lenient. Americans tend to like local control of schools, parental involvement and choice in education, and traditional curricula. Far more Americans feel strongly in favor of gun rights than in favor of gun control. Americans treasure families and neighborhoods, and oppose governmental intrusions into them. We don't like governmental racial preferences. We are deeply patriotic. We far prefer conservative judges to liberal ones. And we still are a faithful people, with churches and belief in God a very important part of most of our lives.

Also, we know deep down in our cores that candidates who draw a connection between family breakdown and out-of-wedlock births, on one hand, and cultural and economic ills like crime, delinquency, and lack of economic mobility, on the other, are absolutely right. Statistically, the case in favor of this argument is irrefutable. Psychologically, we know it is right. And we've known it is right for nearly half a century. We didn't even need a "conservative" to make that case for it; we relied, quite correctly, on the social-science findings of the politically liberal (or center-leftist) Daniel Patrick Moynihan.

Finally, we believe with every fiber of our beings that voluntary associations, churches, and local associations are better at ameliorating social ills than are governments, especially the federal government. When we talk about cultural values and social concerns, we usually do not do so because we want government to impose our values on others through government programs; instead, we either want government to get out of the way of these intermediary institutions (or of the family), or else we want the government to do no more than make it easier for those institutions to act.
http://spectator.org/archives/2012/0...ism-winning-ri
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  #49  
Old Feb 24, '12, 10:56 am
yogicat yogicat is offline
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Default Re: Social Issues and the Santorum Surge

Honestly, I think the higher ups (whoever those are) want Obama to win reelection. Obama will win reelection. Every Republican nominee up there has no chance of winning - and we all know it. Ron Paul will probably run as an independent and make it even more difficult. I'm sorry, I don't disagree with Santorum's views, but this is America. Cultural melting pot. A president who would attempt to force non-religious individuals to follow religious teachings, is just not going to win here.
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  #50  
Old Feb 24, '12, 11:02 am
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Default Re: Social Issues and the Santorum Surge

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Originally Posted by yogicat View Post
Honestly, I think the higher ups (whoever those are) want Obama to win reelection. Obama will win reelection. Every Republican nominee up there has no chance of winning - and we all know it. Ron Paul will probably run as an independent and make it even more difficult. I'm sorry, I don't disagree with Santorum's views, but this is America. Cultural melting pot. A president who would attempt to force non-religious individuals to follow religious teachings, is just not going to win here.
Exactly what is Santorum going to force on American's?
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  #51  
Old Feb 24, '12, 12:29 pm
He Man He Man is offline
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Default Re: Social Issues and the Santorum Surge

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Originally Posted by qui est ce View Post
Exactly what is Santorum going to force on American's?
Freedom of speech, apparently.

I love how crazy people get over a policitian's socially conservative values. Santorum hasn't mentioned one policy he'd enact to force homeschooling or NFP on the general populace, and yet just mentioning it makes people mad. Shows you how deeply seeded the devil is in this culture.
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  #52  
Old Feb 24, '12, 12:45 pm
Bubba Switzler Bubba Switzler is offline
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Default Re: Social Issues and the Santorum Surge

The WSJ took not one but to whacks at Santorum on social issues today:

"Moralizer in Chief?
Americans are open to candidates of faith. Less so to any hint they might impose their moral views if they're elected."

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB1000...291787938.html

"Democrats Are Praying for a Santorum Nomination
His long record of statements on religious and social issues are of a sort that large sectors of the American public find unpalatable."

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB1000...LEFTTopOpinion
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  #53  
Old Feb 24, '12, 1:44 pm
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Default Re: Social Issues and the Santorum Surge

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bubba Switzler View Post
The WSJ took not one but to whacks at Santorum on social issues today:

"Moralizer in Chief?
Americans are open to candidates of faith. Less so to any hint they might impose their moral views if they're elected."

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB1000...291787938.html

"Democrats Are Praying for a Santorum Nomination
His long record of statements on religious and social issues are of a sort that large sectors of the American public find unpalatable."

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB1000...LEFTTopOpinion
meh
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  #54  
Old Feb 24, '12, 1:46 pm
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Default Re: Social Issues and the Santorum Surge

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bubba Switzler View Post
The WSJ took not one but to whacks at Santorum on social issues today:

"Moralizer in Chief?
Americans are open to candidates of faith. Less so to any hint they might impose their moral views if they're elected."

