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  #1  
Old Feb 24, '12, 6:44 am
demetrios423 demetrios423 is offline
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Default attending mass and being Catholic

I just read a report about my parish that states we have 6543 registered parishioners, but only 21% attend mass.

My question is, are those that don't ever come to mass still be considered Catholic? When are we something as opposed to saying we are something?
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  #2  
Old Feb 24, '12, 8:01 am
fred conty fred conty is offline
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Default Re: attending mass and being Catholic

That only means that ecumenism applies not only to those who are not of the faith but more importantly to those who are of the faith. It is like a campfire that has died down all except for a few hot embers. And we hope that those embers someday will be rekindled by the Holy Spirit because you and I prayed for them.

Just a thought.
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  #3  
Old Feb 24, '12, 8:05 am
rtodaro rtodaro is offline
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Default Re: attending mass and being Catholic

Missing Mass, although considered a mortal sin, does not result in a person no longer being considered a Catholic.However, if a Catholic no longer wishes to remain a Catholic they have to go through a process, which I believe is called an act of "defection."

I'm a lay person - so I may be entirely incorrect. I'm sure there is someone else who can provide a better answer.
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  #4  
Old Feb 24, '12, 8:08 am
demetrios423 demetrios423 is offline
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Default Re: attending mass and being Catholic

My original question has been on my mind for a while. The republican candidates who claim to be catholic don't seem to reflect their faith most of the time. Which lead to my question the label of catholic vs being catholic. there must be a difference.
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  #5  
Old Feb 24, '12, 8:30 am
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centurionguard centurionguard is offline
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Default Re: attending mass and being Catholic

Quote:
Originally Posted by demetrios423 View Post
I just read a report about my parish that states we have 6543 registered parishioners, but only 21% attend mass.

My question is, are those that don't ever come to mass still be considered Catholic? When are we something as opposed to saying we are something?
Quote:
Originally Posted by demetrios423 View Post
My question is, are those that don't ever come to mass still be considered Catholic? When are we something as opposed to saying we are something?
Personally; I would never make a brash statement in saying there no longer Catholic if they were baptized Catholic.

Perhaps the better thing to say is that they're Lost Sheep.
Being a devout Catholic presents a huge life-long challenge.

I think every Catholic needs to search every fiber of their being and ask themselves truthfully What Makes Them Catholic? It really is a soul searching question.

What does it mean to be Catholic?
http://www.bostoncatholic.org/Being-....aspx?id=11316

Quote:
People have chosen to enter the Catholic Church for various reasons. Members of the Church have different understandings of what makes them Catholic or why they are Catholic. However, there is a common thread that binds all Catholics together. Catholics belong to a Christ-centered faith community that views Jesus Christ as the foundation. Catholics share Jesusí vision and model their lives after Jesusí example of love. Catholics are called to care for one another and to use their unique gifts and talents for the good of the community and the world. Below is a listing of some of the basic beliefs and values of a Catholic:

