'Sexuality, like priesthood, is a gift from God. Nobody would choose to be gay'

[ivebeenshown]

Originally Posted by Publisher

I'm amazed that people actually think their sexuality can be turned "on" and "off" or "switched" at the drop of a hat....but the fairy tale is needed to justify "it's a choice".

Oh strawman, if only you had a brain!

...who exactly is saying that it sexual preference can be changed at 'the drop of a hat'? Conditioning doesn't happen overnight. I believe that my preference was conditioned because of actions I chose to perform.

[ivebeenshown]

Originally Posted by ringil

Oh come on!!

One doesn't "opt" for sexual preference! It just "is". I certainly couldn't "opt" to be a homosexual because I, personally find even thinking of homosexual activity as kind of. . . . well. . . unappealing.

Some people find vodka 'unappealing' but then they choose to try it, and maybe they aren't crazy about it at first, but they develop a taste and desire for it. It may happen quickly or it may happen slowly, but it doesn't necessarily happen right away.

But hey, you know... just as there are lots of heterosexuals that would try to convince a homosexual to just try having heterosexual intercourse, I am sure there are many homosexuals that convince other people to 'open their minds' and 'just try' homosexual intercourse. Actually, I know there are. I did that.

[ringil]

Originally Posted by ivebeenshown

Some people find vodka 'unappealing' but then they choose to try it, and maybe they aren't crazy about it at first, but they develop a taste and desire for it. It may happen quickly or it may happen slowly, but it doesn't necessarily happen right away.

But hey, you know... just as there are lots of heterosexuals that would try to convince a homosexual to just try having heterosexual intercourse, I am sure there are many homosexuals that convince other people to 'open their minds' and 'just try' homosexual intercourse. Actually, I know there are. I did that.

Sex isn't Vodka. Those that feel that sexuality can be chosen must not be very solid in their own preferences and I say this a a licensed therapist. Sexual preference is deeply held in the bio-pschological realm.

At my local YMCA I've had far too many "come on's" from gay men so, yeah, some can be pushy but you know what- I've never been tempted even to the tiniest possible degree.

It's ridiculous, absolutely ridiculous! It's not a choice- even remotely so! There is a period in late childhood and adolescence when many kids experiment but only the homosexual will continue this behavior.

[sedonaman]

Originally Posted by ringil

Sex isn't Vodka. ...

That depends on what the definition of "is" is. Look. My comment was poorly written, I will agree; but my point is you don't have to be a homosexual to engage in homosexual acts, and children who are normal will probably feel there is something wrong with them if they perceive that most people [esp. their peers] are homosexual.
_________________
What started as a demand for basic civil rights has mutated into a liberal demand to overturn the whole society, along with its traditions and norms, its standards and laws, its history and heroes.

[ivebeenshown]

Originally Posted by ringil

Sex isn't Vodka.

A is A is not B, and all analogies are invalid. Right?

Those that feel that sexuality can be chosen must not be very solid in their own preferences and I say this a a licensed therapist. Sexual preference is deeply held in the bio-pschological realm.

Licensed by who, who taught you, did they have a particular agenda?

At my local YMCA I've had far too many "come on's" from gay men so, yeah, some can be pushy but you know what- I've never been tempted even to the tiniest possible degree.

My grandmother has never drank liquor.

It's ridiculous, absolutely ridiculous! It's not a choice- even remotely so! There is a period in late childhood and adolescence when many kids experiment but only the homosexual will continue this behavior.

Oh, that's right, that's right... only those who keep it up are 'true' homosexuals, anyone who thinks they can change are really 'bisexual'... not 'true' homosexuals.

And with all that I'm asked to believe that attractions to people of certain age groups, skin colors, body types, or animals or inanimate objects are just 'attractions'. Somehow gender is the only fixed thing. Right...

[ringil]

Originally Posted by ivebeenshown

A is A is not B, and all analogies are invalid. Right?

Licensed by who, who taught you, did they have a particular agenda?

I am licensed as a Clinical Social Worker whose agenda is to provide an accounting for quality, research-based pracitioners which are re-embursable by health insurance providers to give individual, family, and group interventions. .

My grandmother has never drank liquor.

