Tax cuts for the wealthy

[oneofmany]

Originally Posted by Ben F

There should be no tax breaks for anyone, poor or rich. The flat tax rate with no exemption is the way I would go. How about everybody pay ten percent. You make ten bucks, then one buck goes to Uncle Sam. God bless

Some people are so poor they cannot even spare that 1 dollar. Really poor people should not pay taxes and they need to be taken care of but we now have half of our society on some kind of government program. From social security, medicare to welfare.

Plus the government can't seem to stop spending on any program that comes along. Too much waste in government that is more evil than what any rich person can do. Our government has become the monster that is bleeding our poor and our country to death. That needs to stop. I hope our next election will help get the dead wood out of there.

[nightranger]

Originally Posted by yellow8yellowM

is it not obvious to everybody (even liberals) why tax cuts to the wealthy could be good Christian policies, even if you disagree with them?

Lol... Are you serious? Liberals are experts at taking money from "wealthy" people and spending it on things like abortion, welfare, government forced healthcare etc. That's what makes liberals feel good. Spending other folks money.

[TarkanAttila]

There has been questioning about what good it does for the economy to cut the taxes for the rich. There has also been questioning about what good it does to tax small business owners - who do make up the vast majority of the businesses on the market, and a fair portion of production and sales - to have their taxes raised.

May I make a suggestion? Get rid of the tax code. A flat tax income tax of 10% for everyone, rich and poor. For the exceptionally rich - the top 1% or so of the country - a 25% tax. Perhaps if a person doesn't make enough income to be reasonably taxed - say, less than $600 a year - don't bother taxing him. Nothing else, though.

How nice it would be to abolish the IRS, the tax code, and those stupid tax forms you have to fill out every year! (Actually, that alone is reason to induce a flat tax, never mind that it will equally milk the rich and the poor at the same time without discrimination.)

Originally Posted by Ben F

There should be no tax breaks for anyone, poor or rich. The flat tax rate with no exemption is the way I would go. How about everybody pay ten percent. You make ten bucks, then one buck goes to Uncle Sam. God bless

Agreed, Ben. Agreed.

[pnewton]

Originally Posted by yellow8yellowM

Mr. Blackburn did not take a position on this--he simply was not able to give an example, which is why I was perplexed.

I misread that. Then I will say that like him, I can see no Christian reason, no moral justification, for tax cuts for the wealthy. Unlike him, I am not going to make the illogical leap that there must be something even though I do no know it.

[pnewton]

Originally Posted by oneofmany

Some people are so poor they cannot even spare that 1 dollar. Really poor people should not pay taxes and they need to be taken care of but we now have half of our society on some kind of government program. From social security, medicare to welfare.

While I do not agree with you that some are so poor they should be exempt (even the widow put in her two cents), if there were people so poor that they paid nothing, then they should also not be allowed to vote. Representation without taxation is as much of a contradicion, and a recipe for disaster, as the reverse. Voting without any responsibility is voting irresponsibility.

I do not object to a progressive tax, but the bottom should never be zero, much less the tax credit situation we have. The United States will soon be as bankrupt as Greece because of this. Then the poor that will be our children and our grandchildren will be far worse off than the poor now if we were to show a modicum of financial responsibility. We are helping the poor today at the expense of devistating poverty later.

[TarkanAttila]

Originally Posted by pnewton

While I do not agree with you that some are so poor they should be exempt (even the widow put in her two cents), if there were people so poor that they paid nothing, then they should also not be allowed to vote. Representation without taxation is as much of a contradicion, and a recipe for disaster, as the reverse. Voting without any responsibility is voting irresponsibility.

Most people don't bother to vote, anyway (pity).

[nightranger]

Originally Posted by TarkanAttila

May I make a suggestion? Get rid of the tax code. A flat tax income tax of 10% for everyone, rich and poor. For the exceptionally rich - the top 1% or so of the country - a 25% tax. Nothing else.

How nice it would be to abolish the IRS, the tax code, and those stupid tax forms you have to fill out every year!



Agreed, Ben. Agreed.

You don't want to do that, believe me.
.
Even if you could wave a magic wand, elect all conservatives and abolish the tax code tomorrow, it would only stay abolished until liberals took over again.
Since it's a constitutional (16th) amendment, it would take a 2/3 majority of states to get rid of it. Not going to happen.
And when liberals did take power again, not only would you have a flat tax, but they would then resurrect the income tax as well.
Be careful what you wish for

[TheRealJuliane]

Originally Posted by TarkanAttila

There has been questioning about what good it does for the economy to cut the taxes for the rich. There has also been questioning about what good it does to tax small business owners - who do make up the vast majority of the businesses on the market, and a fair portion of production and sales - to have their taxes raised.