*We believe in God who is our loving Father and creator. Godís love is limitless and overflows into our hearts and lives. God has created us out of His love that sustains and supports us daily.
*We believe that God sent us his own beloved Son, Jesus Christ, who suffered, died, and rose from the dead, to save us and offer us the gift of eternal life. We profess faith in the divinity of Jesus Christ, the son of God. Jesus is our Lord and Savior, our Shepherd and King.
*We believe in the Holy Spirit and in the Spiritís powerful presence in the Church today. The Spirit, given by Jesus to the Church at Pentecost, enables the Lord to continue to be present with us today and to continue his saving mission. The Spirit imparts wisdom and knowledge to us and gives us our various spiritual gifts, which are found in the Bible. We are called to recognize and share these gifts with the community. The Spirit helps us to continue to develop our faith and to grow in our relationship with God.
*We strive to follow Jesusí teachings in our lives: to love God above all else and to love others, to practice forgiveness and mercy, to care for the poor and helpless.
*We work for peace and justice in our world. We bring Godís kingdom of peace, unity, and love to a world faced with conflict, division, and strife.
*We worship and praise God by living a sacramental life. We recognize the need for forgiveness and see the sacrament of reconciliation as a means to receive this great gift of forgiveness. We recognize that our sin harms the community in some way and the sacramental gift of reconciliation helps heal our relationships with others, the community, and God. We also encounter the real presence of Jesus Christ in the Eucharist and are nourished and fed by the Eucharist on a weekly basis. The Eucharist binds us together as a community and with God. We believe that the Eucharist is not merely a sign or symbol of Jesus, but rather the real body and blood of Christ. We are open to receiving this real presence and to becoming the body of Christ in the world.
*We recognize the importance of prayer and take time to develop an active prayer life. Prayer strengthens and defines our relationship with God. Without prayer, we lose touch with our loving God and we isolate ourselves from a God who desires intimacy and closeness.
*We recognize the importance of reading and praying the Sacred Scriptures. The Bible is Godís word and we strive to learn and understand the word of God by applying the Scriptures to our lives today.
*We acknowledge the primacy of the Pope and respect the office of the papacy as the true teaching authority of the Church. We seek guidance for moral decisions from the pope and the bishops in communion with him.
*We recognize the importance of service to others. Believing that Jesus came to serve and not to be served, we strive to follow the example of Jesus and spread his message of love. We try our best to live lives centered on the Gospel and to live for others, rather than just for ourselves.
*We preach the Gospel of Jesus Christ, both in word and in action. We are willing to stand up to opposition and preach Gospel values in a world whose values are often contrary to the message of Jesus. We are willing to endure suffering and rejection, as did Jesus, for the sake of the Gospel and to speak up for what we believe to be right, just, and true.
*We are devoted to Mary, the Mother of God, and see the saints as true examples of holiness and faith. We pray through Mary and the saints and ask them to intercede for us.
*We are committed to the protection of all of life, in all stages. We pray for the protection of all of human life, from the moment of conception until natural death. We also work to strive to respect the dignity of every human being and to eliminate prejudice, oppression, poverty, violence, and injustice.
*We are a community of believers united with Catholics from around the world.
continued:
__________________
It takes courage to live through suffering; and it takes honesty to observe it. C. S. Lewis
To love means loving the unlovable. To forgive means pardoning the unpardonable. Faith means believing the unbelievable. Hope means hoping when everything seems hopeless.
G. K. Chesterton.
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  #6  
Old Feb 24, '12, 8:31 am
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centurionguard centurionguard is offline
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Default Re: attending mass and being Catholic

continued:

The Gospel of Luke 12: verses 1-8
Quote:
1 And *he spoke also a parable to them, that we ought always to pray, and not to faint,

2 Saying: There was a judge in a certain city, who feared not God, nor regarded man.

3 And there was a certain widow in that city, and she came to him, saying: Avenge me of my adversary.

4 And he would not for a long time. But afterwards he said within himself: Although I fear not God, nor regard man,

5 Yet because this widow is troublesome to me, I will avenge her, lest continually coming, she weary me out.

6 And the Lord said: Hear what the unjust judge saith:

7 And will not God avenge his elect, who cry to him day and night: and will he have patience in their regard?

8 I say to you, he will quickly avenge them. But yet, when the Son of man cometh, shall he find, think you, faith on earth?
Haydock's Catholic Bible Commentary, 1859 edition.
Quote:
Ver. 8. In the Greek, although he suffer for the present the elect to be oppressed. (Bible de Vence) --- Our divine Redeemer adds, this, to shew that faith must necessarily accompany our prayers. For whosoever prays for what he does not believe he shall obtain, will pray in vain; let us, therefore, entreat the Father of mercies to grant us the grace of prayer, and firmness in faith; for faith produces prayer, and prayer produces firmness of faith. (St. Augustine, de verb. Dom. Serm 36.) --- But of this there is little left on the earth, and there will be still less at the second coming of the Son of God.
__________________
It takes courage to live through suffering; and it takes honesty to observe it. C. S. Lewis
To love means loving the unlovable. To forgive means pardoning the unpardonable. Faith means believing the unbelievable. Hope means hoping when everything seems hopeless.
G. K. Chesterton.
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  #7  
Old Feb 24, '12, 8:54 am
paperwight66 paperwight66 is offline
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Default Re: attending mass and being Catholic

Quote:
Originally Posted by fred conty View Post
That only means that ecumenism applies not only to those who are not of the faith but more importantly to those who are of the faith. It is like a campfire that has died down all except for a few hot embers. And we hope that those embers someday will be rekindled by the Holy Spirit because you and I prayed for them.

Just a thought.