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB1000...291787938.html

"Democrats Are Praying for a Santorum Nomination
His long record of statements on religious and social issues are of a sort that large sectors of the American public find unpalatable."

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB1000...LEFTTopOpinion
I'm from St. Louis AND Missouree, the Show Me State.

Look what all the pundits were saying about the Cardinals.

Santorum was a has-been before Rick Perry was a has-been.

The WSJ must be a Romney supporter.
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  #55  
Old Feb 24, '12, 2:06 pm
Bubba Switzler Bubba Switzler is offline
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Default Re: Social Issues and the Santorum Surge

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Originally Posted by qui est ce View Post
The WSJ must be a Romney supporter.
They are, but not with any discernible enthusiasm.

I think everyone just keeps hoping, against all evidence, that Romney will get his act together earn their respect. In the mean time, Santorum and Gingrich (and Paul) seem like easy targets.
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  #56  
Old Feb 24, '12, 2:33 pm
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Default Re: Social Issues and the Santorum Surge

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Originally Posted by Bubba Switzler View Post
They are, but not with any discernible enthusiasm.

I think everyone just keeps hoping, against all evidence, that Romney will get his act together earn their respect. In the mean time, Santorum and Gingrich (and Paul) seem like easy targets.
So you agree the Santorum surge is not just a temporary blip?
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  #57  
Old Feb 24, '12, 2:39 pm
Rich Olszewski Rich Olszewski is offline
 
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Default Re: Social Issues and the Santorum Surge

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Originally Posted by qui est ce View Post
The WSJ must be a Romney supporter.
Could be. It's certainly not an Obama hand puppet.
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  #58  
Old Feb 24, '12, 2:47 pm
irishpatrick irishpatrick is offline
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Default Re: Social Issues and the Santorum Surge

Quote:
Originally Posted by yogicat View Post
Honestly, I think the higher ups (whoever those are) want Obama to win reelection. Obama will win reelection. Every Republican nominee up there has no chance of winning - and we all know it. Ron Paul will probably run as an independent and make it even more difficult. I'm sorry, I don't disagree with Santorum's views, but this is America. Cultural melting pot. A president who would attempt to force non-religious individuals to follow religious teachings, is just not going to win here.
What teachings would Santorum try to make others follow?

I do NOT agree with your analysis--I think people want someone with some sense of traditional morality.
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  #59  
Old Feb 24, '12, 2:48 pm
Bubba Switzler Bubba Switzler is offline
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Default Re: Social Issues and the Santorum Surge

Quote:
Originally Posted by qui est ce View Post
So you agree the Santorum surge is not just a temporary blip?
I could see it going either way.

Santorum is far from a perfect candidate, he was a "team player" meaning he voted for lots of stuff in solidarity with the Republican establishment, and he has a track record of favoring "compassionate conservativism".

On the other hand, he has not "blown up" like the other flavors of the month have. He remains a serious, if flawed, contender.

Romney, meanwhile, just can't seem to attract enough support to put the race away. He has plenty of baggage of his own but, worse, just doesn't seem to be learning or improving.

But I am enjoying the panic by the media and Democrat and Republican establishments with Santorum's rise.

(Of course, as one writer noted, nobody ever challenged Obama on his support for infanticide; we all know there is a double standard at work.)

In the end, I'll support anyone against Obama, even Gingrich.
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  #60  
Old Feb 24, '12, 2:50 pm
irishpatrick irishpatrick is offline
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Default Re: Social Issues and the Santorum Surge

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bubba Switzler View Post
I could see it going either way.

Santorum is far from a perfect candidate, he was a "team player" meaning he voted for lots of stuff in solidarity with the Republican establishment, and he has a track record of favoring "compassionate conservativism".

On the other hand, he has not "blown up" like the other flavors of the month have. He remains a serious, if flawed, contender.

Romney, meanwhile, just can't seem to attract enough support to put the race away. He has plenty of baggage of his own but, worse, just doesn't seem to be learning or improving.

But I am enjoying the panic by the media and Democrat and Republican establishments with Santorum's rise.

(Of course, as one writer noted, nobody ever challenged Obama on his support for infanticide; we all know there is a double standard at work.)

In the end, I'll support anyone against Obama, even Gingrich.
Name one man that has held the office of the Presidency, who was not a flawed contender as a candidate.
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