Your side on masturbation

[itullian]

Originally Posted by Irishgal49

That is horrible. And the sad thing is you believe it too. It isn't that we don't love God enough is that we are weak and we screw up. I have this addiction and I also have 2 mental illness diagnoses and I can't find ANYONE to give me direction on this. They all bail with that famous phrase, "Well you have to search your soul and decide for yourself." Ok then, I'm taking communion. I cannot believe that when someone is suffering with the massive shame, horrible feelings of guilt, thoughts of suicide/depression, desperation, anxiety, feelings of being a total failure that you would kick them and say, "too bad you don't love God enough"

I have to go barf now.

these people are alien to empathy and compassion.
please relax your soul Irishgal.

[itullian]

even the CCC has mitigating circumstances with regards to age, mental or physical state, loneliness, etc.

so relax.

[bobballen_18]

Originally Posted by Irishgal49

I wonder how many people who are posting are married, I also wonder how many followed all these high and moral roads when they were dating and I wonder if the advice would come on so strong if they were single. I am not saying it's not wrong, just some of the attitude makes me wonder. It's so easy to tell people to totally abstain when you don't have to.

Well, I'm single, and I'm adding my answer to the "totally abstain" group. Even though I have not completely mastered myself with this issue either.

2) we have wet dreams so we are still spilling the "seed" and wet dreams is still masturbating in our sleep

As others have posted, first of all, we do not consent to it when we're sleeping, and plus, it's not necessarily masturbating anyway - I don't know about you, but it seems whenever I have them, most of the time I wake up and my hands aren't anywhere near my pants. Odd, huh.

As I like to say, prayer is always the answer for help in overcoming sins such as these.

[bobballen_18]

I'm not going to question the Church's teaching on this, but I have to question the way it is handled. I don't think I'm going out on a limb when saying that if masturbation is a mortal sin, then it is by far the most commonly committed one--at least for men.

I have been active in the church since I was born and did not find out that it was considered a sin until I was 35 and first came to this forum. What the heck? If it is that serious, why isn't it talked about in Mass when it is the one sin that everyone is probably committing more than any of the others?

If you are trying to reduce the net amount of sin in the world, the most effective means would be to speak out against masturbation and nothing but masturbation. But as it is, it is never mentioned.

Interesting thought. It's probably kind of the same reason sex is barely even talked about. That's what my experience is, anyway. I'm pretty sure my parents hardly ever mentioned sex to me in my puberty years, and I'm pretty sure I only remember hearing my parish priest mention it once. I had recently learned about it at the time and it was one of those "oh my gosh, he said 'sex'" moments.

That's probably the biggest reason it's not talked about very much. I guess in my case, my parents set a good enough example that I instinctively knew and absorbed the Church's teachings on sex. But I think that looking back on things, I kind of wish 1) it would not have been introduced to me the way it was 2) and I wish that maybe my parents would have mentioned things about sex and masturbation...although perhaps 4th grade is a little bit too early. Or is it? I don't know. 4th grade is when my brother (who was in 8th grade) told me about sex and taught me about masturbation. I didn't know it was a grave sin (although of course due to my good Catholic upbringing I kinda knew something was funny...) until at least a couple years later, but by then, puberty had begun to transform me, I had just begun school in public schools, and I had already been masturbating for two years, so the chances of me stopping were pretty much zero.

I guess my point is, you have a good point for discussion in how it's taught. Perhaps the Church doesn't need to address it publicly, but given their teachings on it, perhaps a possible solution is that parents need to educate their children better on it. I have many a time looked back and wondered how much my sexual development could have been different if my parents had taught me about sex/masturbation in the correct light early enough. Of course, it would have helped if my brother didn't introduce me to it as something to enjoy. And no, I'm not blaming him for anything, but you probably know what I mean.

[underacloud]

Originally Posted by Irishgal49

That is horrible. And the sad thing is you believe it too. It isn't that we don't love God enough is that we are weak and we screw up. I have this addiction and I also have 2 mental illness diagnoses and I can't find ANYONE to give me direction on this.

The appropriate person to give you direction (morally, spiritually) is a trustworthy spiritual director. Not internet strangers who don't know you any more deeply than to see that you have a picture of JPII as your avatar, identify as a daily mass goer, and quote the wonderful poet St John of the Cross in your signature. As a tangent, St John of the Cross was widely considered to be an amazing spiritual director!

A good spiritual director will talk through your ongoing struggles, and is the appropriate person to discuss issues of mortal sin and whether or not to abstain from the Eucharist (when certain sins are yet to be confessed).

I'm sorry if you feel that some of the responses seem harsh. It probably comes down to the difference between discussing such matters in the abstract sense (eg that masturbation is an objective mortal sin) vs specific cases (each individual struggling with this). Sometimes these lines can seem a little blurred.

[Pfaffenhoffen]

Originally Posted by itullian

the most ridiculous thing i ever heard.

Peter loved Christ so much but denied Him 3 times....and he was the first Pope...so I do not think it is ridiculous...Flesh is Weak...

[Pfaffenhoffen]

Originally Posted by bobballen_18

Interesting thought. It's probably kind of the same reason sex is barely even talked about. That's what my experience is, anyway. I'm pretty sure my parents hardly ever mentioned sex to me in my puberty years, and I'm pretty sure I only remember hearing my parish priest mention it once. I had recently learned about it at the time and it was one of those "oh my gosh, he said 'sex'" moments.