Oh, that's right, that's right... only those who keep it up are 'true' homosexuals, anyone who thinks they can change are really 'bisexual'... not 'true' homosexuals.

And with all that I'm asked to believe that attractions to people of certain age groups, skin colors, body types, or animals or inanimate objects are just 'attractions'. Somehow gender is the only fixed thing. Right...[/quote]

There is some evidence that pedophilia, for example, may be deeply psychologically seated in some individuals.

Countless empirical studies have provided much insight into the development and nature of homosexuality. On the other side of the coin, research has indicated that deeply seated homosexuality cannot be "switched" to a heterosexual persuation.

No mainstream licensing body endorses "reparative" therapies and it is un-ethical to engage in such endeavors as a member of any licensing body. No insurance provider will cover efforts to change sexual preference as these efforts have been shown to be ineffective at best, and psychologically destructive, at worse.

It should be noted that Psychiatrists, Psychologists, Counselors, Marriage and Family Therapists, Licensed Addiction Counselors, and Social Workers lie all along the continuum of Conservative to Liberal politically and socially, yet NO licensed professional could ethically parctice efforts to change sexual orientation.

Such practices are carried out by tiny fringe groups and all of there efforts must be funded out-of-pocket by those desiring such poppycock.

[Jeffrey]

The word I would use is... disgusting.

Originally Posted by ringil

Oh come on!!

One doesn't "opt" for sexual preference! It just "is". I certainly couldn't "opt" to be a homosexual because I, personally find even thinking of homosexual activity as kind of. . . . well. . . unappealing.

[The Rock]

Originally Posted by ringil

I am licensed as a Clinical Social Worker whose agenda is to provide an accounting for quality, research-based pracitioners which are re-embursable by health insurance providers to give individual, family, and group interventions. .

Countless empirical studies have provided much insight into the development and nature of homosexuality. On the other side of the coin, research has indicated that deeply seated homosexuality cannot be "switched" to a heterosexual persuation.

No mainstream licensing body endorses "reparative" therapies and it is un-ethical to engage in such endeavors as a member of any licensing body. No insurance provider will cover efforts to change sexual preference as these efforts have been shown to be ineffective at best, and psychologically destructive, at worse.

It should be noted that Psychiatrists, Psychologists, Counselors, Marriage and Family Therapists, Licensed Addiction Counselors, and Social Workers lie all along the continuum of Conservative to Liberal politically and socially, yet NO licensed professional could ethically parctice efforts to change sexual orientation.

Such practices are carried out by tiny fringe groups and all of there efforts must be funded out-of-pocket by those desiring such poppycock.

Fr Groeschel would completely disagree. He earned a doctorate in psychology (Ed.D.) from Columbia University in 1971. And your portrayal of those who disagree with your position as "fringe" and un-ethical is ridiculous and uncharitable.

http://insightscoop.typepad.com/2004...sociation.html

Fr. Benedict Groeschel blasts American Psychological Association

From the September 6-12, 2009, issue of National Catholic Register:
As a member of the American Psychological Association for 36 years, I am filled with indignation at the recent statement of the APA that deems it “inappropriate” for therapists to treat homosexual clients.
Such therapy is called reparative therapy and has as its goal the establishment of a heterosexual orientation in place of a homosexual one.
This statement of the APA has been issued despite the fact that there are a number of outstanding members of that organization, including two past presidents, who have strongly supported reparative treatment.
Issued in August, “Appropriate Therapeutic Responses to Sexual Orientation” advises treatments that “increase family and school support and reduce rejection of sexual minority youth.”
The report also states: “Some difficulties arise because the professional psychological community considers same-sex sexual attractions and behaviors to be a positive variant of human sexuality, while some traditional faiths continue to consider it a sin, moral failing, or disorder that needs to be changed. … We believe that licensed mental-health providers are more likely to maximize their clients’ self-determination by providing effective psychotherapy that increases a client’s abilities to cope, understand, acknowledge, explore and integrate sexual-orientation concerns into a self-chosen life in which the client determines the ultimate manner in which he or she does or does not express sexual orientation.”
Unfortunately, a statement like this issued by an organization like the APA automatically takes on a certain amount of authority. In this case, however, that claim is fraudulent.