May I make a suggestion? Get rid of the tax code. A flat tax income tax of 10% for everyone, rich and poor. For the exceptionally rich - the top 1% or so of the country - a 25% tax. Perhaps if a person doesn't make enough income to be reasonably taxed - say, less than $600 a year - don't bother taxing him. Nothing else, though.

How nice it would be to abolish the IRS, the tax code, and those stupid tax forms you have to fill out every year! (Actually, that alone is reason to induce a flat tax, never mind that it will equally milk the rich and the poor at the same time without discrimination.)



Agreed, Ben. Agreed.

Why? Why should people who have made a lot of money, have to pay even more of that money just because they have been successful?

I really hate it that the attitude that something is evil about success has crept so thoroughly into this country's psyche that no one even questions it. Success including wealth, is to be PUNISHED instead of encouraged and rewarded. I thought the idea of making one's own wealth out of nothing was what this nation was FOUNDED UPON! Private property rights is woven all through our Constitution, yet the progressive income tax is the exact opposite. I wonder if that's the Puritan influence - that wealth is bad. On the contrary, personal success allows people to be more charitable and many successful people are VERY generous with their money, even after the government extorts them for a larger proportion of it, simply because they have made money.

I would do things the other way. Make it reverse progressive. Pay LESS taxes the more successful you are, and see how the economy suddenly starts to improve. You also have to do away with all the welfare programs, and let people get off their fat behinds and get back to WORK though.

The ant and the grasshopper story must be brought back into our country's ethical structure before any of that happens.

And this communistic attitude that every successful person is simply GREEDY must be eradicated!!!

[TheRealJuliane]

Originally Posted by yellow8yellowM

Could you clarify what you did not understand?

It was a joke. I don't think there are very many of what I would call conservatives in elected office yet, elections of 2010 notwithstanding. We've only started to replace some of our elected representatives and sometimes, the replacements are only marginally more conservative. Until more people wake up and recognize what progressives are doing to this nation, it's going to be a very long slog for true conservatives. You can see it in the Presidential nomination process. Mitt Romney is a huge improvement over Barack Obama, yet he is still very much an "establishment" Republican, so we need a conservative Congress to keep him in line. That's where the true change in power lies - all the Congressional races where at least some conservatives are in races against progressives and their shadows in the GOP.

But I am not sure we have enough time until the whole thing crashes.

[Jeanne S]

Originally Posted by TheRealJuliane

Why? Why should people who have made a lot of money, have to pay even more of that money just because they have been successful?

I really hate it that the attitude that something is evil about success has crept so thoroughly into this country's psyche that no one even questions it. Success including wealth, is to be PUNISHED instead of encouraged and rewarded. I thought the idea of making one's own wealth out of nothing was what this nation was FOUNDED UPON! Private property rights is woven all through our Constitution, yet the progressive income tax is the exact opposite. I wonder if that's the Puritan influence - that wealth is bad. On the contrary, personal success allows people to be more charitable and many successful people are VERY generous with their money, even after the government extorts them for a larger proportion of it, simply because they have made money.

I would do things the other way. Make it reverse progressive. Pay LESS taxes the more successful you are, and see how the economy suddenly starts to improve. You also have to do away with all the welfare programs, and let people get off their fat behinds and get back to WORK though.

The ant and the grasshopper story must be brought back into our country's ethical structure before any of that happens.

And this communistic attitude that every successful person is simply GREEDY must be
eradicated!!!

You go girl!

[wondrousgnat]

Inheritance taxes are double taxation. I hav eheard that before. My parents worked hard for their money. But it was theirs. When they died I inherited their money tax free, It just came to me and I did nothing to deserve it. I paid no taxes on it. But then if my employer pays taxes on his income why should I pay taxes on my pay? Isn't that double taxation? And this time on money that I do earn.

I do have money in stocks, IRAs, municpal bonds, etc. I do know what capital gains are. And when I get home from a hard 10 hour day of work I open my mail and see what I have earned from mail that is managed by my broker.

I have no problem with people getting wealthy from the money that they earn.

