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  #1  
Old Feb 25, '12, 11:29 am
mercytruth mercytruth is offline
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Default Is the Millenium Literal?

There is a European Catholic woman who purports to be receiving messages from God our Father, our Lord Jesus Christ and our Blessed Mother.

In one of her most recent messages from God our Father, we are told that the millenial reign of Jesus Christ on earth is literal and scriptural. Can Catholics believe this?
Secondly, we are being ask to pray the rosary on Feb.29th to avert a nuclear war in Iran.

http://www.thewarningsecondcoming.co...eace-on-earth/

Thank you, and His peace to all.
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  #2  
Old Feb 25, '12, 12:40 pm
piejesu piejesu is offline
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Default Re: Is the Millenium Literal?

We can believe any private revelation that the Church has put it's stamp of approval on, but we are not obliged to do so.
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  #3  
Old Feb 25, '12, 12:42 pm
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lauraabarlow lauraabarlow is offline
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Default Re: Is the Millenium Literal?

We are on the verge of a conflict with Iran, definitely doesn't hurt to pray the rosary for divine intervention.....
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  #4  
Old Feb 25, '12, 12:49 pm
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triumphguy triumphguy is offline
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Default Re: Is the Millenium Literal?

I think topics/discussion on private revelation are banned.
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  #5  
Old Feb 25, '12, 12:51 pm
mercytruth mercytruth is offline
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Default Re: Is the Millenium Literal?

Quote:
Originally Posted by triumphguy View Post
I think topics/discussion on private revelation are banned.
My apologies if this is the policy. Just forget my question.
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  #6  
Old Feb 25, '12, 1:07 pm
cdaters cdaters is offline
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Default Re: Is the Millenium Literal?

Mercytruth, this document contained on Catholic Answers might be helpful. It discusses millennial reign concepts:

False Profit: Money, Prejudice, and Bad Theology in Tim LaHaye’s Left Behind Series

Praying the Rosary is never a bad thing.

Last edited by cdaters; Feb 25, '12 at 1:22 pm.
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  #7  
Old Feb 25, '12, 1:51 pm
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Inego de Loyola Inego de Loyola is offline
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Default Re: Is the Millenium Literal?

Quote:
Originally Posted by The Catechism of the Catholic Church
The Church's ultimate trial

675 Before Christ's second coming the Church must pass through a final trial that will shake the faith of many believers.574 The persecution that accompanies her pilgrimage on earth575 will unveil the "mystery of iniquity" in the form of a religious deception offering men an apparent solution to their problems at the price of apostasy from the truth. The supreme religious deception is that of the Antichrist, a pseudo-messianism by which man glorifies himself in place of God and of his Messiah come in the flesh.576

676 The Antichrist's deception already begins to take shape in the world every time the claim is made to realize within history that messianic hope which can only be realized beyond history through the eschatological judgment. The Church has rejected even modified forms of this falsification of the kingdom to come under the name of millenarianism,577 especially the "intrinsically perverse" political form of a secular messianism.578

677 The Church will enter the glory of the kingdom only through this final Passover, when she will follow her Lord in his death and Resurrection.579 The kingdom will be fulfilled, then, not by a historic triumph of the Church through a progressive ascendancy, but only by God's victory over the final unleashing of evil, which will cause his Bride to come down from heaven.580 God's triumph over the revolt of evil will take the form of the Last Judgment after the final cosmic upheaval of this passing world.581
Emphasis mine.

P.S. I don't think that this thread violates the rules because the related private revelation is only peripherally involved in the central question of whether or not a belief is orthodox. Which I believe is specifically the sort of question this whole forum is about. Mods please correct me if I'm wrong in this interpretation when you close the thread.
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But there are some people, nevertheless−−and I am one of them−− who think that the most practical and important thing about a man is still his view of the universe.
Heretics by G.K. Chesterton
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  #8  
Old Feb 25, '12, 1:56 pm
mercytruth mercytruth is offline
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Default Re: Is the Millenium Literal?

Quote:
Originally Posted by cdaters View Post
Mercytruth, this document contained on Catholic Answers might be helpful. It discusses millennial reign concepts:

False Profit: Money, Prejudice, and Bad Theology in Tim LaHaye’s Left Behind Series

Praying the Rosary is never a bad thing.
Thankyou for the website from Catholic Answers. Please allow me quote a portion of it:

Justin was quick to note, however, that not all Christians held this view. In his Dialogue with Trypho the Jew (c. a.d. 165) he explained that "I and many others are of this opinion, and [believe] that such will take place, as you [Trypho] assuredly are aware; but, on the other hand, I signified to you that many who belong to the pure and pious faith, and are true Christians, think otherwise."