[The Rock]

http://www.ncregister.com/site/artic...l_association/

Above is the link to Father Benedict Groeschel's statement

Nevertheless, this APA committee has grabbed many headlines and, in the process, probably damaged many people who have struggled to overcome same-sex attachment through psychotherapy. At least some of them have likely given up on treatment that may have been greatly helping them.

[Dakota Roberts]

Originally Posted by JimG

Well yes, I've heard that before, but I'm never quite sure what people mean by it. Are they talking about sexual attraction? At what age? It was uncommon in my youth for kids in elementary school to speak of having boyfriends or girlfriends, and when they did, it was more of a social idea rather than a sexual idea, but mostly we didn't think about it all. Now kids have been increasingly sexualized even before they know what it means, and so it's more common to talk like that. And with schools providing sex education at earlier and earlier ages, there is a dangerous trend of denying children their innocence and sexual latency period.

Now it's almost as though we wish to force a decision on them in pre-school. So, what's your sexual preference? Huh? Before puberty, does a child really know that his or her preference is for a particular kind of sexual activity? And if he does, is it because he's already been given too much information about sex, and the culture has told him that he must choose?

Males since they are quite visual can tell what they find "visually appealing" before they don't know what sex is.

[sedonaman]

Originally Posted by The Rock

... And your portrayal of those who disagree with your position as "fringe" and un-ethical is ridiculous and uncharitable.

"Homosexuality is not about sex."

Dr. Joseph Nicolosi - November 2008 - Denver, CO

Part 1 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VjQT4QXBpEQ
Part 2 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VUhtt...endscreen&NR=1
Part 3 http://www.youtube.com/watch?NR=1&fe...&v=Tm43ow64YG4

[sedonaman]

Originally Posted by poorsinner7

This is an excellent link. I watched the first one and forwarded it to my pastor, who is chaplain of a "Courage" group.

If you are referring to my post, glad to have been some help.

[vsedriver]

Originally Posted by pepipop

the blessings of being in a family as opposed to life long celibacy and potential loneliness.

why do people act like life long celibacy is a fate worse than death? And what makes people think that if they don't marry they will suffer from loneliness? I am living a celibate life, I have friends, and family. My life is not awful just because I am following Church teaching.

[fix]

Originally Posted by ringil

There is some evidence that pedophilia, for example, may be deeply psychologically seated in some individuals.

Countless empirical studies have provided much insight into the development and nature of homosexuality. On the other side of the coin, research has indicated that deeply seated homosexuality cannot be "switched" to a heterosexual persuation.

No mainstream licensing body endorses "reparative" therapies and it is un-ethical to engage in such endeavors as a member of any licensing body. No insurance provider will cover efforts to change sexual preference as these efforts have been shown to be ineffective at best, and psychologically destructive, at worse.

It should be noted that Psychiatrists, Psychologists, Counselors, Marriage and Family Therapists, Licensed Addiction Counselors, and Social Workers lie all along the continuum of Conservative to Liberal politically and socially, yet NO licensed professional could ethically parctice efforts to change sexual orientation.

Such practices are carried out by tiny fringe groups and all of there efforts must be funded out-of-pocket by those desiring such poppycock.

The same groups that endorse homosexuality as normal and healthy? How many of those groups endorse "gay" marriage? How many endorse abortion as therapeutic?

[ringil]

Originally Posted by fix

The same groups that endorse homosexuality as normal and healthy? How many of those groups endorse "gay" marriage? How many endorse abortion as therapeutic?

Licensing bodies aren't conserned with the issues you list.

"Reparative Therapy" is not a recognized therapy by the official professional licensing bodies of the various mental health disciplines. A clinician knowing that another is engaging in such activity is ethically bound to inform the appropriate licensing body. Those advocating this approach are indeed in the far fringe of the mental health field.

Health insurance will not cover efforts to change sexual orientation.

These questions of the development and nature of sexual orientation lie outside of the questions of the moral licitness of engaging in homosexual acts. Attempts by the therapist to press their personal religious convictions onto a client would be grossly unethical. On the other hand, a therapist cannot be forced to violate their religious convictions in work with a client. If the clinician is conserned that their personal religious or ethical standards may be compromized they must refer the client to another therapist who may be able to help them.