I first voted in 1968. In that time I have voted for a grand total of one Democrat (prolifer Phil Rock whose opponent George Ryan is still in prison). And I have been to a Tea Party rally. Also picketed abortion clinics on a number of ocassions. I really don't think I am with the 999.

[aicirt]

Originally Posted by TheRealJuliane

What are these "conservatives" of which you speak??



We still have a long, long way to go.

And we may not have time to get there.

I for one and my husband for two. I believe there are stats which prove that Republicans give more to charity then Democrats. Also conservatives are church going and it is a mandate of most religions to take care of the poor.

It has been our experience that our liberal friends are rather tight with the purse strings. I hear their talk. A number of them are not affiliated with any religion so forget giving to any church or charity to which that church might support.

The amount of burauracy involved with any government agency is a turn off. I'm not a fan of hugh charities either because the majority of the dollar goes to salaries. I think the head of the Girl Scouts gets a salary of $500,000. (but I still buy its cookies )

My friends seem to think it is the government's responsibility so tax away! They also have the attitude that it is those who are richer than they so they shouldn't have to give seeing themselves as "poor" which they are not. Poor in comparison to Bill Gates....yes but when you own a couple of houses, take expensive vacations etc. you are not poor.

[aicirt]

Originally Posted by TheRealJuliane

Why? Why should people who have made a lot of money, have to pay even more of that money just because they have been successful?

I really hate it that the attitude that something is evil about success has crept so thoroughly into this country's psyche that no one even questions it. Success including wealth, is to be PUNISHED instead of encouraged and rewarded. I thought the idea of making one's own wealth out of nothing was what this nation was FOUNDED UPON! Private property rights is woven all through our Constitution, yet the progressive income tax is the exact opposite. I wonder if that's the Puritan influence - that wealth is bad. On the contrary, personal success allows people to be more charitable and many successful people are VERY generous with their money, even after the government extorts them for a larger proportion of it, simply because they have made money.

I would do things the other way. Make it reverse progressive. Pay LESS taxes the more successful you are, and see how the economy suddenly starts to improve. You also have to do away with all the welfare programs, and let people get off their fat behinds and get back to WORK though.

The ant and the grasshopper story must be brought back into our country's ethical structure before any of that happens.

And this communistic attitude that every successful person is simply GREEDY must be eradicated!!!

Completely with YOU!! Maybe I misunderstood your point when I answered the other post.

[TarkanAttila]

Originally Posted by TheRealJuliane

Why? Why should people who have made a lot of money, have to pay even more of that money just because they have been successful?

There's such a thing as being successful. And then there's such a thing as having too much. It's like the difference between being overweight and being morbidly obese. Yes, they've got a right to all the dough they've packed away. And there's nothing wrong with having some extra for status, in case hard times come along, or even to invest in something new. But at some point too much is too much, and money becomes useless to the owner.

Take for instance Bill Gates. Would Bill Gates have any use for $50 billion? For the past 3 years he's been letting it grow to $60 billion. What possible use does a man have for $60 billion? What possible use does a man have with 600 pounds of fat on his limbs? 50 or 100 pounds extra I might understand. But 600? That's enough to put you into bed permanently.

Yes, the government needs the money. Yes, we want the money. Yes, they earned the money and deserve the rights to it. But at some point it tips the scale and becomes a sort of morbid obesity. So where do we make the cut? $1 billion? $10 billion? Difficult to say, as unlike obesity there are no obviously negative symptoms of having too much money (money being as portable as a single plastic card, nowadays).

Perhaps... when they have enough money to form an influential lobbying group. If they are able to influence politics by themselves, using money primarily or alone, perhaps it is time they start paying. In taxes.

But I'm just throwing it out there on a whim.

[Maryann C]

Originally Posted by TarkanAttila

There's such a thing as being successful. And then there's such a thing as having too much. I.

And WHO is going to be the arbitrary judge of what is too much money???? Big Brother?
It is not like when you over eat and are unhealthy - nature takes care of it because your heart and your body were not made to carry that weight or like when you drink "too much" your liver packs in.

As for the poster who said if you don't pay taxes you should not be able to vote. Because representation without taxation is dangerous ?? I would agree but it is just as dangerous as what we have now which seems to be representation based on big money lobbying.

No I think the real answer is term limits for all and politicians are not allowed to vote on their own pay raises, pension plans and health care.....that should be given to elected volunteer taxpayer citizen boards - the politician's employers!