Your side on masturbation

[sw85]

Originally Posted by xSteven

Alright but i'm a teenager. I have high testosterone levels and I get excited easily and stay excited for awhile and while that i lust and stuff. The only way to get rid of the testosterone level is ejaculating. I can't do that only if i sleep and if it happens that night. It doesnt every day.

Also I understand that you should be using your parts with another person in marriage, but some people dont masturbate for pleasure or stuff like that. It's more like a stress releaser. No lusting involved just a time to get away.

I still see no sin it.

I understand it's difficult. Trust me, I do. I was one of those 7-10 times a week people at my worst. I quit cold turkey the day I was baptized and confirmed and haven't lapsed since. The Holy Spirit rocks that hard.

It's very difficult, yes. But Christianity doesn't owe you an easy life. In fact, that's pretty far down our list of concerns. This is an entire religion based around excruciating personal suffering for the sake of something other than ourselves. "If any man will come after me, let him deny himself, and take up his cross, and follow me." So pick up your cross and let's go.

You will find, once you quit, that your body stops rebelling fairly quickly. It is addicted to the rush of chemicals it experiences every time you masturbate. When you stop, there will be a detox period and then you will be in the clear. You will have to fight the temptation after that but it will not be a wild, delirious struggle. It will be a battle you fight quietly and on the inside day after day. The rosary is your friend here. St. Michael is your friend. Regular recourse to confession is your friend here. So is the Liturgy of the Hours and the precious blood and adoration and communion and Scriptures and etc. etc. etc. The Church has furnished all manners of shields and weapons and armor and squires and warhorses to help you in this battle. If you cannot win it, it is only weakness on your part, spurred on by constant internal rationalization, that keeps you from victory. Does God have any use for those who can't be bothered to fight themselves for Him? I don't know, but I wouldn't want to risk my soul to find out.

As far as seeing sin in it, I would not expect someone in the grips of sin to see their behavior as sinful. This is what sin is, and what it does. It blinds you, darkens the intellect. You are fortunate then that you do not have to rely on your own impaired judgment on this. You can rely on the collected wisdom of the Church -- on a tradition of received wisdom that goes back even before the time of Christ, a long line of holy men and women, martyrs, theologians, doctors of the Church, who consecrated their lives to contemplation and prayer, who wrote books and books on moral theology, some of whom died for the faith, at least one of whom (Aquinas) was rewarded for his laborers with a miraculous vision of God Himself. They all saw it as an abominable sin. Do you think you're smarter or holier than them? If not (and you probably shouldn't), you should trust their judgment here, and turn back from your course.

[austenbosten]

Originally Posted by sw85

I understand it's difficult. Trust me, I do. I was one of those 7-10 times a week people at my worst. I quit cold turkey the day I was baptized and confirmed and haven't lapsed since. The Holy Spirit rocks that hard.

It's very difficult, yes. But Christianity doesn't owe you an easy life. In fact, that's pretty far down our list of concerns. This is an entire religion based around excruciating personal suffering for the sake of something other than ourselves. "If any man will come after me, let him deny himself, and take up his cross, and follow me." So pick up your cross and let's go.

You will find, once you quit, that your body stops rebelling fairly quickly. It is addicted to the rush of chemicals it experiences every time you masturbate. When you stop, there will be a detox period and then you will be in the clear. You will have to fight the temptation after that but it will not be a wild, delirious struggle. It will be a battle you fight quietly and on the inside day after day. The rosary is your friend here. St. Michael is your friend. Regular recourse to confession is your friend here. So is the Liturgy of the Hours and the precious blood and adoration and communion and Scriptures and etc. etc. etc. The Church has furnished all manners of shields and weapons and armor and squires and warhorses to help you in this battle. If you cannot win it, it is only weakness on your part, spurred on by constant internal rationalization, that keeps you from victory. Does God have any use for those who can't be bothered to fight themselves for Him? I don't know, but I wouldn't want to risk my soul to find out.

As far as seeing sin in it, I would not expect someone in the grips of sin to see their behavior as sinful. This is what sin is, and what it does. It blinds you, darkens the intellect. You are fortunate then that you do not have to rely on your own impaired judgment on this. You can rely on the collected wisdom of the Church -- on a tradition of received wisdom that goes back even before the time of Christ, a long line of holy men and women, martyrs, theologians, doctors of the Church, who consecrated their lives to contemplation and prayer, who wrote books and books on moral theology, some of whom died for the faith, at least one of whom (Aquinas) was rewarded for his laborers with a miraculous vision of God Himself. They all saw it as an abominable sin. Do you think you're smarter or holier than them? If not (and you probably shouldn't), you should trust their judgment here, and turn back from your course.