I'm pretty sure you meant to write 'evangelism' or 'evangelising' there, not 'ecumenism'.
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  #8  
Old Feb 24, '12, 8:59 am
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JRKH JRKH is online now
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Default Re: attending mass and being Catholic

Quote:
Originally Posted by demetrios423 View Post
I just read a report about my parish that states we have 6543 registered parishioners, but only 21% attend mass.
Those numbers can reflect a lot of different things.
For instance, Illness - My wife and I rarely attend mass because she has Alzheimer's and I am her full time caregiver. I have discussed this with our pastor and received a dispensation from our mass obligation.
I still do try to get to mass when possible.

Another thing might be - how do they measure this? Is it by collection envelopes? Such would at best reflect "families" not individuals. But there could be people who attend mass but are unable to give and so do not use their envelopes..

This is another case of a random statistic used without any background to illuminate it.

Quote:
My question is, are those that don't ever come to mass still be considered Catholic? When are we something as opposed to saying we are something?
"Considered Catholic" by whom???

The Church considers anyone baptized into the Church unless they formally defect.

Peace
James
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.... if I have all faith so as to move mountians but have not love, I am nothing. - (1Cor 13:2)


The Best book on Spirituality that I ever Read: "The Fulfillment of All Desire"

Oh my God , I will continue
to perform, all my actions
for the love of Thee
Amen.
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  #9  
Old Feb 24, '12, 9:03 am
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anp1215 anp1215 is offline
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Default Re: attending mass and being Catholic

Hasn't formal defection been done away with?
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  #10  
Old Feb 24, '12, 9:10 am
demetrios423 demetrios423 is offline
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Default Re: attending mass and being Catholic

My question is not to say what people are or aren't. It is just a question in hopes to gain understanding.
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  #11  
Old Feb 24, '12, 9:15 am
Lancer Lancer is offline
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Default Re: attending mass and being Catholic

Quote:
Originally Posted by rtodaro View Post
Missing Mass, although considered a mortal sin, does not result in a person no longer being considered a Catholic.However, if a Catholic no longer wishes to remain a Catholic they have to go through a process, which I believe is called an act of "defection."

I'm a lay person - so I may be entirely incorrect. I'm sure there is someone else who can provide a better answer.
Two excerpts for clarification...one papal and one diocesan ...with links to complete documents. Yes...formal defection has changed...eliminated.

Pax Christi

Quote:
APOSTOLIC LETTER "MOTU PROPRIO"
OMNIUM IN MENTEM
OF THE SUPREME PONTIFF BENEDICT XVI
ON SEVERAL AMENDMENTS TO THE CODE OF CANON LAW


Experience, however, has shown that this new law gave rise to numerous pastoral problems. First, in individual cases the definition and practical configuration of such a formal act of separation from the Church has proved difficult to establish, from both a theological and a canonical standpoint. In addition, many difficulties have surfaced both in pastoral activity and the practice of tribunals. Indeed, the new law appeared, at least indirectly, to facilitate and even in some way to encourage apostasy in places where the Catholic faithful are not numerous or where unjust marriage laws discriminate between citizens on the basis of religion.

Therefore I decree that in the same Code the following words are to be eliminated: "and has not left it by a formal act " (can. 1117); "and has not left it by means of a formal act" (can. 1086 ß 1); "and has not left it by a formal act" (can. 1124).

Given in Rome, at St Peter's, on 26 October in the year 2009, the fifth of my Pontificate.
BENEDICTUS PP. XVI

http://www.vatican.va/holy_father/be...nonici_en.html
An Example of the impact
Quote:
Archdiocese of Dublin The Chancellery

29th October 2010 Personal & Confidential

Dear _____

I am writing to you in response to your correspondence in which you confirmed your wish to leave the Catholic Church.

As you may have read in news reports, the Canon Law of the Catholic Church was recently change on this matter and it now no longer possible, as it was for some years, to make a formal act of defection from the Church.
... .

Yours sincerely,

SIGNATURE Revered Fintan Gavin Assistant Chancellor [email protected]

http://www.technomancy.org/catholic-defection/
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  #12  
Old Feb 24, '12, 9:50 am
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Default Re: attending mass and being Catholic

Quote:
Originally Posted by demetrios423 View Post
My question is not to say what people are or aren't. It is just a question in hopes to gain understanding.
I think that there are many varying degrees here. In other words it isn't a boolean either/or, yes/no, on/off. kind of answer. It's hard to know what an individual's struggles are...

Peace
James
__________________
.... if I have all faith so as to move mountians but have not love, I am nothing. - (1Cor 13:2)


The Best book on Spirituality that I ever Read: "The Fulfillment of All Desire"

Oh my God , I will continue
to perform, all my actions
for the love of Thee
Amen.
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