Pope John Paul ii saint hood

JillianRose · #1 Jul 4, '12, 9:34 am

hi!!

I was wondering why isn't Pope John Paul ii a St? Wouldn't being a pope engough to become a st? What do you have to do to become a st.?

YoungTradCath · #2 Jul 4, '12, 9:51 am

He is on the road to sainthood. No, being a pope does not automatically make one good enough to be a saint. In fact, I do believe a majority of popes are not canonized saints.

There are several things that are required to be canonized: heroic virtue, miracles, a decree of the reigning Pope. Martyrdom will also set the gears in motion.

John Paul is currently a "blessed," which is one step behind being a canonized saint.

OurBeloved · #3 Jul 4, '12, 9:56 am

Quote:

Originally Posted by JillianRose

hi!!

I was wondering why isn't Pope John Paul ii a St? Wouldn't being a pope engough to become a st? What do you have to do to become a st.?

There have been Pope's who the church would consider as having lead very unholy or scandalous lives. Pope Alexander VI I would say is a good example.

It must be noted though that none of the Pope's ever taught error ( or else we would not be assenting to the teaching of Infallibility anyway ).

OraLabora · #4 Jul 4, '12, 10:00 am

Quote:

Originally Posted by JillianRose

hi!!

I was wondering why isn't Pope John Paul ii a St? Wouldn't being a pope engough to become a st? What do you have to do to become a st.?

It's because the process takes time. For John Paul II the process is well underway. The Church doesn't name her saints lightly. You can be sure that when she does name a saint, the saint's story has been very exhaustively researched.

I read an article in the local paper recently about a medical doctor (an atheist) called by the Church to verify the medical miracles of St. André Bessette who was canonized recently. She was extremely impressed about how thorough the Church was and how she had to leave no stone unturned in trying to find a medical explanation to disprove the miracle.

Rich C · #5 Jul 4, '12, 11:02 am

Quote:

Originally Posted by JillianRose

hi!!

I was wondering why isn't Pope John Paul ii a St? Wouldn't being a pope engough to become a st? What do you have to do to become a st.?

A certain number of approved miracles attributed to a deceased Catholic's intercession are required and investigated before the Church declares someone to be a saint. Pope John Paul II is currently a "blessed" because some of the requirements have been met, but not all yet.

Also, I think a pretty small proportion of popes have been canonized, though between the Roman Canon and the trend of canonizing every other pope in the last 100 years it seems like most of them have been. In between the 1st and 19th centuries through, I think it's just a few really excellent ones.

Andre1000 · #6 Jul 4, '12, 1:03 pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by JillianRose

hi!!

I was wondering why isn't Pope John Paul ii a St? Wouldn't being a pope engough to become a st? What do you have to do to become a st.?

Pope Honorius I was honored with an anathema by the Third Council of Constantinople

So no.

NeedsMercy · #7 Jul 5, '12, 9:03 pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by JillianRose

hi!!

I was wondering why isn't Pope John Paul ii a St? Wouldn't being a pope engough to become a st? What do you have to do to become a st.?

A few years ago, I read a book about how the Church determines who becomes a saint. It does a very good job describing the whole process. It certainly is convoluted, which explains why it takes so long for canonization. Here's the book:

"Making Saints" by Kenneth L. Woodward

(t was published in 1990, so it shouldn't be too hard to find.)

Hesychios · #8 Jul 5, '12, 9:15 pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by JillianRose

... What do you have to do to become a st.?

First you have to be good, then ...

Anyway one isn't made a saint by an act of the church, one is a saint before it is known, because God decides, and some saints (probably most) are not discovered at all. They will not be known by us in this life, they will be seen in heaven.

Being Pope does not get one a free pass, many Popes have been unworthy, some extremely scandalous.

moon1234 · #9 Jul 6, '12, 12:39 pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by OraLabora

The Church doesn't name her saints lightly.

Some may argue that point. Under Pope JPII there were more saints than in the past 300 years. Some even remarked that this diminished the recognition of major saints in the Church.