It is important to know this fact because pre-millennialists often portray their view as the early Christian view, but right here—in the earliest record we have of anyone holding this view—it is acknowledged that this is not the case.


I read the original dialogue with Trypho, and Justin Martyr concludes by saying,
"But I and others, who are right-minded Christians on all points, are assured that there will be a resurrection of the dead, and a thousand years in Jerusalem, which will be built, adorned, and enlarged, as the prophets Ezekiel and Isaiah and others declare."
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  #9  
Old Feb 25, '12, 2:02 pm
mercytruth mercytruth is offline
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Default Re: Is the Millenium Literal?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Inego de Loyola View Post
Emphasis mine.

P.S. I don't think that this thread violates the rules because the related private revelation is only peripherally involved in the central question of whether or not a belief is orthodox. Which I believe is specifically the sort of question this whole forum is about. Mods please correct me if I'm wrong in this interpretation when you close the thread.
Thank you for the teaching of the Catechism. May I quote the passage that seems most relevant?
"676 The Antichrist's deception already begins to take shape in the world every time the claim is made to realize within history that messianic hope"

We know that Hitler was one such person who claimed to bring in the millenium within history, but I think those who believe in the literal concept of the millenium believe that it will not take place until our Lord Jesus Christ comes to this earth.
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  #10  
Old Feb 25, '12, 2:04 pm
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Inego de Loyola Inego de Loyola is offline
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Default Re: Is the Millenium Literal?

Quote:
Originally Posted by mercytruth View Post
but I think those who believe in the literal concept in the millenium believe that it will not take place until our Lord Jesus Christ comes to this earth.
Yes but they still believe that it will take place in time rather than after the passing of this world. The reign of Christ as king after the judgment and the new heaven and earth is eternal and not "millennial" and any claim that this will happen before the judgement is specifically condemned.
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But there are some people, nevertheless−−and I am one of them−− who think that the most practical and important thing about a man is still his view of the universe.
Heretics by G.K. Chesterton
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  #11  
Old Feb 25, '12, 2:19 pm
mercytruth mercytruth is offline
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Default Re: Is the Millenium Literal?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Inego de Loyola View Post
Yes but they still believe that it will take place in time rather than after the passing of this world. The reign of Christ as king after the judgment and the new heaven and earth is eternal and not "millennial" and any claim that this will happen before the judgement is specifically condemned.
Yes, they do believe that it will take place in time. They often refer to this 1,000 years as the Sabbath millenium, and after the seventh (millenium) day the new heavens and new earth will be ushered in.

Ireneaus writes of this (time?) in " Ireneaus Against Heresies", Book IV, chapters XXXI-XXXVI.
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  #12  
Old Feb 25, '12, 3:35 pm
cdaters cdaters is offline
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Default Re: Is the Millenium Literal?

The key concepts I believe are addressed under the, "Where the Church Stands" part of the document I referred to earlier,

Quote:
Does this mean that there is no reign of Christ? No. Christ is reigning now, from heaven. As he told the apostles, "All authority in heaven and on earth has been given to me" (Matt. 28:18). etc.
There is more contained in the Catholic Encyclopedia under:

Millennium and Millenarianism
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  #13  
Old Feb 25, '12, 4:22 pm
mercytruth mercytruth is offline
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Default Re: Is the Millenium Literal?

Quote:
Originally Posted by cdaters View Post
The key concepts I believe are addressed under the, "Where the Church Stands" part of the document I referred to earlier,



There is more contained in the Catholic Encyclopedia under:

Millennium and Millenarianism
Thank you for the reference. The reference is thorough. Bishop Papias, who says he received these revelations orally from the disciples of the apostles. Yes, St. Irenaeus, St. Justin Martyr, Lactantius and Hippolytus all speak of the millennium in their writings.

Where I would take issue with the reference is to think of this idea as strictly an out growth of Jewish apocalyptic mysticism. If one were to read the writings of these aforesaid individuals, one would see that they quote extensively from Isaiah and not from Enoch.
Many speak of the restoration of creation during this time to the pristine condition that the creation of this earth was in before the fall. In fact Ireaneaus quotes Rom.8:22 in this regard.

I think it is imprudent to dismiss so many of the early church fathers in this way.
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