Some questions about Bible translations.

[Zimm3r]

Ok first I want to apologize for any disorganization and also if this comes off as rather negative or condescending etc, but I figured I'd ask these questions.

1. I have been using an iPod app called, straight forwardly enough, the Bible app which offers several translations of the Bible, currently I have been using the NIV, as it is easy to read, nicely organized, and I was given a paper copy over Kairos (so I figured it was a decent enough translation if they chose that one, I do understand the advertising a lot and most used etc angle with is being highly marketed). But then stumbled over this supposed controversy that the NIV is biased and trying to get everyone to be protestant etc so what gives, is the NIV a good translation?

2. What translations do you recommend, I've seen recommendations for the Jerusalem bible, RSV, and NAB but sadly they aren't available in the bible app (in no fault because of the app but because of the strict and draconian copyright put down by the authors)? I was going to list the translations available sadly the youversion.com site it down for now, I'll try to post it later.

3. With the NAB (which a deeply deeply catholic friend of mine recommended), I find it odd that the USCCB has a verse listening (with no heading or paragraphs) is that to stay more faithful to the original authors?

4. Why is the NAB's copyright so strictly held it seems even publishers want to avoid it because the USCCB is so intent on keeping an iron fist on it?

[po18guy]

If it exists, I would search for an app of the Revised Standard Version-Second Catholic Edition. It is also known as the Ignatius bible. It is simply excellent and, IMO, the USCCB should adopt it in place of the NAB. The NAB is a politically correct, semi-squishy 1970s translation. In Catholic bibles, either older or newer than the NAB might be better in the absolute sense, as the Church is moving decisively back toward tradition.

[Jaypeeto4]

On the one hand, "copyrighting" Bibles certainly SEEMS distasteful at first, but really the idea is a good one. You don't want people (which lack of a copyright could permit easily to happen) quoting enormous portions of your bible, adding misquotes to the quotes, and calling it "NAB" or NIV or whatever. That's why nearly all modern translations allow only a limited amount of their bibles to be quoted in any one quotation, and in the front of your book, you must note something like,
"unless otherwise noted, quotations are from the NRSV Bible-Catholic Edition,
published by the National Council of the Churches of Christ etc etc etc"

This prevents a lot of mischief from unscrupulous MISquoters, and they ARE out there.

There is no truly BAAAAAD Bible translation, unless we count that horrific
"Cotton Patch Version" of the Bible, sold for years in Christian bookstores. I'm VERY FAR from being pure or saintly, but I bought some of those volumes, got them home, and was HORRIFIED. These weren't just "country-fied" translations, but for example, statements like "Behold I am laying up in Zion a choice cornerstone..." were rendered as,
something like, I'm not kidding,
Look, y'all, I am layin up in AMERICA a choice cornerstone.
That goes way too far. God wasn't laying up any cornerstone at all in AMERICA, and to render it thus is not a "country-fied" translation, no, it rather borders on blasphemous.

The NIV of course has an evangelical protestant flavor to it, that's unavoidable given their doctrinal and philological worldview. But it's still a pretty darn good translation (minus our catholic Deuterocanonicals). No modern translation is perfect. Nearly all of them render Hail, Full of Grace WRONGLY as "Greetings, favored one!" or "Greetings, highly favored daughter!" to avoid the connotation that already, at the annunciation itself, Gabriel declares that Mary is already filled to overflowing with God's Divine Grace. Even Catholic translations like the NAB seem to render it this way to avoid hampering ecumenical dialogue. The rendering is flat-out wrong. But we know that, and overall, the NAB, the text itself, is really quite good (( I do have a problem, theologically, with some of it's original footnotes and study notes. People have actually abandoned the Catholic Faith after reading those footnotes, and gave that, as the reason, to their horrified families-- those footnotes and study notes undermined and destroyed their trust in the Catholic Faith, and that's a VERY SERIOUS matter indeed, and those responsible have much to answer for). But the TEXT of the NAB is quite nice. Another, with a rather nice text, though not without some flaws, is the New Revised Standard Version, which goes too far in the inclusive language direction ((though not nearly as far as a couple of newer versions which came AFTER it)). The NRSV is very elegant and an easy read. I have HEARD that the New American Bible REVISED VERSION (just came out recently) is a vast improvement, but have yet to check it out for myself.
As for noncatholic modern bibles, my favorite, I confess, is put out by THE LOCKMAN FOUNDATION and is called the New American Standard Bible, the NASB. I had a HARPER STUDY BIBLE (not to be confused with the "Harper-collins Study Bible" which is entirely different) version of the NASB bible from the 1980s, still have it, and it was an IMMENSE help to me in reading the word of God and in drawing me toward a Catholic understanding of many scripture passages. The NASB is an evangelical bible, but it is a fantastic translation, it really is.
The original RSV-Catholic Edition, available from Ignatius Press, is also a very nice
Catholic bible version, which I heartily encourage people to get a copy of.
PLEASE:
Stay away from things like THE JIMMY SWAGGART BIBLE. It's name says it all.
It is a Bible, the popular King James Version, but it is filled from front to back with "Brother Swaggart's" own unique personal interpretations of the scriptures. You will come away from study of such a bible with your head filled with Brother Swaggart's personal theological conclusions, and sorry, but Christianity has been around for thousands of years longer than Brother Swaggart, no matter how good and sincere his intentions may be.
Peace,
Jaypeeto4
+JMJ+