I am not against recognizing saints at all. I just think that JPII was TOO active in this aspect of the Church. I also feel the RUSH to point to him as a saint is improper.

Many people refer to him as JP The Great. I don't think history will see him that way. His personality made him very popular, but other aspects of his papacy were not so great for the Church.

The rush to canonize all Holy People who die, especially popular with the people, runs a very real risk of advancing a cause for sainthood when there really should time for the current popularity to pass. It allows for a more objective investigation process when miracles occer rather than the very real possibility of political undertones coursing through the process.

BraveCatholic · #10 Jul 6, '12, 11:58 pm

Besides a some requirements around how one lived their life to be a "Blessed" you need one confirmed miracle which has occurred for JP II which is why he is now called Blessed.

To be canonized a Saint you need a second confirmed miracle. From my understanding there are a few under consideration for JP II currently.

My guess is that it won't be long. I was lucky enough to have my marriage blessed by JP II at his second to last Wednesday audience. I look forward to his Official Sainthood. Lord knows that blessing has come in handy.

Chatter163 · #11 Jul 7, '12, 6:55 am

I agree that the Church must be wary of the emotion that the media usually seeks to engender about so many things. However, in the pre-medieval Church, before there was an established process for canonization, saints were frequently named due to public acclamation and reports of miracles at their intercession. Blessed John Paul II is a modern example of this, but he will still go through the process, so to speak, even if it is acclerated a bit.

While I can appreciate that some, myself included, see some negative aspects of his papacy, we are not discussing secular politics here. One does not critique a papacy as one does a presidential term, and decide sainthood based on that. The Church examines the life of an individual and determines sanctity. That is what's all about--sanctity.

BJP2 gave us an extraordinary model of sanctity--In particular, his patient bearing of physical suffering during his last decade on earth. He is a model for all elderly and infirmed people who must bear the physical ravages of their afflictions. In this regard, he mirrors the sufferings of Our Lord Himself. In the midst of all this, he made the world aware of the Divine Mercy devotion. Many see this is his greatest gift to the Church and a visible aspect of his own sanctity. The Divine Mercy was not very well-known outside of Poland, but he saw to it that the entire Church became aware of St. Faustina and Our Lord's message to her. His emphasis on prayer wherever he went was another hallmark of his sanctity. His constant calls for peace and justice in the world demonstrated his concern for all people. His gentle but firm role in the ending of communism in the West is another aspect.

This is why people cried out, "Sancto subito!"

Oneofthewomen · #12 Jul 7, '12, 7:38 am

Some interesting information from from Br. JR on the process.

Credo in Deum · #13 Jul 7, '12, 6:19 pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by JillianRose

hi!!

I was wondering why isn't Pope John Paul ii a St?

God hasn't willed it yet.

Quote:

Originally Posted by JillianRose

Wouldn't being a pope engough to become a st?

Nope.

Quote:

Originally Posted by JillianRose

What do you have to do to become a st.?

God's will.

curlycool89 · #14 Jul 7, '12, 6:32 pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by moon1234

Some may argue that point. Under Pope JPII there were more saints than in the past 300 years. Some even remarked that this diminished the recognition of major saints in the Church.

We're not adding saints per se, just adding them to the canon.

There's nothing that makes so-called "major saints" any better then newer saints either. Older saints have greater followings just because of the time they've had. It's nice to see new saints too and to acknowledge God's working in our modern day.

I only first heard of St. André Bessette a few years ago (for example), who lived just over 70 years ago, and he's one of my favourite saint now. His life's story is very inspirational, and his faith and trust in God was amazing.

As for John Paul the Great, it's already caught on with my generation, so it will probably stick.

NeedsMercy · #15 Jul 7, '12, 9:15 pm

Just as an aside, the following is from St. Faustina's Diary:

As I was praying for Poland, I heard the words: I bear a special love for Poland, and if she will be obedient to My will, I will exalt her in might and holiness. From her will come forth the spark that will prepare the world for My final coming. (Diary, 1732)

There are those who believe that the Lord is referring to BJPII in this passage insomuch as he was instrumental in the spread of the Divine Mercy devotion. If that's true, I think he's got it made...