I found that the first three days are the hardest, after that it get's a lot easier. However I'm one of those that gave up after 3 weeks, but like I said it was because I was tired of dealing with the other problems I was experiencing...but I'm not saying the problems I have are normal...in fact what I'm reading I fall on the abnormal side...so I encourage everyone to try and at least go a week of abstaining......I know this is the equivalent of the drunkard at the end of the bar saying "Don't end up like me.." well....that's what I'm saying. To those saying they can't...I'm sure you can go a whole day...I'm sure you can go 3 days....I'm sure you can go a whole week, just give it a try.

[Elizabeth502]

sw, thank you for your beautiful, inspiring, and realistic post #91.

[just came back]

I go through cycles. I am in counseling for this along with repressed religious issues stemming from a pentecostal upbringing. I abstained for 8 days 3 weeks ago, slipped to 5 times the next week, 3 times last week with the final time being a week ago today. So...I am now at 7 days of abstinence and trying to persist.

What boggles my mind is the difference of mortal/venial amongst the priesthood as it pertains to this act. I've heard both from priests before and it gets confusing. Peace.

[Irishgal49]

Originally Posted by Corki

Personal beliefs regarding issues of morality are not just based on what we "think" something is or should be but rather on what the Church teaches and why.

From the Catechism:



So it's wrong, definately. But whether it's a mortal sin is something you need to discuss with your priest in Confession.

Also, if you feel this is an addiction (as noted in your #4) , you need to get help to overcome it.

Actually a priest of 35 years gave me the scoop on this and for a great number of years it was not considered a sin for a woman...only for a man because of spilling seed. In fact the term "grave matter" was not interpreted the same way. I wish I could quote what he said because he really went through this for over an hour---needless to say, it's certainly not "encouraged" but he told me to make an act of contrition and attend confession once a month and not to worry, God would not send me to hell for it. So....that's the edict of a long-standing and greatly respected priest. I just wish I could have stated all that he said because he's a Catholic history expert on law and the history of contraception/sex/masturbation and other family/sexual matters.

[Irishgal49]

Originally Posted by underacloud

The appropriate person to give you direction (morally, spiritually) is a trustworthy spiritual director. Not internet strangers who don't know you any more deeply than to see that you have a picture of JPII as your avatar, identify as a daily mass goer, and quote the wonderful poet St John of the Cross in your signature. As a tangent, St John of the Cross was widely considered to be an amazing spiritual director!

A good spiritual director will talk through your ongoing struggles, and is the appropriate person to discuss issues of mortal sin and whether or not to abstain from the Eucharist (when certain sins are yet to be confessed).

I'm sorry if you feel that some of the responses seem harsh. It probably comes down to the difference between discussing such matters in the abstract sense (eg that masturbation is an objective mortal sin) vs specific cases (each individual struggling with this). Sometimes these lines can seem a little blurred.

Thanks for that, you gave a compassionate response. I did go see a priest and he had a totally different take than I've been hearing, but like you said, a spiritual director can better assess your mental status, situation, and such. Thanks for your kindness.

[Irishgal49]

Originally Posted by ebonykawai

I agree. Why would a loving God create people exactly the way he wanted them, and then spend the rest of life on earth punishing them for how he created them?? Doesn't fit with my world view anymore.

Toddlers masturbate. It's a normal, human thing. We were created as sexual beings. Should you become obsessed with it? No, you shouldn't become obsessed with anything. Does it mean you don't love God if you do it? I don't even know where this idea came from, it's ludicrous.

I agree.

[Irishgal49]

Originally Posted by just came back

I go through cycles. I am in counseling for this along with repressed religious issues stemming from a pentecostal upbringing. I abstained for 8 days 3 weeks ago, slipped to 5 times the next week, 3 times last week with the final time being a week ago today. So...I am now at 7 days of abstinence and trying to persist.

What boggles my mind is the difference of mortal/venial amongst the priesthood as it pertains to this act. I've heard both from priests before and it gets confusing. Peace.

3 Catholics 5 opinions
3 priests 7 opinions

[Irishgal49]

Originally Posted by Catholic80

You might want to read Fr. Groeschel's book, "The Courage to be Chaste."