[Zimm3r]

Originally Posted by Jaypeeto4

Stay away from things like THE JIMMY SWAGGART BIBLE. It's name says it all.
It is a Bible, the popular King James Version, but it is filled from front to back with "Brother Swaggart's" own unique personal interpretations of the scriptures. You will come away from study of such a bible with your head filled with Brother Swaggart's personal theological conclusions, and sorry, but Christianity has been around for thousands of years longer than Brother Swaggart, no matter how good and sincere his intentions may be.
Peace,
Jaypeeto4
+JMJ+

Haha I have never heard of that translation sounds rather humoress, also have you ever heard of the lol cats bible (it is meant to be in humor not a serious attempt at anything else).

Also I do know that the NASB is one of the translations that the Bible app I am using does have so that is good news (pun not intended, ok a little).

I have not ran into the issue of full of grace (I believe that is in Mathew if my memory does not fail me (though often it does :P) and I am currently reading Luke (as the first book I ever read was Acts for other reasons dealing with Charismatic stuff). I tried to read John but that is more difficult as it isn't synoptic and is more theological whereas Luke is historical.

Also I am glad to hear that not everyone is as comfy cosy with the USCCB but the misquoting problem seems a rather sad (though not unimportant reason) to so restrict the bible , especially if someone just wanted to use it in full.

Thank you for your replies, God bless

[TS Aquinas]

Originally Posted by Zimm3r

Ok first I want to apologize for any disorganization and also if this comes off as rather negative or condescending etc, but I figured I'd ask these questions.

1. I have been using an iPod app called, straight forwardly enough, the Bible app which offers several translations of the Bible, currently I have been using the NIV, as it is easy to read, nicely organized, and I was given a paper copy over Kairos (so I figured it was a decent enough translation if they chose that one, I do understand the advertising a lot and most used etc angle with is being highly marketed). But then stumbled over this supposed controversy that the NIV is biased and trying to get everyone to be protestant etc so what gives, is the NIV a good translation?

For starters it mistranslated important Marian verses such Gen 3:15 and Luke 1:28. That alone is enough to seek another translation, in my opinion. There are others but I'm not the type that lists 101 reasons.

2. What translations do you recommend, I've seen recommendations for the Jerusalem bible, RSV, and NAB but sadly they aren't available in the bible app (in no fault because of the app but because of the strict and draconian copyright put down by the authors)? I was going to list the translations available sadly the youversion.com site it down for now, I'll try to post it later.

The Douay for sound theological exegesis. But if the old English is to much to take in, I recommend the Catholic Public Domain Version written by a CAF member who used the Vulgate as the foundation and the Douay as a guide. Yes, I am bias towards translations that use the Vulgate as the foundation for translation


As for the NAB... some of us rather not acknowledge it's existence and leave it at that. Lots to say about it, must refrain being a public forum.

[COPLAND 3]

Originally Posted by TS Aquinas

For starters it mistranslated important Marian verses such Gen 3:15 and Luke 1:28. That alone is enough to seek another translation, in my opinion. There are others but I'm not the type that lists 101 reasons.



The Douay for sound theological exegesis. But if the old English is to much to take in, I recommend the Catholic Public Domain Version written by a CAF member who used the Vulgate as the foundation and the Douay as a guide. Yes, I am bias towards translations that use the Vulgate as the foundation for translation


As for the NAB... some of us rather not acknowledge it's existence and leave it at that. Lots to say about it, must refrain being a public forum.

I second that!

[T More]

Go with the Douay Rheims. Centuries of saints, popes and doctors of the Church can't be wrong.

[Isaiah45_9]

Originally Posted by Zimm3r

Ok first I want to apologize for any disorganization and also if this comes off as rather negative or condescending etc, but I figured I'd ask these questions.

1. I have been using an iPod app called, straight forwardly enough, the Bible app which offers several translations of the Bible, currently I have been using the NIV, as it is easy to read, nicely organized, and I was given a paper copy over Kairos (so I figured it was a decent enough translation if they chose that one, I do understand the advertising a lot and most used etc angle with is being highly marketed). But then stumbled over this supposed controversy that the NIV is biased and trying to get everyone to be protestant etc so what gives, is the NIV a good translation?