That's probably the biggest reason it's not talked about very much. I guess in my case, my parents set a good enough example that I instinctively knew and absorbed the Church's teachings on sex. But I think that looking back on things, I kind of wish 1) it would not have been introduced to me the way it was 2) and I wish that maybe my parents would have mentioned things about sex and masturbation...although perhaps 4th grade is a little bit too early. Or is it? I don't know. 4th grade is when my brother (who was in 8th grade) told me about sex and taught me about masturbation. I didn't know it was a grave sin (although of course due to my good Catholic upbringing I kinda knew something was funny...) until at least a couple years later, but by then, puberty had begun to transform me, I had just begun school in public schools, and I had already been masturbating for two years, so the chances of me stopping were pretty much zero.

I guess my point is, you have a good point for discussion in how it's taught. Perhaps the Church doesn't need to address it publicly, but given their teachings on it, perhaps a possible solution is that parents need to educate their children better on it. I have many a time looked back and wondered how much my sexual development could have been different if my parents had taught me about sex/masturbation in the correct light early enough. Of course, it would have helped if my brother didn't introduce me to it as something to enjoy. And no, I'm not blaming him for anything, but you probably know what I mean.

What if...?

What if...?

What if...?

That leads us nowhere. Maybe you received a beautiful education. It happened that way it could be worse!
This commandement is not the first...northe second...!!!

[bobballen_18]

Originally Posted by Pfaffenhoffen

What if...?

What if...?

What if...?

That leads us nowhere. Maybe you received a beautiful education. It happened that way it could be worse!
This commandement is not the first...northe second...!!!

I think I would know whether my sex education was "beautiful" or not. And in case you didn't catch it, I was saying that my introduction to sex was not beautiful.

That leads us nowhere? So you're saying that if we find a problem with something, we should just leave it the way it is? It's not like I'm advocating anything that is against Church teachings. In fact, it's quite the opposite - suggesting that parents should educate their children appropriately about sex would be making sure their children understand, appreciate, and are aware of the Church's teaching.

Actually, I really don't KNOW if parents should do that, because then you have to bring in factors like, when to do it, and how to do it, and I know I wouldn't be sure on those issues. But 1) I don't have to deal with that, and if I ever do it won't be for a long time down the road, and 2) I was just expressing an idea.

And I guess you just expressed your opinion too, so, whatever; thank you for your opinion.

[Pfaffenhoffen]

Originally Posted by bobballen_18

I think I would know whether my sex education was "beautiful" or not. And in case you didn't catch it, I was saying that my introduction to sex was not beautiful.

That leads us nowhere? So you're saying that if we find a problem with something, we should just leave it the way it is? It's not like I'm advocating anything that is against Church teachings. In fact, it's quite the opposite - suggesting that parents should educate their children appropriately about sex would be making sure their children understand, appreciate, and are aware of the Church's teaching.

Actually, I really don't KNOW if parents should do that, because then you have to bring in factors like, when to do it, and how to do it, and I know I wouldn't be sure on those issues. But 1) I don't have to deal with that, and if I ever do it won't be for a long time down the road, and 2) I was just expressing an idea.

And I guess you just expressed your opinion too, so, whatever; thank you for your opinion.

I am an educator. Tell you: it is very, very difficult to deliver sex education. As a father, I think the same. I avoided doing it with my children (boys) and it was their mother who did the job. I guess that if I had a girls it would be easier for me.

Now, I was trying to be optimistic. Looking around and seeing that there are thousands of women who had their clitoris removed and other bizarre phenomena, well, I said that you may look at your education with not bad eyes.

There were mistakes. Tell you, put a poll here and ask whether the members' sexual education was perfect and I am curious to see the results.

As you said, that's just my opinion....

[xSteven]

Originally Posted by bobballen_18

Well, I'm single, and I'm adding my answer to the "totally abstain" group. Even though I have not completely mastered myself with this issue either.



As others have posted, first of all, we do not consent to it when we're sleeping, and plus, it's not necessarily masturbating anyway - I don't know about you, but it seems whenever I have them, most of the time I wake up and my hands aren't anywhere near my pants. Odd, huh.

As I like to say, prayer is always the answer for help in overcoming sins such as these.

Normally when I have one, i find myself sinning a lot more, than i would normally masturbating. I havent masturbated in 2 years which is pretty good but i'm still so confused.

[shipwrkd]

I realize this is an old thread but it's relevant. Is there an accepted way of giving a sperm sample? I understand there are special condoms made for the purpose and a Catholic married man can poke holes to satisfy the Church's stand but what if a man is single??

[underacloud]

Originally Posted by shipwrkd

I realize this is an old thread but it's relevant. Is there an accepted way of giving a sperm sample? I understand there are special condoms made for the purpose and a Catholic married man can poke holes to satisfy the Church's stand but what if a man is single??

Why would a single man possibly need to give a sperm sample? A single man need not worry about fertility issues.

[shipwrkd]

Originally Posted by underacloud

Why would a single man possibly need to give a sperm sample? A single man need not worry about fertility issues.

Perhaps at the request of his Oncologist?

[underacloud]

Originally Posted by shipwrkd

Perhaps at the request of his Oncologist?

Interesting. I've not heard of that as a test for testicular cancer, but I suppose it may be.

Unfortunately, for the single Catholic male, it is not considered a moral option...while the object is good, the means are intrinsicly evil...thus, a biopsy would be required (which is unfortunately painful, I believe ).

[shipwrkd]

Yup, it is. Gonna leave, think all has been said and I'd rather not dig up an old thread.