It's very good and it covers a lot of what you mention... wet dreams, lustful thoughts, and such. Fr. Groeschel makes a clear distinction between involuntary moments (such as during sleep) and auto eroticism (what we commonly refer to as masturbating).


It sounds like you are trying to justify masturbating because it is such a strong addiction. Yes, masturbation is a sin and a highly disordered sin at that. It's a common problem, but that doesn't make it any less grave.

I am tired of the post here. I am positive that 99% of the people on here are married and probably run and have sex after reading this. I find absolutely no help in hearing married people tell those of us who are single (and I'm newly single) what sinners we are. I'm glad my priest doesn't confer. I never had this problem married so I'm going to keep following what my priest said and his history of this whole belief in the Church is fascinating and I'm feeling a LOT better.

[nickybr38]

To respond to the OP:

What I think is immaterial. I submit myself to the authority of the Church. If the Church says it's harmful and even sinful and I abide by that it hurts NO ONE. So I will abide by it. As should you.

When/if the Church changes it's position then... er.. knock yourself out. Until then you'd do well to trust the authority that Christ has left in place to guide us.

PS: The idea that NOT masturbating causes MORE lustful thoughts is RIDICULOUS. I routinely committed this sin prior to converting to the Catholic Church. I can tell you that I had WAY more lustful thoughts back when I did it then now. In the two years since I quit I have lustful thoughts maybe ONCE a month and they are easily combated with prayer.

[just came back]

Originally Posted by Irishgal49

I am tired of the post here. I am positive that 99% of the people on here are married and probably run and have sex after reading this. I find absolutely no help in hearing married people tell those of us who are single (and I'm newly single) what sinners we are. I'm glad my priest doesn't confer. I never had this problem married so I'm going to keep following what my priest said and his history of this whole belief in the Church is fascinating and I'm feeling a LOT better.

Amen! It's easy for those who have OUTLETS. That being said I am at 8 days and counting abstinence. I hope God sends me a good Catholic wife someday. It's good to know that not only men struggle with this. Peace.

[CopticChristian]

Originally Posted by ebonykawai

I agree. Why would a loving God create people exactly the way he wanted them, and then spend the rest of life on earth punishing them for how he created them?? Doesn't fit with my world view anymore.

Toddlers masturbate. It's a normal, human thing. We were created as sexual beings. Should you become obsessed with it? No, you shouldn't become obsessed with anything. Does it mean you don't love God if you do it? I don't even know where this idea came from, it's ludicrous.

Toddlers soil their pants, spit up, put everything in their mouth and choke to death if not watched. Soon we all grow up.

[CopticChristian]

Originally Posted by xSteven

What's your side on it? I personally believe it is not a sin for many reasons.

1) When we don't masturbate, we get more lustful thoughts in our heads making us sin more, and think/do/say bad things.

2) we have wet dreams so we are still spilling the "seed" and wet dreams is still masturbating in our sleep

3) Some people don't masturbate for pleasure all the time. It can be used to get rid of stress, and our lustful thoughts. I remember I just coulden't focus on anything, all i could think of was lusful thoughts and I would tell myself "STOP! This is not what God wants!" I just couldent focus to pray to him, or get these thoughts out of my head. How else would I get them out?

4) If you shoot someone, the gun isn't the sinful part. So masturbation is the gun, and lust, addiction are the killing things. I just believe in that.

P.S. I am a Roman Catholic and I am sitll confused on wether masturbation is a sin or not. I do go to church every sunday and pray daily.

Thanks! Bless you all!

Steven,

You identified yourself as an 8th grader about to be confirmed. I suggest you speak to your priest at your Church about these issues and read the Catechism for teens cover to cover and in particular the areas you have questions about. Your concern for issues is a start in the right direction. Continue to ask and you will in time find answers.

[PumpkinSeed]

If you were to masturbate without having lustful thoughts, you probably wouldn't be excited.

Perhaps I'm wrong, but as far as im concerned you need to be turned on by something in order to masturbate correctly otherwise you'd be dry (if youre a girl) and limp (if you're a guy).

Right?

[xSteven]

Sorry for bringing this back up, but I'd like to just ask another question.
If Catholics and Christians both believe in Christ, why do Christians believe masturbation is normal, and Catholics thinks it's bad? What happened to the concept of the Church is God's word also?

Thank you~