2. What translations do you recommend, I've seen recommendations for the Jerusalem bible, RSV, and NAB but sadly they aren't available in the bible app (in no fault because of the app but because of the strict and draconian copyright put down by the authors)? I was going to list the translations available sadly the youversion.com site it down for now, I'll try to post it later.

3. With the NAB (which a deeply deeply catholic friend of mine recommended), I find it odd that the USCCB has a verse listening (with no heading or paragraphs) is that to stay more faithful to the original authors?

4. Why is the NAB's copyright so strictly held it seems even publishers want to avoid it because the USCCB is so intent on keeping an iron fist on it?

There is an app called:

VerseWise and it has the RSV-CE - http://itunes.apple.com/us/app/verse...323637638?mt=8
Not free thou

You can also download Olive Tree for free and they have the DRB for free.

There is also a free Catholic App called Laudate and it has the NAB and the DRB plus Daily Readings and a lot of other things. Really cool but you need to have WiFi access.

Good Luck,

Jose

[TypesAndShadows]

A version that such apps and websites often have, and which I'd consider a good alternative to the NIV, is the Good News Translation. It's an ecumenical translation, available with imprimatur, available with Deuterocanonicals or 'Apocrypha' which includes a larger subset of Deuterocanonicals than most Catholic Bibles. It's written to be understood by people for whom English is a second language, so it's very easy reading.

While something like the Jerusalem Bible or a RSV-CE might be better in a perfect world, the GNT (sometimes called "Today's English Version") is widely and cheaply available, and very easy to understand. I would pick it over the NIV, as I don't think the NIV is going to get an imprimatur any time soon. It's probably on your app.

[Cyklist]

I second this, except that about recommending the RSV. There's a serious discussion in: http://www.christianforums.com/t7653202/

Originally Posted by TypesAndShadows

the Good News Translation. It's an ecumenical translation, available with imprimatur, available with Deuterocanonicals or 'Apocrypha' which includes a larger subset of Deuterocanonicals than most Catholic Bibles. It's written to be understood by people for whom English is a second language, so it's very easy reading.

While something like the Jerusalem Bible or a RSV-CE might be better in a perfect world, the GNT (sometimes called "Today's English Version") is widely and cheaply available, and very easy to understand. I would pick it over the NIV.

[po18guy]

Originally Posted by Cyklist

I second this, except that about recommending the RSV. There's a serious discussion in: http://www.christianforums.com/t7653202/

The last straw in crushing any hope I had for the GNT was its verbiage in John 2:4. Let's compare:

John 2:4
Douay-Rheims 1899 American Edition (DRA)
And Jesus saith to her: Woman, what is that to me and to thee? my hour is not yet come.

John 2:4
Good News Translation (GNT)

You must not tell me what to do, Jesus replied.
My time has not yet come.

Somehow, somewhere, the translation has gone from Jesus asking an almost rhetorical question into Him rebuking His mother. This is but one example. The GNT is, in my mind, obviously and clearly biased against Catholic teaching. It carries the taint of agenda.

[TS Aquinas]

Originally Posted by po18guy

The last straw in crushing any hope I had for the GNT was its verbiage in John 2:4. Let's compare:

John 2:4
Douay-Rheims 1899 American Edition (DRA)
And Jesus saith to her: Woman, what is that to me and to thee? my hour is not yet come.

John 2:4
Good News Translation (GNT)

You must not tell me what to do, Jesus replied.
My time has not yet come.

Somehow, somewhere, the translation has gone from Jesus asking an almost rhetorical question into Him rebuking His mother. This is but one example. The GNT is, in my mind, obviously and clearly biased against Catholic teaching. It carries the taint of agenda.

What do you expect of translations that break from Latin scriptural tradition?

[po18guy]

Originally Posted by TS Aquinas

What do you expect of translations that break from Latin scriptural tradition?

You used the "L" word!!! That is horrifying and repulsive to cafeteria Christians. In this age, we are drowning in so much modernism, I'm surprised that there is not a Cheech and Chong translation.

lex transferre, lex credendi

[TS Aquinas]

Originally Posted by po18guy

You used the "L" word!!! That is horrifying and repulsive to cafeteria Christians. In this age, we are drowning in so much modernism, I'm surprised that there is not a Cheech and Chong translation.

There is, it's called the New World Translation.

lex transferre, lex credendi

[po18guy]

Originally Posted by TS Aquinas

There is, it's called the New World Translation.

Oh! My spellcheck isn't working. I had it as New Weird Translation. I stand corrected.